12 round mag on unconverted gun...legal?

[BolivianAK 2]

Would it be violating 922 compliance to put an American made 12 round magazine on an unconverted Saiga 12?

 

I ordered one with my new gun, but not sure if I can use it yet...

[ChileRelleno 7,071]

Illegal, until converted in compliance with 922r.

Edited March 11, 2010 by ChileRelleno

[Mullet Man 2,114]

Illegal, until converted in compliance with 922r.

 

 

Only if his S12 has a threaded barrel. Its 14 parts for threaded barrel S12's and 13 parts for non threaded barrel S12's.

 

So technically he could be legal, depending. I dont think many will recommend using a mag as the only or main point of compliance though.

[nalioth 405]

Illegal, until converted in compliance with 922r.

 

 

Only if his S12 has a threaded barrel. Its 14 parts for threaded barrel S12's and 13 parts for non threaded barrel S12's.

 

So technically he could be legal, depending. I dont think many will recommend using a mag as the only or main point of compliance though.

If he's got an older unthreaded shotty, whyever not? Seems the best of both worlds to me (if you don't want to convert, that is) - legal with US made "non sporting magazines" and with factory 5 rounders, too - all w/o doing diddly to the shotty.

[saiga875 10]

Would it be violating 922 compliance to put an American made 12 round magazine on an unconverted Saiga 12?

 

I ordered one with my new gun, but not sure if I can use it yet...

 

Some folks consider the thread protector on the end of the barrel to be a "muzzle attachment" which is a 922r part. I don't know if ATF has weighed in on that ruling but to be safe it's generally considered a countable part. Technically if you remove the thread protector you remove the muzzle attachment and then it would be OK with a US magazine. But if you put the thread protector back on you need to put the original magazine back in (or at least remove the US magazine). Easiest thing to do, if you don't want to convert, is to replace the thread protector with a compensator/brake and then use US mags exclusively. You could also replace the gas piston (puck) and leave the thread protector on. Still would need to use US magazines which come in all sizes. I don't see myself ever using a small magazine even though I've converted mine and could use foreign mags.

[Mullet Man 2,114]

If he's got an older unthreaded shotty, whyever not? Seems the best of both worlds to me (if you don't want to convert, that is) - legal with US made "non sporting magazines" and with factory 5 rounders, too - all w/o doing diddly to the shotty.

 

 

I agree but i would think that it could possibly be conveyed as "intent". I understand that its the same by just removing the OE mag too but heh, it is what it is.

 

Of course thats all if the issue got pushed. Innocent until proven guilty, is a fallacy.

Edited March 11, 2010 by Mullet Man

[BolivianAK 2]

Illegal, until converted in compliance with 922r.

 

This is what I am thinking as well, but I keep getting conflicting answers.

 

Is there like an ATF phone number I can call and ask?

[ChileRelleno 7,071]

Mullet & Nalioth, are correct, threaded = illegal, not threaded = legal.

 

I keep forgetting that some are not threaded.

[Lone Star Arms 2,047]

I have a friend I did a performance tuned factory shotty for. I replaced enough Russian parts (US hammer,US gas piston, US Barrel nut) to make it 922r compliant with US made mags.

 

If he wants to put a 2 round mag in it and go Dove hunting, he's good to go. Same goes for his favorite US made 20 round drum. He's got a Lone Star custom vented factory handguard with an integrated 2" picatinny rail, and the original Monte Carlo stock - both hand sanded and refinished with six coats of hand rubbed black enamel lacquer. I swear it looks, and wears like ironwood or ebony without the weight!

 

He didn't want a pistol grip on it, because he didn't want to have to explain that his 12 gauge is not an "assault weapon" to the game warden. He now has the best of both worlds and absolutely loves it. You CAN have your cake and eat it too!

[Eric Pate 478]

Aah, the silly games we have to play...

[nalioth 405]

I have a friend I did a performance tuned factory shotty for. I replaced enough Russian parts (US hammer,US gas piston, US Barrel nut) to make it 922r compliant with US made mags.

 

If he wants to put a 2 round mag in it and go Dove hunting, he's good to go. Same goes for his favorite US made 20 round drum. He's got a Lone Star custom vented factory handguard with an integrated 2" picatinny rail, and the original Monte Carlo stock - both hand sanded and refinished with six coats of hand rubbed black enamel lacquer. I swear it looks, and wears like ironwood or ebony without the weight!

 

He didn't want a pistol grip on it, because he didn't want to have to explain that his 12 gauge is not an "assault weapon" to the game warden. He now has the best of both worlds and absolutely loves it. You CAN have your cake and eat it too!

. . but WaffenSchmied, if the OP has a Saiga shotty in factory trim and doesn't have a threaded muzzle*, the US mag provides it's own compliance. If the OP wants to use their factory 5 rounders, well, then they're legal at that time, too. There is no need at all to "add enough US parts to use US mags", as the US mags provide enough parts on their own, and no US parts are needed when using the factory mags.

 

Years ago, nobody had the option of "US mags as compliance parts" with their shotties, but now they do.

 

 

* If you do have a threaded muzzle or Russian "non sporting magazine", you're gonna need to get dirty.

Edited March 11, 2010 by nalioth

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