8rd mag +1

[jnewt 0]

Just something kinda interesting to throw out there. Prob talked about befor but...lol...

 

After seeing posts about how difficult it is to insert a full 8rd mag on a closed bolt, I broke out a few mags and had a look. Long story short, cut approx .5" off the follower legs, reassembled, loaded mag with 8rds, inserted and she was MUCH easier to insert on a closed bolt. Another + is the mag will now hold 9rds but insertion is difficult like a unmodified mag.

 

Ran about 50 shells through it this eve, ran like a top.

[Stuart2 0]

Hi there

 

My advice is to leave the mag standard.

 

There is really no advantages on modifying the mags.

 

8 rounds in the mag & one in the chamber is ok.

 

What ever you do, do not cut the spring.

 

Stu

[Diggler 0]

But there is no disadvantage to trimming the follower, especially if you use the standard accepted capacity rather than try to cram an extra one in there. The more room you have to push down the top shell, the easier it is to insert the mag.

[pedal2alloy 206]

I think that trimming the follower will reduce reliability. If you look at an 8 round follower vs a 5 or 2 round follower, you will see that it is taller, because the longer the spring is and the more rounds you pile on top, the more rickety the whole assembly becomes. So because of failures in testing, they lengthend the follower to keep it lined up and from not binding.

 

Also since an 8 round mag is curved, the follower can more easily get out of whack at the concave end so this is where it needs the extra length.

[TPABA 0]

I don't find it hard loading an 8-rounder on a closed bolt... the shell seems to become a bit more oval shaped if left unloaded. Could the irregular shape of the shell cause it to jam or worse? Will saiga feed anything?... even irregular shaped shells/slugs?

[Stuart2 0]

Hi TPABA & others

 

I'm just thinking about the change in shape 12ga.

 

If there is a small change in shape with bolt closed, then you may have a problem.

It all depends on how long you leave the magazine within the shotgun.

 

I think if you use a solid 12ga bullet, example: a 500gr lead bullet. First bullet that is under the bolt. May solve this problem.

 

It's more for people that leave there shotguns loaded for a long period of time. 3-5 days.

 

Stu

[Diggler 0]

IF I were storing my S12 with a magazine inserted, I'd notch the safety lever and keep a full mag in it with the bolt open. You'd have to drop the safety before use anyways, that would chamber a round and you wouldn't have to worry about deformity.

[Stuart2 0]

Hi Diggler

 

Are you saying that you would leave the bolt open & leave the shotgun for days at a time?.

 

The hammer spring would be compressed, the recoil spring would be compressed. Not a great idea for the shotgun.

 

Stu

[GTwannabe 1]

Compressing the springs won't hurt them. For a go-to gun, bolt locked back with a full mag inserted would be ideal. Just drop the safety and let the bolt go.

 

I don't like leaving guns cocked because you have to always assume that the gun is loaded.

[Bvamp 604]

compressing springs wont hurt them, you are right......to an extent. compressing them to the amount that would normally occur during use it was designed for is ok. overcompressing the spring like 8 rounds against the bottom of a closed bolt, or 9 rounds stored with the bolt open is putting too much pressure on the metal and will fatigue the spring over time. further if the spring material isnt made from the correct alloy (most are, not all, mind you) and do not have the correct tensile strength, leaving that spring compressed for long periods of time WILL DEFINATELY fatigue it as well.

 

also, i noticed a comment by mr nixon of the atf on saiga 12c's. he said something like they are availible with 4 7 and 10 round mags. meaning they know ya'll are making ten rounders, and that they call the 5 and 8 roudners 4 and 7 rounders. why? well, because you cant insert the friggin things with a full load into a closed bolt. therefore, it CANNOT hold that many rounds. go figure. just a minor thing i noticed, blah blah, nevermind me.

[acetomatoco 0]

compressing springs wont hurt them, you are right......to an extent. compressing them to the amount that would normally occur during use it was designed for is ok. overcompressing the spring like 8 rounds against the bottom of a closed bolt, or 9 rounds stored with the bolt open is putting too much pressure on the metal and will fatigue the spring over time. further if the spring material isnt made from the correct alloy (most are, not all, mind you) and do not have the correct tensile strength, leaving that spring compressed for long periods of time WILL DEFINATELY fatigue it as well.

 

also, i noticed a comment by mr nixon of the atf on saiga 12c's. he said something like they are availible with 4 7 and 10 round mags. meaning they know ya'll are making ten rounders, and that they call the 5 and 8 roudners 4 and 7 rounders. why? well, because you cant insert the friggin things with a full load into a closed bolt. therefore, it CANNOT hold that many rounds. go figure. just a minor thing i noticed, blah blah, nevermind me.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Bvamp, I can insert 5 on a closed bolt, is there something I am not aware of?

http://club.guns.ru/eng/saiga12.htm

This link talks about mags, 5 being standard, 7 being special and 10 being experimental(made of welded sheetmetal).

http://club.guns.ru/eng/symposium.html down in Saiga 12 specifications its lists 5 and 7 rd mags.

In the UK the 8 rd mag is standard and the 5 rd is an option,Decade firearms.com

While looking for my S12 I believe I did see a country that sells it with a 4 rd.

Barrel lengths also varied country to country depending on their laws.

Havn,t seen a 3,6 or 9 rd mag yet. LOL

Edited May 4, 2005 by acetomatoco

[jnewt 0]

But there is no disadvantage to trimming the follower, especially if you use the standard accepted capacity rather than try to cram an extra one in there.  The more room you have to push down the top shell, the easier it is to insert the mag.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

With .5" trimmed off the follower legs the 8rd mag is just as easy to load on a closed bolt with 3" shells as the 5rd is with 2 3/4. I have run aprox 100 shells thru it now and not a single prob. I plan on running some more thru it this weekend, will give an update.

Edited May 5, 2005 by jnewt

[kmoore 3]

Hi TPABA & others

 

I'm just thinking about the change in shape 12ga.

 

If there is a small change in shape with bolt closed, then you may have a problem.

It all depends on how long you leave the magazine within the shotgun.

 

I think if you use a solid 12ga bullet, example: a 500gr lead bullet. First bullet that is under the bolt. May solve this problem.

 

It's more for people that leave there shotguns loaded for a long period of time. 3-5 days.

 

Stu

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Here's a recent thread talking about the problems of shell deformation.

shell deformation

 

I think there was talk not so long back about some of the metal hulled shells. Folks were thinking they might be an good alternative for HD loads that might set compressed for many months at a time.

[mickporno 0]

Hi TPABA & others

 

I'm just thinking about the change in shape 12ga.

 

If there is a small change in shape with bolt closed, then you may have a problem.

It all depends on how long you leave the magazine within the shotgun.

 

I think if you use a solid 12ga bullet, example: a 500gr lead bullet. First bullet that is under the bolt. May solve this problem.

 

It's more for people that leave there shotguns loaded for a long period of time. 3-5 days.

 

Stu

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Here's a recent thread talking about the problems of shell deformation.

shell deformation

 

I think there was talk not so long back about some of the metal hulled shells. Folks were thinking they might be an good alternative for HD loads that might set compressed for many months at a time.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

 

just load the mag , lock the bolt back, insert the mag....problem solved!!