MrOneEyedBoh 14 Posted January 23, 2011 Report Share Posted January 23, 2011 Hey fellas, Long time lurker, but since I just bought my IZ109 Im here to learn about modding it. What Im wondering is, what are the basic need to do mods to convert it? I dont know the specific terms etc but I was looking at this package here ( http://store.carolinashooterssupply.com/servlet/-strse-805/SAIGA-12-CONVERSION-KIT/Detail ) Is there another kit out there cheaper? I dont know many places to look, I mean I can google stuff but I dont want to send non-legit people my money. Ya know? The internet can get flaky at times... Anyway, anything else I should get before the panic starts? Like other recommended mods. I appreciate it fellas! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
mark4567 4 Posted January 23, 2011 Report Share Posted January 23, 2011 Hey welcome! I'm kind of new to the SAIGA myself. I have done 4 AK's before I got the saiga and they are much the same.. The kit your looking at is the EXACT same one I got!! It requires you to cut off the rear tang. Not a hard job but is a "permanent" mod, no going back once you hack it off! I went with the Billet trigger guard rather than the sheet metal one. But that's just a matter of choice. I also ordered a hinge for the ACE stock as well as the parts kit. to make it a folder. As far as what else to get, Depends on what you what your gun to look like. Carolina shooters supply is a great company to deal with and ships lightning fast!!! Its a one stop shop for SAIGAS!! My best advice is go to the picture thread at the top of the page.. go through 20 something pages of pics and see what you like.. then just order the parts.. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
The_Caged_Bird 474 Posted January 23, 2011 Report Share Posted January 23, 2011 Dude, any kit from Carolina Shooter's Supply will work flawlessly. You might have to do some slight bending to the right leg of your stock hammer spring but that's no big deal. Also, if you order your kit from them, you'll get it so fast you'll think that they got your order a week before. To put it in perspective, I ordered my kit on the first business day after Christmas, and I received it on the 29th of December. If they are that fast during the holidays, I can only imagine how fast they are during the rest of the year... Quote Link to post Share on other sites
mark4567 4 Posted January 23, 2011 Report Share Posted January 23, 2011 Yup ordered mine on a Wednesday at 5pm and I was putting it together on Saturday! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
MrOneEyedBoh 14 Posted January 23, 2011 Author Report Share Posted January 23, 2011 Alright cool guys., Im going to make the jump NOW on the conversion stuff. and my rail I might get in a week or so. This is what I have so far Stock folding mechanism ( to side fold it, is this one pretty good? As in terms of stability, relibilty etc ) Conversion kit with 8.5" and Tromix DIY Low brass reliabilty kit ( not needed? ) And the rail, Im bent between the Chaos pre order one or the Carolina Tactical quad rail Quote Link to post Share on other sites
The_Caged_Bird 474 Posted January 23, 2011 Report Share Posted January 23, 2011 Alright cool guys., Im going to make the jump NOW on the conversion stuff. and my rail I might get in a week or so. This is what I have so far Stock folding mechanism ( to side fold it, is this one pretty good? As in terms of stability, relibilty etc ) Conversion kit with 8.5" and Tromix DIY Low brass reliabilty kit ( not needed? ) And the rail, Im bent between the Chaos pre order one or the Carolina Tactical quad rail I'm not sure if the reliability kit would be needed. Be sure that you "break-in" the gun first with a couple hundred rounds of high brass ammo to see if your gun functions properly or not before converting it. If you have a warranty issue Cadiz will NOT fix it if you've already converted it. I'm all for converting, trust me, the difference in trigger pull is night and day but break the gun in first so that way you can determine any key problem areas that could be fixed before or during conversion... Quote Link to post Share on other sites
MrOneEyedBoh 14 Posted January 23, 2011 Author Report Share Posted January 23, 2011 Alright cool guys., Im going to make the jump NOW on the conversion stuff. and my rail I might get in a week or so. This is what I have so far Stock folding mechanism ( to side fold it, is this one pretty good? As in terms of stability, relibilty etc ) Conversion kit with 8.5" and Tromix DIY Low brass reliabilty kit ( not needed? ) And the rail, Im bent between the Chaos pre order one or the Carolina Tactical quad rail I'm not sure if the reliability kit would be needed. Be sure that you "break-in" the gun first with a couple hundred rounds of high brass ammo to see if your gun functions properly or not before converting it. If you have a warranty issue Cadiz will NOT fix it if you've already converted it. I'm all for converting, trust me, the difference in trigger pull is night and day but break the gun in first so that way you can determine any key problem areas that could be fixed before or during conversion... Oh ok cool. so whats a good cheap shell to run for the break-in? With the issues of the guns like in terms fo them going south for exportation.. what would we do for warranty issues? What are some of the problems I should be looking for? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
slostang 80 Posted January 23, 2011 Report Share Posted January 23, 2011 The FIRST thing i did to my s-12 was polish the bolt / carrier and got an MD Arms V-plug. So far ive only put about 100 rounds of federal low brass through it with zero FTF's or FTE's. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
MrOneEyedBoh 14 Posted January 23, 2011 Author Report Share Posted January 23, 2011 The FIRST thing i did to my s-12 was polish the bolt / carrier and got an MD Arms V-plug. So far ive only put about 100 rounds of federal low brass through it with zero FTF's or FTE's. Im guessing that V plug from MD arms is the same ( or similar ) to the one from Carolinas plug ( http://store.carolinashooterssupply.com/servlet/-strse-309/Saiga-E-dsh-tac-Gas-Piston/Detail?sfs=d64c9e49 ) Quote Link to post Share on other sites
mark4567 4 Posted January 23, 2011 Report Share Posted January 23, 2011 (edited) The FIRST thing i did to my s-12 was polish the bolt / carrier and got an MD Arms V-plug. So far ive only put about 100 rounds of federal low brass through it with zero FTF's or FTE's. Im guessing that V plug from MD arms is the same ( or similar ) to the one from Carolinas plug ( http://store.carolin...il?sfs=d64c9e49 ) Nope thats a twister gas piston. The plug goes in front of that and screws into the gas block. this is the V-Plug http://store.carolin...vlet/Categories Edited January 23, 2011 by PIZDA Quote Link to post Share on other sites
MrOneEyedBoh 14 Posted January 23, 2011 Author Report Share Posted January 23, 2011 Thanks for clearing that up. I guess that would be a good mod to do too? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
mark4567 4 Posted January 23, 2011 Report Share Posted January 23, 2011 Thanks for clearing that up. I guess that would be a good mod to do too? Im just running the stock piston and I use the V-Plug, And MY gun runs great with it. I do have a low power spring as well which lets me lower the gas setting by one for low brass 71/2 birdshot loads. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
MrOneEyedBoh 14 Posted January 23, 2011 Author Report Share Posted January 23, 2011 (edited) I may get the stuff while I can. I can always resell it later if I dont use it... With the Chaos extended rail, can I run ar15 style sights off of it? Or no? I plan on running an optic i believe. but Carolina has the Chaos rail only for ( the extended one ) 132. Now Chaos themselves has their rail WITH sights for 175. thats only 40 bucks more for their sights. And carolina has Chaos' sights for an additional 99 bucks. so thats a definite savings there. But Id like to get the parts from one place... Does the Tromix DIY trigger guard has the integrated safety piece? Edited January 23, 2011 by MrOneEyedBoh Quote Link to post Share on other sites
mark4567 4 Posted January 23, 2011 Report Share Posted January 23, 2011 Don't know about the TROMIX Like I said earlier I used CSS billet trigger guard. CHAOS sights are a HK style from what I have read, But with any rail you can use AR type sights the rear might be a bit far away on some rails. Just stick a Eotech or red dot on it and call it done...lol Quote Link to post Share on other sites
MrOneEyedBoh 14 Posted January 23, 2011 Author Report Share Posted January 23, 2011 haha yea man. Its not like Im going to be accurate with this thing. Well accurate enough to warrant iron sights. Though they are nice for a backup. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
The_Caged_Bird 474 Posted January 24, 2011 Report Share Posted January 24, 2011 (edited) I ran the 15 pack of buck from Wal-Mart and the 15 pack of slugs as well. About 150 rounds did it for me. There's nothing wrong with buying all of the parts now, BUT, after polishing the internals (which will smooth the action of the gun up tremendously) and breaking-in, you might not need some of those parts. I didn't and my gun was under-gassed. As far as accuracy goes, with my stock iron sights (and a bit of silver paint applied to the front bead sight) I've never missed anything with my Saiga-12, even during 20 round drum dumps... Whatever you want to put on your gun is your prerogative, but I chose to go with as light as possible because a 20 round drum weighs about as much as an unconverted S-12, doubling the guns weight with a mag is more than enough to make it a lot of "fun" to carry. Edited January 24, 2011 by Caged Quote Link to post Share on other sites
MrOneEyedBoh 14 Posted January 24, 2011 Author Report Share Posted January 24, 2011 Yeah I can see where you're coming from. I guess what I was asking is like internal mods. Like that twister and V plug are pretty decent mods to do. Not necessary but to help out. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
The_Caged_Bird 474 Posted January 24, 2011 Report Share Posted January 24, 2011 Yeah I can see where you're coming from. I guess what I was asking is like internal mods. Like that twister and V plug are pretty decent mods to do. Not necessary but to help out. Oh, sorry, I mis-understood. I HIGHLY recommend the V-plug! The twister? Not so much... I'm still running the stock gas puck because, if it ain't broke, don't fix it, BUT, if I were to put an American puck in, it would be from King's Armory OR MD's new plug when it debuts. You COULD buy the twister, run a few rounds through the gun with it and then send the twister to King's Armory in exchange for their better (and slightly more expensive) plug... Quote Link to post Share on other sites
slostang 80 Posted January 24, 2011 Report Share Posted January 24, 2011 I'd personally leave the puck stock. I've herd more bad reports than good with aftermarket pucks. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
MrOneEyedBoh 14 Posted January 24, 2011 Author Report Share Posted January 24, 2011 (edited) I'd personally leave the puck stock. I've herd more bad reports than good with aftermarket pucks. Thanks to you and the poster above. This is why Im posting here. Im going to get the v plug and no twister. Any other internals? I seen that gas piston for another Us part, and I see the tromix crook axis retaining pin.. I think I read somewhere that you have to bend this? Seems like this one is already bent? Should I get the lighter spring, like the one seen in the reliability kit? http://store.carolinashooterssupply.com/servlet/-strse-309/Saiga-E-dsh-tac-Gas-Piston/Detail?sfs=d64c9e49 Edited January 24, 2011 by MrOneEyedBoh Quote Link to post Share on other sites
RRice 34 Posted January 24, 2011 Report Share Posted January 24, 2011 (edited) I'd personally leave the puck stock. I've herd more bad reports than good with aftermarket pucks. Agreed.Don't go looking to fix problems that don't exist.I have the Gun Fix'r plug on all of my guns and it is worth the money.(I am sure the MD Arms one is goof too). I think you just need to decide how you want to configure the gun ergonomically but leave the gun mechanically stock as possible.I have had great luck with the Tromix fire control group,Gun Fix'r and the JT trigger springs.I have thousands and thousands of rounds through my DIY gun with no issues with just those parts. I have changed the ergonomics by milling the tang and adding an internal receiver block,magpul CTR,the basic chaos rail,JT trigger guard with magpul MOE and Krebs combat sights.However,mechanically the above listed parts are all I have done and it runs like a champ. Edited January 24, 2011 by RRice Quote Link to post Share on other sites
mark4567 4 Posted January 24, 2011 Report Share Posted January 24, 2011 Get this http://store.carolinashooterssupply.com/servlet/-strse-270/Saiga-Axis-Pin-Retaining/Detail Makes life easier during assembly!! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
MrOneEyedBoh 14 Posted January 24, 2011 Author Report Share Posted January 24, 2011 I'd personally leave the puck stock. I've herd more bad reports than good with aftermarket pucks. Agreed.Don't go looking to fix problems that don't exist.I have the Gun Fix'r plug on all of my guns and it is worth the money.(I am sure the MD Arms one is goof too). I think you just need to decide how you want to configure the gun ergonomically but leave the gun mechanically stock as possible.I have had great luck with the Tromix fire control group,Gun Fix'r and the JT trigger springs.I have thousands and thousands of rounds through my DIY gun with no issues with just those parts. I have changed the ergonomics by milling the tang and adding an internal receiver block,magpul CTR,the basic chaos rail,JT trigger guard with magpul MOE and Krebs combat sights.However,mechanically the above listed parts are all I have done and it runs like a champ. Ok cool. I just dont want o have to buy things later if they are or might be needed. But from doing more and more reading I see that these things arent necessary Get this http://store.carolin...etaining/Detail Makes life easier during assembly!! Ok cool haha. Should I get that retaining spring I liked to above also? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
mark4567 4 Posted January 24, 2011 Report Share Posted January 24, 2011 The low power recoil spring isn't necessary. I shoot a lot of low brass bird shot loads and the spring lets me use less gas to cycle the gun. It means I got to change springs if I shoot buck or heavy loads. But I think its worth it. Thats just me though! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
MrOneEyedBoh 14 Posted January 24, 2011 Author Report Share Posted January 24, 2011 The low power recoil spring isn't necessary. I shoot a lot of low brass bird shot loads and the spring lets me use less gas to cycle the gun. It means I got to change springs if I shoot buck or heavy loads. But I think its worth it. Thats just me though! Which springs should I buy? I dont think I need that crook spring because it looks like it comes in the main conversion kit Carolina sells. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
EJ45 38 Posted January 24, 2011 Report Share Posted January 24, 2011 I'm running the stock springs in mine. Other than having my internals polished, installing the Vplug and shooting the hell out of it, that's all I did as far as "performance" parts. Mine handles federal bulk with no problems. Id guess its better to change one thing at a time and see how your gun performs instead of changing out everything and wondering what is causing problems ... good luck! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
roachtron 49 Posted January 24, 2011 Report Share Posted January 24, 2011 (edited) Alright cool guys., Im going to make the jump NOW on the conversion stuff. and my rail I might get in a week or so. This is what I have so far Stock folding mechanism ( to side fold it, is this one pretty good? As in terms of stability, relibilty etc ) Conversion kit with 8.5" and Tromix DIY Low brass reliabilty kit ( not needed? ) And the rail, Im bent between the Chaos pre order one or the Carolina Tactical quad rail I'm not sure if the reliability kit would be needed. Be sure that you "break-in" the gun first with a couple hundred rounds of high brass ammo to see if your gun functions properly or not before converting it. If you have a warranty issue Cadiz will NOT fix it if you've already converted it. I'm all for converting, trust me, the difference in trigger pull is night and day but break the gun in first so that way you can determine any key problem areas that could be fixed before or during conversion... I am tired of seeing this and it is incorrect. In this thread http://forum.saiga-1...showtopic=59443 the owner of cadiz gun works states they will repair your gun if its ports are of incorrect size or there is any other defect that is caused during manufacturing. So even if you gun is converted they will repair it under warranty but it will be inspected to make sure it wasn't caused during your conversion. So still take your time and do it right or break it in first if you want but I am going to convert as soon as I get my hands one. Edited January 24, 2011 by roachtron 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
MrOneEyedBoh 14 Posted January 24, 2011 Author Report Share Posted January 24, 2011 Alright cool guys., Im going to make the jump NOW on the conversion stuff. and my rail I might get in a week or so. This is what I have so far Stock folding mechanism ( to side fold it, is this one pretty good? As in terms of stability, relibilty etc ) Conversion kit with 8.5" and Tromix DIY Low brass reliabilty kit ( not needed? ) And the rail, Im bent between the Chaos pre order one or the Carolina Tactical quad rail I'm not sure if the reliability kit would be needed. Be sure that you "break-in" the gun first with a couple hundred rounds of high brass ammo to see if your gun functions properly or not before converting it. If you have a warranty issue Cadiz will NOT fix it if you've already converted it. I'm all for converting, trust me, the difference in trigger pull is night and day but break the gun in first so that way you can determine any key problem areas that could be fixed before or during conversion... I am tired of seeing this and it is incorrect. In this thread http://forum.saiga-1...showtopic=59443 the owner of cadiz gun works states they will repair your gun if its ports are of incorrect size or there is any other defect that is caused during manufacturing. So even if you gun is converted they will repair it under warranty but it will be inspected to make sure it wasn't caused during your conversion. So still take your time and do it right or break it in first if you want but I am going to convert as soon as I get my hands one. Thanks man. I glanced thru the thread, is there 100% solid feedback on that? In terms of them not voiding the warranty. Im going to read it more later tomorrow. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
beefcakeb99 572 Posted January 24, 2011 Report Share Posted January 24, 2011 As he said, as long as you don't mess it up, or touch the ports, you are gtg. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Paulyski 2,227 Posted January 24, 2011 Report Share Posted January 24, 2011 And profile the hammer correctly too. Tom gets kinda chapped when that's the cause for a warranty repair. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
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