New Saiga 308 & Surefire Mag Test Fire

[monomonk 0]

I have to disagree with the thread starter. I have owned three Saigas and currently have the .223 and the .308. I also have other AK types, as well as FALs, and CETMEs. With the FALs and CETMEs you mostly get parts guns assembled by marginally skilled people at Century--unless you want to pay $900 and up for something else. The Saigas are new rifles made in the same factory that has made all (?) of the Russian AKs. Several years ago they were tremendous bargains, especially the .308, which cost less than half of what was being charged for rifles assembled with a hodge-podge of new and used parts. I have found Saigas to be well-made, well-finished for a mass produced military rifle, and reliable. The main problem with them was the unavailability of hi-cap mags. FBMG and Surefire have addressed that deficiency. I have used the FBMG 20 rounders in the .308 and they have worked fine. I do not have any Surefire mags for that rifle. The Surefires for my .223 Saiga have been satisfactory. Almost any firearms producer can put out a gun with problems. I hope you can get yours corrected.

 

Monomonk

[GreenEye 1]

In general the saiga's are a cheaper quality rifle. They are made with parts that happen to be on hand at the time, no 2 are exactly alike. differances in Barrel twist, thickness, crown, finish (toolmarks) along with different type of trunions, bolts, recievers, ect are all present on saiga rifles. your comparison to a ptr-91 rifle is kinda like apples and oarnges. A ptr-91 is a $1000 rifle, whereas a saiga 308 is a $300 rifle (despite market markups and current prices). So how can you really compare the 2 with a straight face??

 

BSometer rising into yellow zone...

 

I have three 308's purchased over the course of five years, and I've interchanged the parts on at least a few occasions. If you want to look at a "what's on hand" rifle, then have a look at a cetme. My friend has a $2000 into a PTR91 with the collapsable stock, hard to find scope, and two trips back to the factory. Other than mutilating the brass, it does about the same in accuracy as my saiga.

 

 

+1 buckandaquarterquarterstaff! Quite a few of the parts going into a Saiga .308 are specific to the Saiga .308, so how can they be cobbled together from random "parts that happen to be on hand at the time"? I have owned two Saiga .308s, and have seen several others, and the barrel thicknesses have been the same, the fit and finish have been the same, the bolts have been the same, etc.... Seriously, this guy thinks you can just throw any old bolt into a Saiga .308?

 

Some Saiga 7.62X39 rifles have dimpled receivers, and some don't. Other than that, which has no functional significance, I haven't heard of mixing and matching of parts. I have several Saigas, and they all work extremely well. People who have had problems have been able to send the guns back to RAA with entirely satisfactory results. In my opinion, Saigas are excellent examples of a simple, highly functional, and extremely robust rifle design.

 

I was talking about saiga's in general. The 223 (and probably the 7.62x39's) come with round front trunions and flat front truniuns. Many saiga have recievers with the pistol grip nut cut, many do not. The saiga 223 has come with no less than 3 different barrel twist ratios (1:7, 1:9, 1:10). ALL saigas have different diameter barrels, don't believe me just go to dinzag's page and see what all diameters have come on the different saigas. The saiga 308 has had at least 2 different bolt carrier types, a "high ground" and a "low ground", the "low ground" is the one that is haveing all the problems with the surefire mags. So in general maybe you should learn what you are talking about before even opening your mouth. And I was not bashing saigas at all if you would have read my original post, you would see i have 3 of them and love them. And when I said "from parts that happen to be on hand at the time", I never even implied that any of said parts were inferior or wrong parts to use.

 

God knows how much fun you'd have trying to interchange parts of a dozen same caliber winchester model 70's from the last 15 years. I suppose that's a parts bin "whatever's on hand" offering as well? My sincerest apologies for not considering twist rates and bbl diameters as an example of "what's on hand" manufacturing.

 

Dont forget the trunion styles and reciever styles, and bolt carrier styles differances . But don't worry Your CLASS A sarcasm is truly awe inspiring, YOU DA MAN.

[buckandaquarterquarterstaff 5]

In general the saiga's are a cheaper quality rifle. They are made with parts that happen to be on hand at the time, no 2 are exactly alike. differances in Barrel twist, thickness, crown, finish (toolmarks) along with different type of trunions, bolts, recievers, ect are all present on saiga rifles. your comparison to a ptr-91 rifle is kinda like apples and oarnges. A ptr-91 is a $1000 rifle, whereas a saiga 308 is a $300 rifle (despite market markups and current prices). So how can you really compare the 2 with a straight face??

 

BSometer rising into yellow zone...

 

I have three 308's purchased over the course of five years, and I've interchanged the parts on at least a few occasions. If you want to look at a "what's on hand" rifle, then have a look at a cetme. My friend has a $2000 into a PTR91 with the collapsable stock, hard to find scope, and two trips back to the factory. Other than mutilating the brass, it does about the same in accuracy as my saiga.

 

 

+1 buckandaquarterquarterstaff! Quite a few of the parts going into a Saiga .308 are specific to the Saiga .308, so how can they be cobbled together from random "parts that happen to be on hand at the time"? I have owned two Saiga .308s, and have seen several others, and the barrel thicknesses have been the same, the fit and finish have been the same, the bolts have been the same, etc.... Seriously, this guy thinks you can just throw any old bolt into a Saiga .308?

 

Some Saiga 7.62X39 rifles have dimpled receivers, and some don't. Other than that, which has no functional significance, I haven't heard of mixing and matching of parts. I have several Saigas, and they all work extremely well. People who have had problems have been able to send the guns back to RAA with entirely satisfactory results. In my opinion, Saigas are excellent examples of a simple, highly functional, and extremely robust rifle design.

 

I was talking about saiga's in general. The 223 (and probably the 7.62x39's) come with round front trunions and flat front truniuns. Many saiga have recievers with the pistol grip nut cut, many do not. The saiga 223 has come with no less than 3 different barrel twist ratios (1:7, 1:9, 1:10). ALL saigas have different diameter barrels, don't believe me just go to dinzag's page and see what all diameters have come on the different saigas. The saiga 308 has had at least 2 different bolt carrier types, a "high ground" and a "low ground", the "low ground" is the one that is haveing all the problems with the surefire mags. So in general maybe you should learn what you are talking about before even opening your mouth. And I was not bashing saigas at all if you would have read my original post, you would see i have 3 of them and love them. And when I said "from parts that happen to be on hand at the time", I never even implied that any of said parts were inferior or wrong parts to use.

 

God knows how much fun you'd have trying to interchange parts of a dozen same caliber winchester model 70's from the last 15 years. I suppose that's a parts bin "whatever's on hand" offering as well? My sincerest apologies for not considering twist rates and bbl diameters as an example of "what's on hand" manufacturing.

 

Dont forget the trunion styles and reciever styles, and bolt carrier styles differances . But don't worry Your CLASS A sarcasm is truly awe inspiring, YOU DA MAN.

 

I gotta admit, not having that PG hole drilled would really cause me to want to spend $1000 more for another gun. And that round trunnion is gonna take at least 2 inches off my grouping...

 

I'll call a truce (sarcasm is pretty much my deal, didn't mean to get too aggressively passive aggressive). I get what you mean... Sort of an AR vs AK argument at the heart of it, and that's already been done...

Edited October 7, 2008 by buckandaquarterquarterstaff

[Jack A Sol 2]

Safety is in the operater, not the rifle.

Rule No1: There's no such thing as an unloaded gun.

Now it's time to get it fixed or sell it to me.

$150.00 last offer.

 

DEFECTIVE = LAWSUIT....Get it? Trigger that STICKS in the ON position with a LOADED CHAMBER?

 

Refund or lawsuit. Get it YET??

 

 

guns owners....First to complain about the legal system, first to threaten to SUE.

[Genocide 0]

[gunnysmith 4]

Safety is in the operater, not the rifle.

Rule No1: There's no such thing as an unloaded gun.

Now it's time to get it fixed or sell it to me.

$150.00 last offer.

 

DEFECTIVE = LAWSUIT....Get it? Trigger that STICKS in the ON position with a LOADED CHAMBER?

 

Refund or lawsuit. Get it YET??

 

 

guns owners....First to complain about the legal system, first to threaten to SUE.

Would you like to rephrase that?

Edited October 7, 2008 by gunnysmith

[Havoc308 3]

Please don't feed the fookin' trolls!

[1liter 20]

Yawn...

 

Move to fight club.

[camosoul77 0]

Holy necrothread batman!

 

Mine did this when I first got it. YMMV, but this is how I fixed it:

 

Remove mag, manually chamber a round. Let it slam shut. Shove mag in, hard, make it click. Fire. Repeat until it feeds well.

 

Took me about 30 rounds. Runs like a dream now.

 

Rearward travel really beat up the cartridges for a while, but it stopped doing that too. Less than 100rnds later it now works like it's supposed to.

 

Redneck way of doing it, I know. But it's an AK people... Kicking it's ass is what makes it work better.

[BKLYN_C 14]

^ +1 ^

 

WTF is the problem here?

Take a file, drimmel and sand paper in your hands and in 20 minutes you will have the best rifle in the world, Kalashnikov with a killer round

Edited November 27, 2008 by BKLYN_C

[Vermiform 26]

You have all been trolled from the very begining of this thread. If he knows how to break down an AK and tell if the "trigger spring" is weak (WTF is with that anyway?), then he already knows AKs and knows that the Saiga 308 is a good rifle. Furthermore, he would never throw surefire mags in the trash even if he didn't like them or thought they were shit. He would sell them to someone else here or turn em on gunbroker.

 

He trolled you from the start. A mod needs to compare IP addresses in this thread as well cause he could very likely be another personality (or two) in this thread as well.

 

Quit feeding him.

 

Reporting this thread to a mod to hopefully get it locked.

[IndyArms 10,186]

AMEN... nothing more to see here people... move along... move along...