DrWho 10 Posted December 28, 2008 Report Share Posted December 28, 2008 (edited) i mean caliber... ok guys i want a 7.62 X 39 just because a buddy has one and likes it.. but i have to wait till shop gets one.. right now they have a 223 and a 308 but i honestly don't know what any of it means.. have a s12 and a xd9 whats a better short range shot? whats more tactical.. what is better for long range. et.... what ammo is going to be available and why.. what ammo is expensive or cheap help inform me.. or just say fnckin google it.. Edited December 28, 2008 by DrWho Quote Link to post Share on other sites
nalioth 405 Posted December 28, 2008 Report Share Posted December 28, 2008 i mean caliber... ok guys i want a 7.62 X 39 just because a buddy has one and likes it.. but i have to wait till shop gets one.. right now they have a 223 and a 308 but i honestly don't know what any of it means.. have a s12 and a xd9 whats a better short range shot? whats more tactical.. what is better for long range. et.... what ammo is going to be available and why.. what ammo is expensive or cheap help inform me.. or just say fnckin google it.. They're all damned good at short range."Tactical" is a mind set, not the fiddly bits you can hang on your weapon. Long range use would go more for the .308, as it's the biggest centerfire cartridge you mention. Availabity? 7.62x39 and .223 are both made here in the USA. They'll both be available, theoretically. Right now, we get cheap 7.62x39 imported from Russian and other eastern block countries. If the imports dry up, it'll get expensive. .223 is expensive right now due to us currently having a two fronted combat engagement. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Vultite 57 Posted December 28, 2008 Report Share Posted December 28, 2008 i like X39 for the price and power. .223 lacks the power and is more expensive, but if i didn't care about cost i'd chose .308 for power and accuracy..... Quote Link to post Share on other sites
jrance@iacwds.com 716 Posted December 28, 2008 Report Share Posted December 28, 2008 The following is my opinion - .308 is the most expensive ammo, it is great for long range accuracy depending on what weapon platform you use .223 is the most accurate for CQB out to 400 yards, it is next most expensive 7.62x39 offers less accuracy than .223 but is more powerful and is cheapest I have and like them all, this is what I see as their advantages/disadvantages in a nutshell when a person says "?" Hope that helps. 1911 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
nalioth 405 Posted December 28, 2008 Report Share Posted December 28, 2008 Please keep in mind that as soon as we pull our troops out of the middle east, .223 prices are probably gonna drop like a rock. The above posters are speaking of the now, not the future. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
AgentLQ 3 Posted December 28, 2008 Report Share Posted December 28, 2008 Its really kinda up to you. What kind of sustainable do you want? There are arguments for all the rounds you listed. Such as... 308 and 223 are NATO rounds... which would be nice to have a weapon you're familiar with chambered in for a SHTF scenario. The 223 is one of those American rounds you can buy all sorts of fancy performance rounds for as well. (to try and make up for the rounds ballistic short comings) But IMHO... I'd grab the x39. Buy a case (or three) and stash it. The ammo is pretty prevalent in decent quality. And if you really wanna make sad buy some CORBON DPX rounds... omfg... *skeet* Plus... by the time you'll need a 556, there will be plenty laying on the ground. I dunno I'm grabbin a 556 saiga when I can. Modding that sumbitch for the MSA adapter. Your mileage may vary. I sure as shit am not paying out the ass to shoot 308 through a semi... Eff that noise. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
gtnichols 51 Posted December 29, 2008 Report Share Posted December 29, 2008 "By the time you need a .223, there will be plenty laying on the ground" :ph34r: :ph34r: :ph34r: :ph34r: HAH! that's funny,... Please note 556 and .223 are the same rifle,... Quote Link to post Share on other sites
sadams4 1 Posted December 29, 2008 Report Share Posted December 29, 2008 The last long range war was WW I (trench warfare). Since then, with each war, the range of engagement has reduced to very nominal stand off distances. Most engagements that have taken place in recent wars has occured at an average of 65 meters (occassional long range sniper shots or stand offs). At say, less than 300m the x39 would come out on top for effectiveness, wound trama damage, and (as a civilian having to pay for it) cost. Up until a couple years ago, I had been a huge fan of the 5.56... I have seen the error of my ways and have picked up more AK types, and consistently fired them more often (have not put a single round through my AR in over 3 years). As for cost on ammunition after the current wars calm down or end... don't count on it. OSHA and EPA regulations have had a pretty harsh affect on ammunition manufacturing in the US. Once the wars settle down, the military will have to spend some significant time rebuilding pre-possition war stores, as well as training inventory. The largest impact has been the BATFEs restriction on importing "military surplus" ammo from foreign countries. Even prior to the war (even in CA) I remember 5.56 going for 500 rounds for $100, yet 800 rounds of 7.62x39 going for around $90. There are additonal costs to take into account: cost of weapon, magazines, readily available and cost effective accessories, overall quality and reliabilty of the weapon and/or accessories. Case in point, a friend of mine recently was looking at getting a rifle: Ar-15 $1000, each mag $20, 1000 rounds of ammo $400 AK $600, each mag $13, 1000 rounds $240 He got the AK and everything needed for less than the cost of an AR with nothing else. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
DrWho 10 Posted December 29, 2008 Author Report Share Posted December 29, 2008 guys.. all really awesome posts... thanks Lobo: your info makes sense on range and actual usage. think i will wait for a dealer to get me a X39 may go to a gun show in cow town on the 3rd and see if any thing is available at cost.. just sucks. i have 200 rounds of x39 and 2, 30 round surefire clear mags but no pea shooter. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Bean.223 365 Posted December 29, 2008 Report Share Posted December 29, 2008 (edited) The last long range war was WW I (trench warfare). Since then, with each war, the range of engagement has reduced to very nominal stand off distances. Most engagements that have taken place in recent wars has occured at an average of 65 meters (occassional long range sniper shots or stand offs). At say, less than 300m the x39 would come out on top for effectiveness, wound trama damage, and (as a civilian having to pay for it) cost. Up until a couple years ago, I had been a huge fan of the 5.56... I have seen the error of my ways and have picked up more AK types, and consistently fired them more often (have not put a single round through my AR in over 3 years). As for cost on ammunition after the current wars calm down or end... don't count on it. OSHA and EPA regulations have had a pretty harsh affect on ammunition manufacturing in the US. Once the wars settle down, the military will have to spend some significant time rebuilding pre-possition war stores, as well as training inventory. The largest impact has been the BATFEs restriction on importing "military surplus" ammo from foreign countries. Even prior to the war (even in CA) I remember 5.56 going for 500 rounds for $100, yet 800 rounds of 7.62x39 going for around $90. There are additonal costs to take into account: cost of weapon, magazines, readily available and cost effective accessories, overall quality and reliabilty of the weapon and/or accessories. Case in point, a friend of mine recently was looking at getting a rifle: Ar-15 $1000, each mag $20, 1000 rounds of ammo $400 AK $600, each mag $13, 1000 rounds $240 He got the AK and everything needed for less than the cost of an AR with nothing else. Just a few things. You can get a ar from 650-800 range. AND ar mags can be had for 8$ I can show ya a place that has Pmags for 14$ SHIPPED! Edited December 29, 2008 by Bean.223 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
bravo30 0 Posted December 29, 2008 Report Share Posted December 29, 2008 (edited) like the guys said before .308 is deff the way to go long range but !!!! i live in West Philly so x39 serves me well for whatever range i may encounter ( short to medium) i place survivability high above any other trait and with the x39 you get that 10 fold along with stopping power ..... a combination in my opinion that is worth its weigh in gold esp in an urban enviorment .....now if i lived out west id go for the 5.56 for obvious reasons mainly accuracy and range not so much worried about stopping power cause i doubt theyd want to fight with a hole in their chest Edited December 29, 2008 by bravo30 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
SOPMOD 254 Posted December 29, 2008 Report Share Posted December 29, 2008 7.62x39 a 200 yard caliber,it is hard hitting,forgiving in the reloading department,the most reliable feeding,cheapest magazines,cheapest to purchase in bulk,most commonly used "bulk" military caliber used by American civilians due to a proliferation of cheap SKS rifles and .13 per round ammo sold a case at a time for 20 years. Everyone talks about 223 since it's what our military and police use but our military can't even get enough ammo to supply itself and our police won't share their ammo with you and they don't have that much anyway but every hilbilly,gangbanger,militia goonie,white supremacist,leftist rebel wannabe has an SKS and anywhere from a carton to a case of 7.62x39 laying around and if you really ended up having to shoot it out with some looter or ruffian there is a good chance that they would be using an SKS or maybe even an AK and once you dirtnapped them you could scavenge them for ammo and maybe even mags. Also 7.62x39 brass can be reloaded from reclaimed 303 British,7.63x54,7.7 Jap,7.65 Mauser bullets and powder so if you have plenty of primers and buy brass cased ammo you could use half a dozen finds of surplus ammo for components! Also 7.62x39 is the only caliber you listed that can be reloaded with heavy bullets and produce a reliable subsonic round for use with suppressors that will actually still cycle the weapon when loaded slower than 1150fps. A 7.62x39 AK and a decent 308 bolt gun is quite a combination if you ask me... Quote Link to post Share on other sites
22_Shooter 1,560 Posted December 29, 2008 Report Share Posted December 29, 2008 I voted 7.62x39 for average all around versatility. i live in West Philly Reading that made me think........... "West Philadelphia, born and raised, on the playground is where I spent most of my days....." OK, I'm done babbling. My ex used to live in North-West'ish Philly area. Not a very friendly area to live, I might add . Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Racer 27 37 Posted December 30, 2008 Report Share Posted December 30, 2008 I voted to go for the ak round since you have some and mags. I got a 223 first but that was before everything was so costly and I really "wanted" an AR. Go for the one that you want. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
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