TronJohn 1 Posted January 8, 2009 Report Share Posted January 8, 2009 Alright, just got back from lunch a little while ago, picked up the Warhammer and dropped it off at home and just took a quick inspection of it and have a few questions. First off, I couldnt rack the bolt and open it more than an inch? is there a special trick? Also there seems to be a lever on the right hand side by the bolt, what exactly is that? Then there seems to be something else on the left side that kinda looks like a lever, but doesnt seem to do anything? (I could be wrong it about it doing anything as I didnt play with it) I found out the silver tab by the trigger is the BHO, but when do I press it? Before I rack the bolt or after its already fully open do I then press the tab to hold it open? I now see the "Rock n' Lock" magazine action you guys are talking about. I'm new to it, so I dont hate it, seems easy enough, but the AR style magwell adapter does sound like a nice option. But if Ill still have to Rock n' Lock the MD20, theres really no reason to spend the money to modify the rest. Does anyone know if the MD20 will ever be able to use the AR style magwell adapters? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
BobAsh 582 Posted January 8, 2009 Report Share Posted January 8, 2009 (edited) The WarHammer? lol I couldnt rack the bolt and open it more than an inch? is there a special trick? No trick, it's just like any other AK. edit to add- make sure the safety isn't in the way. Also there seems to be a lever on the right hand side by the bolt, what exactly is that? I assume you are referring to the safety. Up is safe, as marked on the receiver. Then there seems to be something else on the left side that kinda looks like a lever, but doesnt seem to do anything? I'm guessing you mean the scope mount. I found out the silver tab by the trigger is the BHO, but when do I press it? Press it as you're racking the bolt, and it catches. Does anyone know if the MD20 will ever be able to use the AR style magwell adapters? Probably not, unless MD makes a magwell specifically for it. Edited January 8, 2009 by BobAsh Quote Link to post Share on other sites
BobAsh 582 Posted January 8, 2009 Report Share Posted January 8, 2009 I'm new to it... Yeah. Check this out, and see if it answers some questions. http://en.wikisource.org/wiki/AK-47_Operator%27s_Manual Quote Link to post Share on other sites
ernestmayhand 10 Posted January 8, 2009 Report Share Posted January 8, 2009 I found out the silver tab by the trigger is the BHO, but when do I press it? Everytime a friend of mine tries out the 12 for the first time I have to show him my way of locking the bolt open. Here's what I do: Using my thumb pointing down, I pull the carrier back all the way, then using my middle finger I push and hold up on the BHO tab, then slowly release the carrier and the BHO should catch. At the same time with my left hand I'm usually removing the mag and reinserting a new one. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
TronJohn 1 Posted January 8, 2009 Author Report Share Posted January 8, 2009 The WarHammer? lol yes yes, you like eh? I thought that was its official nickname anyways? No trick, it's just like any other AK. edit to add- make sure the safety isn't in the way. I've never had my hands on any AK platform, but seems easy enough... just grab the handle and rack back right? (Obviously while holding the BHO) Once I load the mag, and rack one in the chamber, can I then take the mag back out and re-load another round giving me 5+1 instead of 4+1? I assume you are referring to the safety. Up is safe, as marked on the receiver. Ahh ok, its a pretty big saftey, it was probably on, hence the reason I couldnt rack it all the way back. I'm guessing you mean the scope mount. yeah tahts probably what it is, I wont ever use it, when I have the gun modified can I have it removed? Or can I remove it myself? Probably not, unless MD makes a magwell specifically for it. Looks like I better get used to the rock n' lock. Its not bad and seems pretty easy, but the AR style is a tad easier, but I'm going with whatever setup my MD drum needs. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
D-H 20 Posted January 8, 2009 Report Share Posted January 8, 2009 I would suggest avoiding that magwell part. By adding it you severely limit the types of magazines you can use. You'll get used to loading regular Saiga 12 mags quickly. The standard 5 round mag is pretty easy to load. Practice with that and you'll be glad you didn't get the magwell. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
BobAsh 582 Posted January 9, 2009 Report Share Posted January 9, 2009 Once I load the mag, and rack one in the chamber, can I then take the mag back out and re-load another round giving me 5+1 instead of 4+1? You can also hand load the chamber through the ejection port prior to inserting the mag. Ahh ok, its a pretty big saftey, it was probably on, hence the reason I couldnt rack it all the way back. Yes, it's big. It doubles as the dustcover for the ejection port. yeah tahts probably what it is, I wont ever use it, when I have the gun modified can I have it removed? Or can I remove it myself? Yeah, it can be removed. I don't have one on mine. It's riveted on, so to make it look good requires welding and refinishing. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
TronJohn 1 Posted January 9, 2009 Author Report Share Posted January 9, 2009 (edited) I'm going to be sending it to Will @ RedStick since you guys are so backed up. I've been talking to him for probably about a year. You guys have just always been backed up so I always planned on him doing it. As you can see, I literally just got the gun today. But I will make sure I have him remove that as well. Is there any way to change the saftey? I'm clearly getting a full lob n' tuck on this bad boy, and well whats replace a safety? Are there any other better safetys you guys have used to replace the stock one? The idea of hand loading one while the bolt is open makes more sense. I had a chance for a little more hands on tonight after work while on the shitter... so I have some more questions as I took some good time to inspect the weapon all over. This is my first gun like this... so it seems kind of awkward to rack the bolt and press the BHO. It seems like the bolt handle should be on the left so you can rack it so much easier instead of having to bend your arm around the top of the receiver. Any suggetions on the easiest way to handle the weapon as you are racking the bolt? What about this plastic cover on the top of the receiver... whats up with that? Does it come off? Will it get replaced with my face life? Edited January 9, 2009 by TronJohn Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Etek 32 Posted January 9, 2009 Report Share Posted January 9, 2009 I know you're new to the AK/Saiga field and excited etc but.... Are you for real? Seriously. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
gmorgan 2 Posted January 9, 2009 Report Share Posted January 9, 2009 (edited) I know you're new to the AK/Saiga field and excited etc but.... Are you for real? Seriously. Tron Jon has been a member here for over a year and has almost 140 posts...I gotta belive someone has access to his computer and might be having a little fun at his expense . Edited January 9, 2009 by gmorgan Quote Link to post Share on other sites
TronJohn 1 Posted January 9, 2009 Author Report Share Posted January 9, 2009 yes I am serious and no, there hasnt been anyone on my account. This is the first day I've held a saiga or any AK platform in my hands. Of course I'm going to have questions. My last post was serious and I'd appreciate if someone could help me out. That is probably the last series of questions. I think I covered all the ones I will have in that post. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
7.62x39 0 Posted January 9, 2009 Report Share Posted January 9, 2009 I know you're new to the AK/Saiga field and excited etc but.... Are you for real? Seriously. Tron Jon has been a member here for over a year and has almost 140 posts...I gotta belive someone has access to his computer and might be having a little fun at his expense . I don't think so. Go read some of those 140 posts. He's for real. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
TronJohn 1 Posted January 9, 2009 Author Report Share Posted January 9, 2009 I'm for real, just new and eager to learn. I always come with 10,000 questions. And now after a year I FINALLY have purchased a saiga 12 (was forced to do so because of this filthy animal about to take office) I wanted to be safe than sorry. Good thing now me and my loved ones will be safe. Well... once the MD20 comes Quote Link to post Share on other sites
TR Young 175 Posted January 9, 2009 Report Share Posted January 9, 2009 Screw them, TronJohn. Ask as many questions as you want to. That's how you learn. I always say, "You don't know what you don't know" so you have to ask. And you shouldn't feel like you should be ashamed to ask. Congrats on your new '109! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
TronJohn 1 Posted January 9, 2009 Author Report Share Posted January 9, 2009 Yes thanks man, I'm finally "part of the family" and not just an outsider looking in. I just recently sold my mossberg 500 to get this... and boy am I happy. (once I get this cheap stock and foregrip off and chop the barrel and move the gas chamber back) Quote Link to post Share on other sites
hobbyshooter 59 Posted January 9, 2009 Report Share Posted January 9, 2009 (edited) This is my first gun like this... so it seems kind of awkward to rack the bolt and press the BHO. It seems like the bolt handle should be on the left so you can rack it so much easier instead of having to bend your arm around the top of the receiver. Any suggetions on the easiest way to handle the weapon as you are racking the bolt? It is a little ackward at first compared to AR's, but having spent so many rounds through my 10/22's it wasn't foreign to me. The 3 ways I rack the bolt are: 1: While holding the foregrip with my left hand, with the but against my upper thigh, and rack it with my right hand. (I don't use this method much anymore unless all my mags are empty and I'm clearing it to set it down) This way you can rack the bolt open with your thumb and press in the BHO with your fingers like Ernest explained above. 2: Holding the grip point the gun slightly down, rotate it slightly counter clockwise, and rack the bolt with your left hand, reaching over the gun. The BHO can be pressed up with your trigger finger. 3: Holding the grip with right hand, butt against your shoulder reach under the gun with your left hand (behind the mag) and rack the bolt. Again the BHO can be pressed up with your trigger finger. This is how I now do mag swaps and seems to be the fastest way. This also allows you to keep the muzzle pointed on target. Do a youtube search for "AK47 reload" and you will find a few techniques. What about this plastic cover on the top of the receiver... whats up with that? Does it come off? Will it get replaced with my face life? There's no plastic. Sheet metal receiver cover is what I think you are referring to. It does not get replaced, but will probably get a paint job. It does come off. Take a look at the button pointing out of the back of that cover. You have to push down the the small button on the top, then push the whole button in and pull up/back on the cover. That's the second step in field stripping the gun (first step being clearing the chamber). Edited January 9, 2009 by hobbyshooter Quote Link to post Share on other sites
BobAsh 582 Posted January 9, 2009 Report Share Posted January 9, 2009 Don't trip, you're one of us. I'm going to be sending it to Will @ RedStick since you guys are so backed up. Will does nice work, and is reliable. Is there any way to change the saftey? There are a few aftermarket safeties around, but I don't like them. I recommend that you accustom yourself to the AK manual of arms. Any suggetions on the easiest way to handle the weapon as you are racking the bolt? It's easier once the pistol grip is on. Rotate the weapon with your right hand so the bolt is up, and rack across the top. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
TronJohn 1 Posted January 9, 2009 Author Report Share Posted January 9, 2009 (edited) Bob youre probably right, onces I get the pistol grip with the tromix stock it will probably be much easier to work the bolt. I'd like to check out these other safetys just for the hell of it... do you know where I could find pics of them? hobbyshooter: I honestly really think the top of the receiver is plastic... I didnt sleep at home last night and havent been home yet, so havent had a chance to re-inspect it... but I know I took a good look at it last night with a quick inspection because it did seem odd to me. I will check again later today and post back. Edited January 9, 2009 by TronJohn Quote Link to post Share on other sites
BobAsh 582 Posted January 9, 2009 Report Share Posted January 9, 2009 I honestly really think the top of the receiver is plastic... If the gun is a Saiga 12 guage, the top cover on the receiver is sheetmetal. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
hobbyshooter 59 Posted January 9, 2009 Report Share Posted January 9, 2009 I honestly really think the top of the receiver is plastic... If the gun is a Saiga 12 guage, the top cover on the receiver is sheetmetal. Yep, push the buttons in and remove it like I explained above you you'll see what's going on. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
TronJohn 1 Posted January 10, 2009 Author Report Share Posted January 10, 2009 closer inspection show it is sheet metal, go figure. There is just such a thick coating on it doesn't seem like metal. I'm going to blow a few dozen rounds and ship it off to will so he can get it chopped and registered. Any links to the other kinds of safetys? I assume that since the back cover comes off you can't have a piece of rail across the entire top. Or can you if you make it 2 separate pieces? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
hobbyshooter 59 Posted January 10, 2009 Report Share Posted January 10, 2009 closer inspection show it is sheet metal, go figure. There is just such a thick coating on it doesn't seem like metal. I'm going to blow a few dozen rounds and ship it off to will so he can get it chopped and registered. Any links to the other kinds of safetys? I assume that since the back cover comes off you can't have a piece of rail across the entire top. Or can you if you make it 2 separate pieces? I believe the finish is a parkerized powder coat. A rail on the dust cover wouldn't hold a sight very well. It can move around a bit. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
BobAsh 582 Posted January 10, 2009 Report Share Posted January 10, 2009 There are rails that go across the cover, also sights that mount on the cover. I find that they don't move around much and are pretty repeatable. This shooter doesn't seem to mind it... Quote Link to post Share on other sites
TronJohn 1 Posted January 10, 2009 Author Report Share Posted January 10, 2009 So Bob, the rails that go across the top, is it a 2 piece rail system, or is it just a single piece of rail? I am not looking to mount a scope on it... why bother on an 8"? But I just do like the overall look of the rail and want the versatility. This top cover seems like a mother fucker to get off... I would assume its just because I'm not used to it. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
TR Young 175 Posted January 10, 2009 Report Share Posted January 10, 2009 There are rails that go across the cover, also sights that mount on the cover. I find that they don't move around much and are pretty repeatable.This shooter doesn't seem to mind it... Rails? Cover?? Sights???? I don't see them.... Quote Link to post Share on other sites
BobAsh 582 Posted January 10, 2009 Report Share Posted January 10, 2009 This top cover seems like a mother fucker to get off... I would assume its just because I'm not used to it. Yeah, there's kind of a little trick to it, you'll get used to it. There is the Cobra rail, which is a "Scout-style" rail: http://forum.saiga-12.com/index.php?showtopic=31709 There are a few cover rails around like this: http://www.opticsplanet.net/ncstar-scope-m...mount-mtak.html Personally I would just go with iron sights on a shotgun. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
TronJohn 1 Posted January 10, 2009 Author Report Share Posted January 10, 2009 Yeah I was reading that Cobra top rail thread the other day, what makes it "scout" exactly? Because its slightly elevated? Can I put just a piece of rail right on the top with out a riser like his? That piece from optics planet is cheap as hell... what do you think the quality is? Do you think it would look right matched up with a separate piece of rail on the front? I really dont plan on using the rails for anything on top... I just like the look of them. I am thinking of putting a TRL-2 on top of I go with the 8". A laser will be plenty for anything within a cqc situation with an 8". I will have sights too for if and when I want to remove the light. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
BobAsh 582 Posted January 10, 2009 Report Share Posted January 10, 2009 Scout because it mounts forward of the receiver. I don't know about the quality of that piece, I just posted it as an example. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
TronJohn 1 Posted January 10, 2009 Author Report Share Posted January 10, 2009 Arent there rails out there that just lay flat with out that riser? I could have sworn I seen Saigas with a full flat rail across the top. (obviously its 2 pieces because of the cover) Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Etek 32 Posted January 10, 2009 Report Share Posted January 10, 2009 Press HERE---------> http://forum.saiga-12.com/index.php?act=Search&f=2 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
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