unclejake 428 Posted October 27, 2009 Report Share Posted October 27, 2009 I see $289 WASR and I will get one just to put it in the safe! I have to admit that a $505 Plum SGL21 is awful tempting. In fact, it downright gives me a woody. Wish I had some room on a credit card, but it has been a tough year. ! Maybe I can unload my conversion for $550 on GB and get an arsenal! Damn, I'm drooling! I'm with you B, if I can run across a WASR for under $300, I would have to grab one up just to stick back...naw, I'd probably use it for my beater/shooter and leave my Saigas in the safe. Boy, I hope these prices keep dropping! The rifles as well as the ammo!! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
bigsal 757 Posted October 27, 2009 Author Report Share Posted October 27, 2009 I've been eyeing a 7.62 Saiga for a home conversion for a long time now. I'm not really attached to the idea of doing everything myself; I just want a good looking AK. Would a SGL-21 being a good fit at this price? Should I wait it out a few more weeks to see if prices continue to fall? This is the floor. You should buy them now. Buy Plum or black as they seem to have the highest resale value. Good Luck placing your order~! 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Spartacus 1,619 Posted October 27, 2009 Report Share Posted October 27, 2009 Anybody know if these have the "thick" receivers (1.6mm?)? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
crackback 135 Posted October 27, 2009 Report Share Posted October 27, 2009 I've been eyeing a 7.62 Saiga for a home conversion for a long time now. I'm not really attached to the idea of doing everything myself; I just want a good looking AK. Would a SGL-21 being a good fit at this price? Should I wait it out a few more weeks to see if prices continue to fall? This is the floor. You should buy them now. Buy Plum or black as they seem to have the highest resale value. Good Luck placing your order~! I concur. They may go slightly lower, but not much. A SGL-21 at $500 today is equivalent to a $340 AK in 1994 prior to the AWB rush for those with a historical perspective. http://data.bls.gov/cgi-bin/cpicalc.pl Also, those damn Nintendo games I bought in 1988 at $49.99 a pop are equivalent to $91.28/game today! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
crackback 135 Posted October 27, 2009 Report Share Posted October 27, 2009 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
imarangemaster 315 Posted October 28, 2009 Report Share Posted October 28, 2009 I see $289 WASR and I will get one just to put it in the safe! I have to admit that a $505 Plum SGL21 is awful tempting. In fact, it downright gives me a woody. Wish I had some room on a credit card, but it has been a tough year. ! Maybe I can unload my conversion for $550 on GB and get an arsenal! Damn, I'm drooling! I'm with you B, if I can run across a WASR for under $300, I would have to grab one up just to stick back...naw, I'd probably use it for my beater/shooter and leave my Saigas in the safe. Boy, I hope these prices keep dropping! The rifles as well as the ammo!! Jake, It would have to be $300 or less for me to get the WASR, otherwise, I spend $400 on a CMP rack grade Inland! It's a bitch having two favorite types of guns! AKs and M1 carbines! 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
mav 459 Posted October 28, 2009 Report Share Posted October 28, 2009 I see $289 WASR and I will get one just to put it in the safe! I have to admit that a $505 Plum SGL21 is awful tempting. In fact, it downright gives me a woody. Wish I had some room on a credit card, but it has been a tough year. ! Maybe I can unload my conversion for $550 on GB and get an arsenal! Damn, I'm drooling! I'm with you B, if I can run across a WASR for under $300, I would have to grab one up just to stick back...naw, I'd probably use it for my beater/shooter and leave my Saigas in the safe. Boy, I hope these prices keep dropping! The rifles as well as the ammo!! Jake, It would have to be $300 or less for me to get the WASR, otherwise, I spend $400 on a CMP rack grade Inland! It's a bitch having two favorite types of guns! AKs and M1 carbines! Only two? Lightweight. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
imarangemaster 315 Posted October 28, 2009 Report Share Posted October 28, 2009 Ha! On my pitiful LEO disability retirement, and my even more pitiful teachers salary, I am lucky I even own one of each! 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
jbrubaker 13 Posted October 28, 2009 Report Share Posted October 28, 2009 Thanks for the opinions, guys. So should I pull the trigger now or wait 'til after I visit a big gun show in my area this weekend? Think the sale will last through the weekend? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
mav 459 Posted October 28, 2009 Report Share Posted October 28, 2009 Ha! On my pitiful LEO disability retirement, and my even more pitiful teachers salary, I am lucky I even own one of each! Hell, I have favorites I have never owned or even touched, for example, the Ma Deuce is one of my favorites. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
jrance@iacwds.com 716 Posted October 28, 2009 Report Share Posted October 28, 2009 Thanks for the opinions, guys. So should I pull the trigger now or wait 'til after I visit a big gun show in my area this weekend? Think the sale will last through the weekend? If you want one, IMO, you need to pull the trigger. To put it in perspective I paid a little over $100.00 more for an SGL-10 last November. The rear had to be converted and a bullet guide installed. Bargains don't last forever. ymmv They had a sale on the US made folder stock, trunion and all neccessary hardware for like $164 that lasted 2 days. Bought one and went back for another and poof they were gone. I can always go elsewhere and pay $350.00. Those are still in stock. 1911 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Spartacus 1,619 Posted October 28, 2009 Report Share Posted October 28, 2009 Anybody know if these have the "thick" receivers (1.6mm?)? They are 1mm. Thanks.... was maybe a silly question and I kind of figured that. I saw a thread recently debating the thick vs. thin receivers and it got me to thinking that maybe the Saigas had been upgraded recently. The thicker receivers always appealed to me, a step closer to milled without the expense. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
shades_of_grey 1,092 Posted October 28, 2009 Report Share Posted October 28, 2009 (edited) Anybody know if these have the "thick" receivers (1.6mm?)? They are 1mm. Thanks.... was maybe a silly question and I kind of figured that. I saw a thread recently debating the thick vs. thin receivers and it got me to thinking that maybe the Saigas had been upgraded recently. The thicker receivers always appealed to me, a step closer to milled without the expense. The way I look at it, 1mm receivers are the standard in the factory producing military 7.62x39 rifles overseen by M Kalashnikov. His standard really is the AK standard. I much prefer a 1mm receiver. The thicker ones are too heavy and not necessary for the design. Edited October 28, 2009 by post-apocalyptic 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
imarangemaster 315 Posted October 28, 2009 Report Share Posted October 28, 2009 I agree about the 1.6mm being un-necessary. I had a Yugo M70AB2 Folder. Between the thick receiver, RPK trunnion, and the really heavy duty folder weighed WAY more than the WASR that I had. When you carried it with a full mag, it felt like it weighed a ton. With that kind of weight, I rather have an M1a or FN FAL! 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Spartacus 1,619 Posted October 28, 2009 Report Share Posted October 28, 2009 I agree that the AK design works fine on the thin receiver, my preference is the more heavy duty parts. I don't notice that my Bulgy is much heavier than any other AK I pick up. It's a difference of ounces, not like it's pounds heavier. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
imarangemaster 315 Posted October 28, 2009 Report Share Posted October 28, 2009 If I remember right, my Yugo was over a pound heavier than the Romanian 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
shades_of_grey 1,092 Posted October 29, 2009 Report Share Posted October 29, 2009 I agree that the AK design works fine on the thin receiver, my preference is the more heavy duty parts. I don't notice that my Bulgy is much heavier than any other AK I pick up. It's a difference of ounces, not like it's pounds heavier. The increased fatigue that several additional ounces, (over a pound), induces is cumulative. Sure it may not be much more tiring to carry/fire a Yugo in a short trip to the range, (though you'll still feel it), but over time the difference becomes more and more apparent. And that's a stock Yugo. If you start strapping additional gear to it, (like a tri-rail handguard, optic, fvg), like my dad's done with his, in fairly short order it becomes a damn chore to fire it (accurately) from the standing unsupported position. If you can, the next time you go shoot, alternate between a Yugo, (or other heavy receiver, heavy RPK trunnion), and an AK with the standard 1mm receiver and AK trunnion, (like a Saiga). The very noticable and real difference might suprise you. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Spartacus 1,619 Posted October 29, 2009 Report Share Posted October 29, 2009 You boys and your flimsy receivers are gettin' all defensive. The muzzle break on the SGL-21 is much heavier than the slant break on my Bulgy, what about that? The weight issue is negligible for the unquestioned benefit of added strength. Even if it is a full pound so what?! Just take a dump before you pick up the rifle. It's simple physics guys, the thicker receiver is stronger and will flex less. This guy says it pretty well: http://www.akfiles.com/forums/showpost.php?p=393959&postcount=7 Man..... ask a simple question around here. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
into_the_knight 22 Posted October 29, 2009 Report Share Posted October 29, 2009 Isn't the Saiga receiver the heavier 1.5mm steel? So this SGL-21 will feel lighter than a similarly converted Saiga 7.62 right? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Azrial 1,091 Posted October 29, 2009 Report Share Posted October 29, 2009 Some of you guys need to start throwing up a little iron.... I am just saying. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
bigsal 757 Posted October 29, 2009 Author Report Share Posted October 29, 2009 Some of you guys need to start throwing up a little iron.... I am just saying. You don't need to be strong to operate an ak! When I think about some of the members here this picture comes to mind: 2 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
imarangemaster 315 Posted October 29, 2009 Report Share Posted October 29, 2009 Sal, Where did you get that picture of me? hahahaha 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
bigsal 757 Posted October 29, 2009 Author Report Share Posted October 29, 2009 Sal, Where did you get that picture of me? hahahaha I actually keep a file of "fat and gay cop photos" for replying to Azriel! 2 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
shades_of_grey 1,092 Posted October 30, 2009 Report Share Posted October 30, 2009 Sal, Where did you get that picture of me? hahahaha I actually keep a file of "fat and gay cop photos" for replying to Azriel! Can't ya just feel the love? I "throw up a little iron" every day, Azrial. That's not it. I just believe in using as light a design as possible. 1mm receivers and AK, (rather than RPK), trunnions get the job done and are the current Russian mil standard. 1.6mm receivers and RPK receivers are just plain unnecessary and will fatigue anyone more quickly, leading to decreased accuracy with the rifle. It's that simple. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
shades_of_grey 1,092 Posted October 30, 2009 Report Share Posted October 30, 2009 (edited) You boys and your flimsy receivers are gettin' all defensive. The muzzle break on the SGL-21 is much heavier than the slant break on my Bulgy, what about that? The weight issue is negligible for the unquestioned benefit of added strength. Even if it is a full pound so what?! Just take a dump before you pick up the rifle. It's simple physics guys, the thicker receiver is stronger and will flex less. This guy says it pretty well: http://www.akfiles.com/forums/showpost.php?p=393959&postcount=7 Man..... ask a simple question around here. That linked post makes a few interesting points. I think the benefits of the 1.6mm design and the "twisting", (and supposed decline in accuracy), of the 1mm receiver design are exaggerated, though. I can see the advantage of the 1.6mm receiver in sustained full-auto fire, (the reason it is used in true AK machine guns, like the RPK), but our rifles here are all semi-auto, right? Regardless, even this post admits that the 1mm receiver design is more than solid enough to perform well with the X and Y stamps around the fcg pins. Also, if the 1.6mm receiver is so advantageous, why does the Russian military currently use 1mm receivers for their AK's? Is it all about saving money? I'm not trying to be a smartass here, this is an honest question. Edited October 30, 2009 by post-apocalyptic 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
shades_of_grey 1,092 Posted October 30, 2009 Report Share Posted October 30, 2009 Oh, and both K-Var and Atlantic Firearms are now selling the Arsenal SGL-21 for these crazy-low prices, (~$500). I ordered a plum Warsaw stock model from K-Var yesterday. She'll arrive at my FFL on the 2nd. I can't fuckin wait. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Spartacus 1,619 Posted October 30, 2009 Report Share Posted October 30, 2009 (edited) That linked post makes a few interesting points. I think the benefits of the 1.6mm design and the "twisting", (and supposed decline in accuracy), of the 1mm receiver design are exaggerated, though. I can see the advantage of the 1.6mm receiver in sustained full-auto fire, (the reason it is used in true AK machine guns, like the RPK), but our rifles here are all semi-auto, right? Regardless, even this post admits that the 1mm receiver design is more than solid enough to perform well with the X and Y stamps around the fcg pins. Also, if the 1.6mm receiver is so advantageous, why does the Russian military currently use 1mm receivers for their AK's? Is it all about saving money? I'm not trying to be a smartass here, this is an honest question. I imagine the thinner receivers are cheaper, but they are also easier to bend and work with. There is a cost savings in the manufacturing process as well as the materials. When it comes down to it, you are right.... the thinner receiver makes for a perfectly serviceable rifle. With all of our back & forth on this, I doubt I will ever be in a situation where I'm wishing my rifle was a pound lighter. And I doubt you will ever be in a situation where you're wishing your rifle was just a hair more accurate. My Dad was a mechanical engineer, so when I'm given the choice, I will always take the heavy duty part. In this case, it really makes no difference either way. Edit: Enjoy your new rifle..... and don't go giving this one to the cops! Edited October 30, 2009 by Spartacus Quote Link to post Share on other sites
m51 0 Posted October 30, 2009 Report Share Posted October 30, 2009 Oh, and both K-Var and Atlantic Firearms are now selling the Arsenal SGL-21 for these crazy-low prices, (~$500). I ordered a plum Warsaw stock model from K-Var yesterday. She'll arrive at my FFL on the 2nd. I can't fuckin wait. You did well,, talked to K-Var yesterday and they told me this pricing on SGL21's will last about 2 more weeks. As soon as their supply is gone the prices are going back up. It's kind of a AK stimulus package by them. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
jbrubaker 13 Posted October 30, 2009 Report Share Posted October 30, 2009 I noticed that on the Arsenal, Inc. page it lists the MSRP for the SGL21 as $499-505. Has it always been that and the distributors were just charging more due to supply/demand? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
GerryV 14 Posted October 30, 2009 Report Share Posted October 30, 2009 I noticed that on the Arsenal, Inc. page it lists the MSRP for the SGL21 as $499-505. Has it always been that and the distributors were just charging more due to supply/demand? No K-var just dropped the price last week. Not sure if they did anything for distributors who purchased before the price drop as I'm sure this sale price is below what they paid a few months ago when K-var was selling the SGL's for $700 plus. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
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