A Serious Question For Gun Owner Christians

[BpS12 512]

What will you do when / if America's Economic system collapses and there are bands of hungry people roaming about ready to take what you have prepared for such a time? What if the bank runs started tomorrow? And runs on food stores started the next day? What comes after all the food and cash is gone? How long? What would you do?

 

 

I will probably consider people who espouse end of days eagerness and other extreme religious beliefs as dangerous and take guard against them.

 

How does it go? Fundamentalism and literalism go hand in hand? I won't give such nonsense an inch if there's no law to protect me from it.

 

Please take the fundy religion to the political section.

 

 

Yes indeed,

I honestly think we should all take guard against all fanaticism. Wether it be religion based or otherwise. This kind of shit gets innocent people killed and hurts countless others. Radical islam, extreme versions of chrisianity, or any type of comunist like absolutism, needs to be crushed like a fuckin bug, in order to keep a free american way of life. This is why we need to be carefull who is elected to office. Just one person in an influential position can infect litetally millions of nonthinkers with his own self / cause motivated agenda, just because some people need something to believe in, no matter how harmful or implausable.

 

Thank goodness we do live in the USA, and we can vote, and have rights that come from the original framework that started this country. Alot of third world countries only go by the mantra of its current ruler, and thats what makes them so unstable. The usa has alot of good folk that live here, that will defend it and its principles. And thats why Im so happy to have been born here. Even though we have irresponsible people leading us for the moment, we can change that, some others dont have that luxury.

 

Yes indeed, it's easy to forget that Hitler was elected. And he played ALL sides of the card(espousing Christianity while usurping Heathen symbology and "utilyzing" Jewish and Islamic knowledge/labor) while imprisoning/slaughtering those that didn't go along with/fit into his "dream". Hmm, can we see the early parallels?

 

For me, its often not the one in office that I worry about but what use the next one will make of his predecessors questiona le/ wrongfull actions. Each builds on the wrongs of the one before, regardless of party or religion.

[chevyman097 2,579]

Meh whats the use. Not like the OP is going to participate in this forum anyways. He is just using S12 to get clicks on his blog. Nothing new. Carry on.

 

 

NOT anymore....

 

 

 

LMAO! well played.

[daughertym 15]

I don't really care what anyone worships... In hard times, if you respect my property, my life, and are willing to be honest in dealing, I'll count you as a friend. Those "Old Fashioned" values are most often found in households that are "traditional/conservative" enough to also be religious. However, I'm quite certain there are a large number of men in prison, and in every riot from Watts to LA '92, to the animals in Philly and Wisconsin, who also come from religious households/families.... but not "traditional/conservative" ones where pride was taught and others were to be respected.

 

Religion is one symptom of a strong upbringing, not really the cause, or even the leading indicator. IMHO

 

 

I'll stand by your side as long as you are a lover of Liberty... Mormon, Catholic, Amish, Muslim, Baptist or otherwise. Cheers!

 

 

Words of wisdom and tolerance to live by.

Edited August 21, 2011 by BigD45

[ItsAllCreated 59]

Speaking in terms only of good hardheartedness (not of religion or faith)

 

 

 

 

 

The way I see it.....

 

You can only give others what you are & have to give.

 

If you want to be the best help you can be, then you have to be the best you can be.

If you allow yourself to be run-down by others ill choices and actions... then you can only give run-down help.

Maybe you care for something so much... that you would allow yourself to be abused by it, rather than defend yourself & cause more destruction upon it.

 

How much help can your abused-self give to others?

 

If your aim is to help others in getting through a dangerous world... then you must 1st be here to help.

Then 2ndly... If you want to be the most helpful you can be, you've got to do the best you can for yourself, so that you can give your best to others. (otherwise you won't be at your best, and won't be able to give your best).

 

Its one thing to love unconditionally, and another to allow yourself to be taken advantage of, &/or be abused.

Aim to give unconditional love to the people around you... [those that need help, even the ones who do the most damage to our world (external & internal)] ...but at the same time be certain to identify situation that you must protect yourself from.

Thats a very important balance that must be maintained

 

For example....

You can't go into a pack of hungry wolves and think you'll be nice to them, so they won't tear you up and eat you.

You can aim to understand the roles that the wolves play in this world, & You can aim to appreciate them for that role, but still know that it would be very dangerous to get involved with them.

If the wolves came to you... you'd be forced into making a choice. You know that if you attempt to be nice... its going to cost you (maybe you & your family life?). & Also know that if you forcibly protect yourself from them, you'd be destroying something that you can understandably appreciate. You can't blame a hungry pack of wolves for doing what they do... but also you can't allow yourself to be a victim either (you can't take blame for protecting yourself).

So you protect yourself and your surroundings, while still being able to hold appreciation for the wolf & its role in our world.

 

In times of great hardship... I bet some of the nicest people would be so desperate that they'd do things they'd never thought they'd do.

In such desperate times, You can't blame them for attempting to hold onto their life with everything they've got (they could have starving kids to feed).

But still... you've got to know when you need to protect yourself.

Its possible to still love and appreciate someone (or lots of people), while having to simultaneously protect yourself against them.

 

It would be absolutely heart breaking to have to physically defend yourself against someone you appreciate... but the choices are to allow yourself to be taken under by their ill-actions, or to protect yourself against others ill-actions.

And again.... even if you have to physically protect yourself against others ill-choices/actions... you can aim to understand their situation (forgive them for their desperation) and appreciate what they have inside of them (something I believe never goes away)

 

If your aim is to help others in getting through a dangerous world... then you must 1st be here to help.

You needn't feel bad about protecting yourself in a dangerous world. You can feel bad about the situation people are in (the situation that drives them to do horrible things). You can care about them and honor them even though they are in those bad situations. But you need to care enough about yourself that will choose to protect yourself so that you can go onto to be a good service for those who could honorably use your help.

 

 

 

 

 

So thats how I see it.

I would certainly hate to ever have to forcibly defend myself against anyone (cause I truly aim to find understanding and appreciation in all walks of life).

But at the same time I choose not to become a victim of our worlds bad circumstances.

I certainly do not want to make choices that will continue the circumstances that we find ourselves in either (we gotta stop the cycle of BS to get out of it).

I'd like to help take us towards a new direction, but I gotta 1st be here to do that. So I gotta protect myself.

Protecting myself from others bad choices in a dangous world just isnt something I want to feel bad about

[magsite20 1,664]

Sadly I'm going to guess that my actions would not be in line with the teachings of Christ.

If I have it I'm going to try to keep it.

If someone else has something I believe I need bad enough I very well may try to take it.

(If it's worth dying for, it very well be worth killing for) not a pretty thought

 

While I believe that in the end I will have to answer for all my actions,

the fear of God will come after the fear of whatever is going on at the moment that has me with a gun in hand.

Edited August 24, 2011 by 20-Mags

[Mr Mivet 6]

After spending time in a Christian based faith, where I found problems with things like it being illegal to wrap my pee pee in rubber to prevent babies, or that you had to confess your sins to another human, so that god can forgive you, and he dictated the punishment you had to endure, uh uh, buh bye.

 

So, with that mind set, it becomes very easy to not sweat the decision when the time comes, even though I was raised with Christian teachings.

 

There are good things from Christianity, love your neighbor, help people out, do to others as you would have them do to you, I have found those same sentiments, especially in Judaism, but they exist in other religions as well, and I think I live life in a good manner, and that if there is heaven, my goods balance the bad, and I am not even sweating jerking off about a million times so far, as I don't really think a loving god would give a shit.

 

But, as with Islam, I see the perversion of religion, which scares me, as it does when I see Christians doing the same thing, for their own benefit, from the Mega Churches that rake in the dollars, and telling someone that its spiritually correct to send them money, is as evil as is telling someone that as a good muslim its OK to blindly kill people for your 72 virgins in heaven.

 

IE, basically while I support the use of some Christian values, organized religion scares me when used as a weapon, so, I keep my powder dry, and am not sweating expending it if shit hits the fan and I have to protect myself, or my family, or to defend what is mine/ours.

Edited August 24, 2011 by Mr Mivet

[BpS12 512]

After spending time in a Christian based faith, where I found problems with things like it being illegal to wrap my pee pee in rubber to prevent babies, or that you had to confess your sins to another human, so that god can forgive you, and he dictated the punishment you had to endure, uh uh, buh bye.

 

So, with that mind set, it becomes very easy to not sweat the decision when the time comes, even though I was raised with Christian teachings.

 

There are good things from Christianity, love your neighbor, help people out, do to others as you would have them do to you, I have found those same sentiments, especially in Judaism, but they exist in other religions as well, and I think I live life in a good manner, and that if there is heaven, my goods balance the bad, and I am not even sweating jerking off about a million times so far, as I don't really think a loving god would give a shit.

 

But, as with Islam, I see the perversion of religion, which scares me, as it does when I see Christians doing the same thing, for their own benefit, from the Mega Churches that rake in the dollars, and telling someone that its spiritually correct to send them money, is as evil as is telling someone that as a good muslim its OK to blindly kill people for your 72 virgins in heaven.

 

IE, basically while I support the use of some Christian values, organized religion scares me when used as a weapon, so, I keep my powder dry, and am not sweating expending it if shit hits the fan and I have to protect myself, or my family, or to defend what is mine/ours.

 

 

Well said, and please note the first quote in my sig line.

[Spartacus 1,619]

Sadly I'm going to guess that my actions would not be in line with the teachings of Christ.

If I have it I'm going to try to keep it.

If someone else has something I believe I need bad enough I very well may try to take it.

(If it's worth dying for, it very well be worth killing for) not a pretty thought

 

While I believe that in the end I will have to answer for all my actions,

the fear of God will come after the fear of whatever is going on at the moment that has me with a gun in hand.

 

 

Residents of Destin, Florida beware!

[magsite20 1,664]

[Joseph 141]

Well anyone who remembers the old testament knows that God certifiably doesn't have any qualms about having his followers kick some major ass when need be, of course senseless killing is very wrong anyone who goes and kills an innocent man/woman or little kid or like kind is demented and worthy of punishment, But self defense or fighting a war for a just and needful cause was never scorned in the bible, at least not in my mind. It only talked about how God Hates those who shed innocent blood, if someones trying to kill you, they are no longer innocent. and or, if someone did something bad enough for you to go to war with them they are no longer innocent.

 

Next topic, A Serious Gun Owner For Questioning Christians

Edited August 26, 2011 by Joebanks

[uzitiger 193]

Ok, sorry, I'm not Christian, failed miserably even when trying to be, but that one little commandment always seems to be a sticking point. Silly really. It says "Thou shalt not kill(ei murder)" iirc, NOT "Thou shalt not defend yourself, family, property or an innocent". Seems to me, those that use it as a stopper, are just trying to wimp out on their OBLIGATION to do the above. Like "If God says I can't, then I don't even have to try."

 

Honestly, if you have to ask, you likely wont make it anyway. But good luck and keep your head down.

 

The original Hebrew bible the Torah says: "Do not murder" not kill. This has been mistranslated and the Jewish response is "he who rises to kill you, kill him first". Protecting ones life and family are the prime obligation.

 

BpS12 wrote that Hitler utilized Muslims but the Muslims were glad to join the Nazis. Former Egyptian dictator Anwar Sadat was jailed by the British for being a Nazi and in Iraq the British took over the country form the pro Nazi Rashid Ali. The Arab went out of their way to aid the Nazis as did the Iranians. The US deposed the Shah's pro Nazi father and made him shah since he was sympathetic to the Allies in WWII. The Bosnians formed an SS division to help Hitler murder Jews.

Edited August 27, 2011 by uzitiger

[BpS12 512]

Ok, sorry, I'm not Christian, failed miserably even when trying to be, but that one little commandment always seems to be a sticking point. Silly really. It says "Thou shalt not kill(ei murder)" iirc, NOT "Thou shalt not defend yourself, family, property or an innocent". Seems to me, those that use it as a stopper, are just trying to wimp out on their OBLIGATION to do the above. Like "If God says I can't, then I don't even have to try."

 

Honestly, if you have to ask, you likely wont make it anyway. But good luck and keep your head down.

 

The original Hebrew bible the Torah says: "Do not murder" not kill. This has been mistranslated and the Jewish response is "he who rises to kill you, kill him first". Protecting ones life and family are the prime obligation.

 

BpS12 wrote that Hitler utilized Muslims but the Muslims were glad to join the Nazis. Former Egyptian dictator Anwar Sadat was jailed by the British for being a Nazi and in Iraq the British took over the country form the pro Nazi Rashid Ali. The Arab went out of their way to aid the Nazis as did the Iranians. The US deposed the Shah's pro Nazi father and made him shah since he was sympathetic to the Allies in WWII. The Bosnians formed an SS division to help Hitler murder Jews.

 

The Torah mistranslated into the Bible, naw, never happened.

 

The Heathen Faith is much the same, for us, murder can get you bankrupt(Weregild/Deathprice), banished or killed in retaliation (lawfully by the victims family/friends) as punishments.

 

You're absolutely right UT, sorry I didn't go into detail about the "utilizetion of knowledge and labor" for either the Jews or the Muslims. I thought it was general knowledge. Perhaps not?

Edited August 28, 2011 by BpS12