Kalifornia Newbie 0 Posted March 15, 2004 Report Share Posted March 15, 2004 Hi folks, My understanding from reading here for a little while is that the Peoples Republic of Kalifornia (hence forth PRK) will not allow shotguns with detachable mags. I am sure I could figure a way to make the mag non-removable, but I don't know if the gun could be loaded. So my question is - With the bolt held open, can you load shells into the mag? If so, would a fixed 8-round mag be legal in the PRK? Thanks, K. N. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
chips 0 Posted March 15, 2004 Report Share Posted March 15, 2004 if your willing to go through the hassle, you should be able to take off the bottom of the mag and put shells in through the bottom Quote Link to post Share on other sites
JesusCow 1 Posted March 15, 2004 Report Share Posted March 15, 2004 or possibly field stripping it to load the mag. hmm, then you could put a pg on it ... Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Kalifornia Newbie 0 Posted March 16, 2004 Author Report Share Posted March 16, 2004 Hmmm... That doesn't sound very fun. I see to dimly recall a rifle that you could reload when the bolt was open by simply feeding shells down through the receiver. But now that I try to remember exactly where I saw that, I can't. I wonder if you could lop the bottom off a mag, drop in the shells, and the put the bottom of the mag (with the spring) back in place. Nah, too much work. Well, it was a thought. Thanks for the input. K. N. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
hartzpad 0 Posted March 16, 2004 Report Share Posted March 16, 2004 actually, in California you can have a detachable magazine on a pump action shotgun, but not a semi-auto. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Bvamp 604 Posted March 16, 2004 Report Share Posted March 16, 2004 (edited) Kalifornia Newbie: there are many guns that take stripper clips into the magazine well like you described. M1 garands, mausers, many hunting rifles. Basically anything with whats called a floorplate will load in that manner. Most if not all should also be legal in Cali. As for loading shells into a magazine THEN putting a spring in it and putting it back together, uh, I would think you would have to be Hercules in the hands to do that. Have you considered or looked into a Saiga 410? .410 is a caliber, making it a rifle-classed weapon. You might be able to own one of those in Cali. Edited March 16, 2004 by Bvamp Quote Link to post Share on other sites
KySoldier 2 Posted March 17, 2004 Report Share Posted March 17, 2004 You have to remember though, welding the 8rd detachable mag might be Califonia friendly for you, but it would then mean that you have a shotgun with "a fixed magazine capacity in excess of 5 rounds." ...which is illegal post '94. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
rock47 1 Posted March 18, 2004 Report Share Posted March 18, 2004 BUY A BENELLI Quote Link to post Share on other sites
LargePrime 0 Posted March 18, 2004 Report Share Posted March 18, 2004 How about convert it to use a tube? No limit on tubes. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
JesusCow 1 Posted March 18, 2004 Report Share Posted March 18, 2004 How about convert it to use a tube? No limit on tubes. this can be argued to the end of time but i've specifically read "a fixed magazine with a capacity in excess of 5 rounds" as an evil feature making an assault shotgun Quote Link to post Share on other sites
LargePrime 0 Posted March 18, 2004 Report Share Posted March 18, 2004 (edited) specificaly exempted is tube fed guns of all types. You can go today and by a 10 round .22 if it's tube fed. Edited March 18, 2004 by LargePrime Quote Link to post Share on other sites
KySoldier 2 Posted March 18, 2004 Report Share Posted March 18, 2004 The fixed magazine capacity he was refering to was about shotgun's evil features, not rifles. But it is true, rifles like those that take over ten rounds in a tube are not banned by the '94 ban. Oh, about the Benelli, there must be preban and postban benellis out there since you can't have one anymore with the standard semi-auto 9 shot fixed magazine. But I haven't seen one in years. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
LargePrime 0 Posted March 19, 2004 Report Share Posted March 19, 2004 So can we put a tube on a saiga? Cant be that hard right? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Bvamp 604 Posted March 20, 2004 Report Share Posted March 20, 2004 You cannot have a tube-fed shotgun that holds more than 5 rounds. Pump, semi, anything. A .410 saiga you could, and can even get 10 round mags for it. The tube in excess of 5 rounds is a rifle-specific law. If you all start yellin, I might go back to where I was looking for the stupid Importation laws and post it, but Im askin ya'll to just friggin believe me for once instead of making me stress hardcore with the ATF site. I just dont feel like it today. Besides the federal laws covering guns like that one, there are MANY more laws in cali that you really have to worry about. You should go print the state specific laws and read em. At least there is something FAIRLY cut and dry you can get like that for the state level. These cryptic federal legislation bullshits that I repeatedly find myself sifting through endlessly for a bullshit question really irritate me. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
KySoldier 2 Posted March 22, 2004 Report Share Posted March 22, 2004 I understand your frustrations with the ATF website, you have to be in the right mood to feel like sifting through it...but I KEEP POSTING THIS.... Word for word, here it is again... "A semiautomatic shotgun that has at least 2 of-- (1) A folding or telescoping stock, (2) A pistol grip that protrudes conspicuously beneath the action of the weapon, (3) A fixed magazine capacity in excess of 5 rounds, and (4) An ability to accept a detachable magazine" A tube on a saiga-12 in excess of 5 rounds....no no. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Lagomorph 0 Posted March 22, 2004 Report Share Posted March 22, 2004 Are ya'll forgetting you can have ONE feature. If you want a fixed 8rd magazine its ok, but no pistolgrip. Same goes for the tube. Ive seen plenty of Benellies with 6-9rd tube mag extensions without the pistol grip. They are perfectly legal. Also Bvamp, I've competed in plenty of 3 gun matches with my 870 with a 7rd tube mag. Some competitors have retarded looking shotguns that have 20" barrels and 7shot extentions (total of 10-11rds). Once again people read the laws, there is a difference between knowing the rules and understanding them! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
KySoldier 2 Posted March 22, 2004 Report Share Posted March 22, 2004 Good point. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Bvamp 604 Posted March 22, 2004 Report Share Posted March 22, 2004 If your pump comes with a mag plug in it, you CANNOT remove it. Hence My confusion here. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
shotgun_lobotomy 0 Posted March 23, 2004 Report Share Posted March 23, 2004 bvamp ur wrong i beleive cause ur allowed 5 rounds in ur gun, the plug is just there for hunting reasons, 3 rounds in ur gun, no more, if ur gun isnt plugged in the feild ur breaking the law but at home, no worries Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Bvamp 604 Posted March 23, 2004 Report Share Posted March 23, 2004 No. Look, I didnt make this up....if you buy new gun...mag plug in the tube...if you TAKE IT OUT...you just broke the gun's manufactured state... or whatever the WORD is. That makes it an illegally manufactured weapon first. second it can bring you into the AWB laws. F THAT bro. You cant "deface a magazine". You cant alter parts to a magazine causing increaded capacity...Im sorry. you wanna test it, GO ahead, Im not. the plugs arent installed just for the game laws btw...........they just dont change tooling because of the AWB. thats all they are doing with the plug. preventing tooling/stock changes as far as I know......????????!!!!!!!!!???????? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
bone 0 Posted March 23, 2004 Report Share Posted March 23, 2004 my pump came with a mag plug init i assumed it was so that i could use it for waterfowl, were only allowed 3 rounds during wf season, but during deer season were allowed 5 so i take the plug out Quote Link to post Share on other sites
KySoldier 2 Posted March 23, 2004 Report Share Posted March 23, 2004 Yeah really, a plug in a pump shotgun is just to give you that option of hunting. There is no legal limit on their capacity. Saying you can't remove the plug is like saying you can't change chokes. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Bvamp 604 Posted March 23, 2004 Report Share Posted March 23, 2004 Allow me to clarify: I will leave the gun type out but I will say its one of the mossberg pump types. I can put 7 rounds in the tube mag without the plug, only 5 with the plug. I cannot remove the plug to bring my total mag cap over 5 rounds. The gun came NEW like that. dont ask me. I also cant put a mag extension on it. I think you guys are seeing these dudes out on the range with the huge tube mags because they either are so well known that noone dares say anything to them, or more likely, they are preban 12's. I saw a preban pump 12 with a 10 shot tube on it recently for sale. They can be had fairly cheap still. specificaly exempted is tube fed guns of all types. You can go today and by a 10 round .22 if it's tube fed. ONLY .22 rimfire is permitted to exceed 10 rounds in tube fed configurations. Marlin's rimfires take 17 in the tube for instance. If you go look at the new centerfire lever action Winchesters however, you wont find more than ten rounds in them. I havent checked a pistol cartridge chambering yet, but I think I will ask next time I am at the shop about one. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
KySoldier 2 Posted March 24, 2004 Report Share Posted March 24, 2004 ...I cannot remove the plug to bring my total mag cap over 5 rounds...I also cant put a mag extension on it... You can't do it because you think it is illegal or because it is physically impossible? It isn't illegal, I don't understand why you think different. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
shotgun_lobotomy 0 Posted March 24, 2004 Report Share Posted March 24, 2004 my henry 17 holds 12+1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Bvamp 604 Posted March 24, 2004 Report Share Posted March 24, 2004 I cant because its a post-ban shotgun. Removing the plug and bringing my magazine cap to 7 rounds would make it a non-removeable magazine in excess of 5 rounds. postban shotguns == 5 rounds period. Prebans I can take the plug out of. There is a special plug i would have to go buy to make this particular shotgun legal to hunt with that i would have to swap with the factory plug. It was something about the factory used up its current stock when the ban kicked in, and decided to just plug up the extended tube mag on it instead of scrapping or re tooling the current stock they had for parts to save some cash. Ok, not ONLY 22 rimfire. Rimfire period, the 17 rimfire came out after the laws were written, and apparantly has been classified into the same category as 22LR and 22mag. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
KySoldier 2 Posted March 24, 2004 Report Share Posted March 24, 2004 I see what you're saying, but if you are talking about a pump shotgun, the law up there I posted doesn't apply, it is only talkin about semi. I'm tellin ya, you can do anything you want to a pump...why do you think people have folding stocks for sale everywhere and the new Mossberg 590 has a bayonet lug, it's because they can! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Bvamp 604 Posted March 25, 2004 Report Share Posted March 25, 2004 Im gonna have to go back to the ATF site and dig it up. There is a section under the high capacity magazine law defining any fixed tubular mag with exception to .22 rimfire. Maybe it was just for semi auto, but I was under the impression it said ANY shotgun fixed magazine. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
KySoldier 2 Posted March 25, 2004 Report Share Posted March 25, 2004 I'm sure about the shotgun law, but have no idea about the rifles you all talk about, by friend has a few in .22 (both Marlin and Ruger) but I never looked it up. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Bvamp 604 Posted March 25, 2004 Report Share Posted March 25, 2004 .22 rimfire is exempt from tubular magazine limits, but not clip limits of ten rounds in semi automatics. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
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