need 1 cheap compliance part

[rightwingnut 0]

So I was going to put the tapco M4 stock on one of my S12s. Mine has threaded muzzle w/ thread protector. That stock may be two parts, but I only counts as one b/c the gun didn't come w/ a pistol grip. That & the magazine leaves me at 11 non-US listed parts, according to the automated compliance work sheet.

 

What is the one other easiest/cheapest part to get for the gun to make it 922 compliant?

[TonyRumore 1,332]

A gas piston is cheap and just drops in.

 

Tony

[rightwingnut 0]

A gas piston is cheap and just drops in.

 

Tony

 

Thanks Tony

 

Where can I get the piston?

 

Wouldn't a muzzle brake be acceptable too?

 

Also, is it true that the 922 is NOT subject to constructive possession like the NFA? So, if I have a barely compliant rifle, can I keep the russian mag around as long as I don't put it in the gun?

[ck43001 12]

A gas piston is cheap and just drops in.

 

Tony

 

Thanks Tony

 

Where can I get the piston?

 

 

I think Chaos makes a piston. Gunfixr might as well. I think they're all selling them for around $25.

 

edit: Sorry, I just checked Cameron's forum and his piston is $34.

 

Craig

[vbrtrmn 167]

Also, is it true that the 922 is NOT subject to constructive possession like the NFA? So, if I have a barely compliant rifle, can I keep the russian mag around as long as I don't put it in the gun?

Constructive possession is just that, law enforcement constructs .. or makes up .. some way to enforce a bad law. It is unlikely that if you are a law abiding citizen you will ever be bothered by law enforcement about a 922r violation, nor constructive possession. Though it is ALWAYS better to be on the safe side, you shouldn't have a "barely" compliant rifle. If you happen to have a fully compliant rifle and a Russian magazine sitting around which would make your rifle non-compliant, that's where constructive possession comes in. By having the magazine they could potentially charge you, because you could potentially use it... or maybe nothing will happen, who knows. Personally, I wouldn't have a barely compliant rifle, because I don't want to risk spending months in court and thousands of dollars on a lawyer.

 

I'm not sure what the penalties for a 922r violation, but I fear it may be Federal Rape-You-in-the-Ass Prison, which I'm sure everyone (hopefully) wants to avoid.

[gozuki 3]

Also, is it true that the 922 is NOT subject to constructive possession like the NFA? So, if I have a barely compliant rifle, can I keep the russian mag around as long as I don't put it in the gun?

Constructive possession is just that, law enforcement constructs .. or makes up .. some way to enforce a bad law. It is unlikely that if you are a law abiding citizen you will ever be bothered by law enforcement about a 922r violation, nor constructive possession. Though it is ALWAYS better to be on the safe side, you shouldn't have a "barely" compliant rifle. If you happen to have a fully compliant rifle and a Russian magazine sitting around which would make your rifle non-compliant, that's where constructive possession comes in. By having the magazine they could potentially charge you, because you could potentially use it... or maybe nothing will happen, who knows. Personally, I wouldn't have a barely compliant rifle, because I don't want to risk spending months in court and thousands of dollars on a lawyer.

 

I'm not sure what the penalties for a 922r violation, but I fear it may be Federal Rape-You-in-the-Ass Prison, which I'm sure everyone (hopefully) wants to avoid.

FCG/gas piston/muzzle device/handguard/buttstock they are all around $30-50 bucks. Or cut 1" (and the threads) off your barrel for free. Stay over 18" bbl length though...

[btr 15]

Dinzagarms arms has thread protectors for 30 dollars:

 

http://www.dinzagarms.com/brakes_hiders/tp.html

 

I think they are US made, you might want to check

[mechsterbator 0]

Also, is it true that the 922 is NOT subject to constructive possession like the NFA? So, if I have a barely compliant rifle, can I keep the russian mag around as long as I don't put it in the gun?

Constructive possession is just that, law enforcement constructs .. or makes up .. some way to enforce a bad law. It is unlikely that if you are a law abiding citizen you will ever be bothered by law enforcement about a 922r violation, nor constructive possession. Though it is ALWAYS better to be on the safe side, you shouldn't have a "barely" compliant rifle. If you happen to have a fully compliant rifle and a Russian magazine sitting around which would make your rifle non-compliant, that's where constructive possession comes in. By having the magazine they could potentially charge you, because you could potentially use it... or maybe nothing will happen, who knows. Personally, I wouldn't have a barely compliant rifle, because I don't want to risk spending months in court and thousands of dollars on a lawyer.

 

I'm not sure what the penalties for a 922r violation, but I fear it may be Federal Rape-You-in-the-Ass Prison, which I'm sure everyone (hopefully) wants to avoid.

 

 

with that sort of mentality, it's "constructive possession" just by keeping all of your old pre-conversion parts around, as your factory parts might be swapped back in to upset the balance.

 

it's all a load of crap no matter how you slice it, but you might as well follow the law and have as many parts as you need on hand to be fully compliant at any given time.

[super jim 14]

Please educate me on the compliance issue. Is the S-12 with 19" barrel legal as it is imported? Mine has been converted with stock, pistol grip and forearm all with USA stamping.

[vbrtrmn 167]

Please educate me on the compliance issue. Is the S-12 with 19" barrel legal as it is imported? Mine has been converted with stock, pistol grip and forearm all with USA stamping.

 

I'm not going to go into any details, there's a whole forum section about it, go educate yourself.

http://forum.saiga-12.com/index.php?showforum=65

Edited January 21, 2009 by vbrtrmn

[super jim 14]

OK, thanks for the link. That helps. So please let me know if you this is correct:

Saiga-12, 19" barrel threaded on the end with a thread protector.

 

Replace thread protector with Poly Choke.............less one import + 1 U.S. part

Replace butt stock with Tapco T-6........................less one import + 1 U.S. part

Added U.S. pistol grip.....does nothing good or bad

Replaced forearm with U.S. made one.................less one import + 1 U.S. part

Installed Krebs sights........does nothing

 

So I have replaced 3 import parts with 3 U.S. made parts.

That makes it one part short for complicance, correct?

 

I also have a Surefire 12 rd mag.....not sure if that helps or not?

 

Jim

Edited January 22, 2009 by super jim

[hobbyshooter 59]

OK, thanks for the link. That helps. So please let me know if you this is correct:

Saiga-12, 19" barrel threaded on the end with a thread protector.

 

Replace thread protector with Poly Choke.............less one import + 1 U.S. part

Replace butt stock with Tapco T-6........................less one import + 1 U.S. part

Added U.S. pistol grip.....does nothing good or bad

Replaced forearm with U.S. made one.................less one import + 1 U.S. part

Installed Krebs sights........does nothing

 

So I have replaced 3 import parts with 3 U.S. made parts.

That makes it one part short for complicance, correct?

 

I also have a Surefire 12 rd mag.....not sure if that helps or not?

 

Jim

 

You didn't count the 3 parts in the Fire Control Group? (trigger, hammer, disconnector/sear)

[super jim 14]

OK, thanks for the link. That helps. So please let me know if you this is correct:

Saiga-12, 19" barrel threaded on the end with a thread protector.

 

Replace thread protector with Poly Choke.............less one import + 1 U.S. part

Replace butt stock with Tapco T-6........................less one import + 1 U.S. part

Added U.S. pistol grip.....does nothing good or bad

Replaced forearm with U.S. made one.................less one import + 1 U.S. part

Installed Krebs sights........does nothing

 

So I have replaced 3 import parts with 3 U.S. made parts.

That makes it one part short for complicance, correct?

 

I also have a Surefire 12 rd mag.....not sure if that helps or not?

 

Jim

 

You didn't count the 3 parts in the Fire Control Group? (trigger, hammer, disconnector/sear)

 

That confuses me even more. I can only have 10 import parts that count. I had 14 originally. I replace 3 of them with US parts. I did not change anything in the FCG. So don't I have 11 import parts that count? I have the gas piston on order so that would make 10, the perfect number, right?

[hobbyshooter 59]

You didn't count the 3 parts in the Fire Control Group? (trigger, hammer, disconnector/sear)

 

That confuses me even more. I can only have 10 import parts that count. I had 14 originally. I replace 3 of them with US parts. I did not change anything in the FCG. So don't I have 11 import parts that count? I have the gas piston on order so that would make 10, the perfect number, right?

 

If you put a pistol grip on you have to relocate the trigger to the forward location. The factory sporter config trigger assembly is crap, and doesn't work up there so it's easier to just buy a Tapco AK FCG that is designed to fit into that location. AND it counts as 3 parts.

 

You did mention getting a pistol grip, so I imagine you are talking about doing the conversion right?

[Surly 11]

It doesn't sound like a fricked up conversion...you should be golden, as the grip is a US part.

[kmoore 3]

I don't think of it as replacing parts or whatever. I think it's just easier to go thru the list and count what remains that is foriegn made. That's what the feds would do

 

It's the same thing when it's all said and done, but it helps avoid the confusion re: pistol grip and the count.

 

BTW, am I the only one that doesn't believe a thread protector counts as a muzzle device? My bbl isn't threaded, so I haven't really followed it, but we never talked about protectors in the old days when the ban was ending ... you know, back in the dinosaurs time.

[7.62x39 0]

You didn't count the 3 parts in the Fire Control Group? (trigger, hammer, disconnector/sear)

 

That confuses me even more. I can only have 10 import parts that count. I had 14 originally. I replace 3 of them with US parts. I did not change anything in the FCG. So don't I have 11 import parts that count? I have the gas piston on order so that would make 10, the perfect number, right?

 

If you put a pistol grip on you have to relocate the trigger to the forward location. The factory sporter config trigger assembly is crap, and doesn't work up there so it's easier to just buy a Tapco AK FCG that is designed to fit into that location. AND it counts as 3 parts.

 

You did mention getting a pistol grip, so I imagine you are talking about doing the conversion right?

 

He doesn't have a converted shotty. He mentioned that He's using one of those crapco T-6 stock/PG things. He still has the imported FCG

[hobbyshooter 59]

He doesn't have a converted shotty. He mentioned that He's using one of those crapco T-6 stock/PG things. He still has the imported FCG

 

Ah. I didn't see anything mentioned about the "intrafuse saiga T-6 collapsing stock". Just mentioned that the pistol grip doesn't remove an imported part, and he's using a "T6" stock.

[super jim 14]

He doesn't have a converted shotty. He mentioned that He's using one of those crapco T-6 stock/PG things. He still has the imported FCG

 

Ah. I didn't see anything mentioned about the "intrafuse saiga T-6 collapsing stock". Just mentioned that the pistol grip doesn't remove an imported part, and he's using a "T6" stock.

 

Correct, I purchased the gun with the Topco stock and pistol grip installed. So I assume I still have the factory FCG. Correct? But if I install the US made gas piston I will be good, correct?

[7.62x39 0]

Yes, Add the US piston to your US made MD, stock, PG and forearm and you're good to go.

[hobbyshooter 59]

Is your T6 stock like this?

Or is the stock and pistol grip 2 separate pieces that attach to the receiver (Pistol grip attaching to the bottom of the receiver, stock inserts in the rear of the receiver)?

[super jim 14]

Is your T6 stock like this?

 

 

Looks like that, one piece.

[super jim 14]

Thanks for everyone's help. It sounds like the consensus is that once I install the US made piston, I'm in compliance. Please let me know if anyone disagrees with this.

 

Jim