22_Shooter 1,560 Posted March 12, 2009 Report Share Posted March 12, 2009 (edited) So I took my S12 out for the first time yesterday, and had some FTE's (see my range report thread). I just read this post from Bvamp in the "Serial # range of problem guns" thread: If you have any problems, switch to ONLY factory 5 round mag that came with your gun, and be sure you are on gas setting "2". The correct gas setting "2" is when your gas plug is screwed all the way in, and backed out to set to "1" and THEN you crank it out once more to the next setting "2". If your plug seats fully on setting "2" back it out one complete turn before considering that your gun has a problem. I did catch one gun this week that this was the issue with. "2" is NOT supposed to be threaded totally into your gun's gas block. DO NOT unscrew your plug if you have cycling problems, to 3 or 4 turns out, however, as this may damage your gun. capiche? The highlighted part is why I'm starting this thread................when I screw my gas knob all the way in, it sits at setting #2. This is where I left it, and where it was when I was shooting. So if I'm understanding Bvamp's post, I should have screwed the knob all the way in (like I did), unscrew it to setting #1, and unscrew some more to setting #2, right? So maybe the FTE's I had were a result of having the knob screwed all the way in, on setting #2, and not backed out to setting #2? <smacks forehead> Am I reading Bvamp's post right? Edited March 12, 2009 by 22_Shooter Quote Link to post Share on other sites
corbin 621 Posted March 12, 2009 Report Share Posted March 12, 2009 This is news to me too. Bvamp knows what he's talking about though, so I'd trust what he says. I've only had my Saiga since mid-January and at the beginning, it handled everything I put in it. Now it doesn't like Wall Mart #8 shot Federal. I suspect that if I follow Bvamp's advice, she'll go back to gobbling up anything I feed her. Of course, after having learned this, I just got one of GunFixer's gas plugs. Thast's cool though. Corbin Quote Link to post Share on other sites
David Mark 2,452 Posted March 12, 2009 Report Share Posted March 12, 2009 I don't think the info from Bvamp is correct. It is my understanding that you screw it all the way in then back it out to two or one depending on the load. I don't think you are supposed to give it the extra revolution he suggests. There really doesn't appear to be a point to that as the setting simply positions the angled back of the plug either open (2) or partially closed (1). Quote Link to post Share on other sites
sunnybean 939 Posted March 12, 2009 Report Share Posted March 12, 2009 I did this last time I was out. Unfortunatly, it didn't make any difference on mine. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Bounce12 407 Posted March 12, 2009 Report Share Posted March 12, 2009 (edited) The highlighted part is why I'm starting this thread................when I screw my gas knob all the way in, it sits at setting #2. This is where I left it, and where it was when I was shooting. So if I'm understanding Bvamp's post, I should have screwed the knob all the way in (like I did), unscrew it to setting #1, and unscrew some more to setting #2, right? So maybe the FTE's I had were a result of having the knob screwed all the way in, on setting #2, and not backed out to setting #2? <smacks forehead> Am I reading Bvamp's post right? Try this: Remove the plug and stand the S-12 upright and set it on the butt stock in front of you. Now, place the gas plug on what would be the top of the gas chamber with the lip of the gas block is resting on the end of the gas tube (as if it was screwed all the way in) and rotate it so that it is in the same position as it would be if you had it screwed all the way in. Rotate it such that it sits exactly as it does when you screw your plug all the way in. Did I confuse you with that? The point is to then LOOK at the gas block from the side and SEE what's going on in the tube. Now, raise the plug up a thread and rotate it such that the other number is where the pin is. Then raise it up another thread and rotate it again. You will be able to see what's going on inside the tube with reference to the ports and the block. You can measure the depth of the plug and then stick the tape down inside the tube and you'll be able to visualize just how deep the plug goes when it is screwed in to various depths. Once you do that, you should be able to visualize WTF is going on IN YOUR TUBE no matter what setting you have. Once you can see the shape and depth of the plug and visualize how it interacts with the ports, you will know from then on out exactly what setting you want. You will see why continuing to unscrew it beyond a certain point won't help (the ports are probably already completely uncovered) and can actually hurt (because now the plug might not even be completely secure). If you do as Bvamp suggests and still have FTE issues, the plug setting probably isn't your problem (so don't go out any farther with it - it won't help). Edited March 12, 2009 by Bounce12 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
havok 21 Posted March 12, 2009 Report Share Posted March 12, 2009 What Bvamp is trying to say is if you tightin your plug and it is tight and on setting 2 your guns plug theads or gas tube are off a bit. When I tightin my plug, when tight it is almost at setting 2. So the first useable setting for me would be setting 1. Which is located around a 1/4 back from tight. If your guns gas tube threads are off or the plug, when tighting your plug you are on setting 2 as your first setting not 1. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Raoul_Duke 113 Posted March 12, 2009 Report Share Posted March 12, 2009 I seem to recall having read a thread a while ago that a few gas plugs were mis-marked, the 1 where the 2 should be and vice versa. IF that is the case, you would have had it on the high brass setting, resulting in your FTE's. I may be wrong, though. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
VanKiller 322 Posted March 12, 2009 Report Share Posted March 12, 2009 Just trying to clear the air a bit. Some of the new guns have the number 2 setting ending up almost seating when dead tight. So naturally some folks are cramming the plug that extra little bit of a turn, and end up with too much gas plug in the hole, which interferes with the gas flow. And it really interferes when the ports are forward in the barrel, as some are coming in now. One gun so far this last week did end up in just such a position without forcing the plug in. SOO, if you are having issues with the gun cycling, bottom out the gas plug, then back it out , one turn, to the correct position. Hope this helps...............Tom/VK Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Cobra 76 two 2,677 Posted March 12, 2009 Report Share Posted March 12, 2009 Damn I'm glad all my guns are EAA and K USA imports. I've never seen such a thing out of any of them before. They just keep on finding more and more ways to screw them up nowadays don't they? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
hobbyshooter 59 Posted March 12, 2009 Report Share Posted March 12, 2009 (edited) I read BVAMPs post to be: If you have FTE's on setting 2 try unscrewing the cam 1 full rotation to 2 again. If it still FTE's after doing that then you have gas port issues for the ammo you are using (undergassed). Some have reported that some guns just need to "wear in" (the springs just need to be worked in). Others said different gas pistons seal better and make for more reliable cycling Others have stated good results with the Gunfixer 4 position gas knob. Others still say to just use heavier ammo specifically. Of course you can send the gun to Candiz for port work... The choice is yours, but I'd probably start by just working the bolt action a bunch, and storing the gun with the bolt locked back. Oh and shoot it with that fed 7-1/2 as often as you can to document any improvements. Edited March 12, 2009 by hobbyshooter Quote Link to post Share on other sites
VanKiller 322 Posted March 12, 2009 Report Share Posted March 12, 2009 Well Said............. I read BVAMPs post to be: If you have FTE's on setting 2 try unscrewing the cam 1 full rotation to 2 again. If it still FTE's after doing that then you have gas port issues for the ammo you are using (undergassed). Some have reported that some guns just need to "wear in" (the springs just need to be worked in). Others said different gas pistons seal better and make for more reliable cycling Others have stated good results with the Gunfixer 4 position gas knob. Others still say to just use heavier ammo specifically. Of course you can send the gun to Candiz for port work... The choice is yours, but I'd probably start by just working the bolt action a bunch, and storing the gun with the bolt locked back. Oh and shoot it with that fed 7-1/2 as often as you can to document any improvements. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Snoofer 138 Posted March 12, 2009 Report Share Posted March 12, 2009 ...and storing the gun with the bolt locked back. my gun runs perfectly since i got it back from CGW, but i was wondering how this would help. loosens the spring? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
22_Shooter 1,560 Posted March 12, 2009 Author Report Share Posted March 12, 2009 OK, I'll give Bvamp's advice a try. I'll probably pick up a KA puck as well. I'll put at least the whole 100-pack of Federal through it, before I decide there's any real problem. Thanks for the advice fellas. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
corbin 621 Posted March 12, 2009 Report Share Posted March 12, 2009 I did as Bvamp suggested and just got back in from putting a box of #8 shot through it. If you've already seen my where I stated how # 8 shot won't work in my Saiga, you can see how it behaved with the gas plug screwed in all the way on setting 2. While I didn't video my shooting just now, I can tell you I was able to run through an MD-20 drum as well as doing my rapid fire technique with a Surefire 8 rounder without a problem. The MD-20 drum might need to have me lessen the spring tension for light loads, as I had the second shot hang up a little when trying to load when I shot it a couple days ago. It talks about that in the manual. Hopefully it's not too hard to do. Today, it did fine though. Corbin Quote Link to post Share on other sites
22_Shooter 1,560 Posted March 13, 2009 Author Report Share Posted March 13, 2009 I did as Bvamp suggested and just got back in from putting a box of #8 shot through it. If you've already seen my where I stated how # 8 shot won't work in my Saiga, you can see how it behaved with the gas plug screwed in all the way on setting 2. While I didn't video my shooting just now, I can tell you I was able to run through an MD-20 drum as well as doing my rapid fire technique with a Surefire 8 rounder without a problem. The MD-20 drum might need to have me lessen the spring tension for light loads, as I had the second shot hang up a little when trying to load when I shot it a couple days ago. It talks about that in the manual. Hopefully it's not too hard to do. Today, it did fine though. Corbin Glad to hear. I hope I have similar results. Thanks for the update. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
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