Bizzarolibe 5 Posted November 5, 2009 Report Share Posted November 5, 2009 I JUUUUSSTTTT BOUGHT ONEENENENNENENE!!!!!!!!!! ....I'm also on Vikadin right now So....freakin....excited.... Good Choice on the Vikadin! mmmmm....good choice indeed. Legal of course, all perfectly legal Quote Link to post Share on other sites
bigsal 757 Posted November 5, 2009 Author Report Share Posted November 5, 2009 IMPORTANT: K-Var increased their SGL-21 prices today. Colored units to raise to $529... 2 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
555JM 10 Posted November 6, 2009 Report Share Posted November 6, 2009 OK, OK, read the thread and looking at the K-Var site. I see NATO length buttstocks and Warsaw length. Which is longer? Any other differences between the two? I'm good with black, but can see that I better get on it. Thanks. Bob Quote Link to post Share on other sites
sunnybean 939 Posted November 6, 2009 Report Share Posted November 6, 2009 555JM, The NATO is longer. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
555JM 10 Posted November 6, 2009 Report Share Posted November 6, 2009 (edited) Can anyone verify from first-hand experience that the SGL-21's do NOT blow out the case neck of fired brass creating a ring, like the Saiga sporters do? I thought these things were built up from Saigas and that every x39 Saiga had the Russian gun-control feature that results in a ring around the case neck. Do they rebarrel these guns as part of the build?? The neck ring about precludes reloading for Saiga x39s. My justification for an SGL-21 is being able to reload for it. Thanks for any help. Bob Edited November 6, 2009 by 555JM Quote Link to post Share on other sites
shades_of_grey 1,092 Posted November 6, 2009 Report Share Posted November 6, 2009 (edited) Can anyone verify from first-hand experience that the SGL-21's do NOT blow out the case neck of fired brass creating a ring, like the Saiga sporters do? I thought these things were built up from Saigas and that every x39 Saiga had the Russian gun-control feature that results in a ring around the case neck. Do they rebarrel these guns as part of the build?? The neck ring about precludes reloading for Saiga x39s. My justification for an SGL-21 is being able to reload for it. Thanks for any help. Bob Yes, I can confirm that SGL20 and SGL21 rifles do not have that bullshit Russian "gun control feature". I posted several months ago with a pic in the thread covering this issue. I own a '20 and a '21. These rifles have Izhmash military barrels/chambers, (unlike the standard "sporter" Saiga 7.62x39 rifles). They do not "step" fired cartridge necks. They are much more friendly to someone looking to reload. Edited November 6, 2009 by post-apocalyptic 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
iyaoyas98 6 Posted November 6, 2009 Report Share Posted November 6, 2009 IMPORTANT: K-Var increased their SGL-21 prices today. Colored units to raise to $529... Atlantic hadn't bumped it yet, at least not as of an hour ago when I ordered a Plum. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
bigsal 757 Posted November 6, 2009 Author Report Share Posted November 6, 2009 IMPORTANT: K-Var increased their SGL-21 prices today. Colored units to raise to $529... Atlantic hadn't bumped it yet, at least not as of an hour ago when I ordered a Plum. Yeah but Atlantic charges you a %3 credit card fee and more for shipping. Even with the bump it is still probably cheaper to go with K-Var. 2 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
555JM 10 Posted November 6, 2009 Report Share Posted November 6, 2009 (edited) Deleted duplicate post.... Edited November 6, 2009 by 555JM Quote Link to post Share on other sites
555JM 10 Posted November 6, 2009 Report Share Posted November 6, 2009 OK, I got one coming. Black with NATO stock. Got a bayonet too; they were on sale. Thanks, everyone, for your help. I need a new chainsaw, but I'm buying this. Think I've lost it. Bob Quote Link to post Share on other sites
iyaoyas98 6 Posted November 6, 2009 Report Share Posted November 6, 2009 IMPORTANT: K-Var increased their SGL-21 prices today. Colored units to raise to $529... Atlantic hadn't bumped it yet, at least not as of an hour ago when I ordered a Plum. Yeah but Atlantic charges you a %3 credit card fee and more for shipping. Even with the bump it is still probably cheaper to go with K-Var. OTD including FFL fees on my end, $555.(I'm sending a Certified Money Order - no 3% charge) Not bad in my book. Of course, If I had beef with someone.... Usually, I just go with the math. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
bigsal 757 Posted November 6, 2009 Author Report Share Posted November 6, 2009 (edited) IMPORTANT: K-Var increased their SGL-21 prices today. Colored units to raise to $529... Atlantic hadn't bumped it yet, at least not as of an hour ago when I ordered a Plum. Yeah but Atlantic charges you a %3 credit card fee and more for shipping. Even with the bump it is still probably cheaper to go with K-Var. OTD including FFL fees on my end, $555.(I'm sending a Certified Money Order - no 3% charge) Not bad in my book. Of course, If I had beef with someone.... Usually, I just go with the math. k-var = $529+18 shipping =$547 + I got to use my credit card... atlantic = "$555 OTD" + You have to run around securing a money order... not sure what math you're using, but I prefer "old math" Edited November 6, 2009 by bigsal 3 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
iyaoyas98 6 Posted November 6, 2009 Report Share Posted November 6, 2009 (edited) IMPORTANT: K-Var increased their SGL-21 prices today. Colored units to raise to $529... Atlantic hadn't bumped it yet, at least not as of an hour ago when I ordered a Plum. Yeah but Atlantic charges you a %3 credit card fee and more for shipping. Even with the bump it is still probably cheaper to go with K-Var. OTD including FFL fees on my end, $555.(I'm sending a Certified Money Order - no 3% charge) Not bad in my book. Of course, If I had beef with someone.... Usually, I just go with the math. k-var = $529+18 shipping =$547 + I got to use my credit card... atlantic = "$555 OTD" + You have to run around securing a money order... not sure what math you're using, but I prefer "old math" You got to back out my $30 FFL fee. I barely have a drivers license. $505 + $20 shipping = $525. I work beside my bank and have a stamp machine at work. Honestly, it's $17 dollars. I spent that at lunch today, either is still a smoking deal. Edited November 6, 2009 by iyaoyas98 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Frank Rizzo 8 Posted November 6, 2009 Report Share Posted November 6, 2009 Im stuck between buying a SGL21-61 ($540.00 including shipping and FFL), or buying a nice Aimpoint Micro to go one one of the other half dozen AK's I already own. Or more mags and ammo. Etc... I have the K-var link open on another tab, info filled in, just having trouble "pulling the trigger" Quote Link to post Share on other sites
shades_of_grey 1,092 Posted November 7, 2009 Report Share Posted November 7, 2009 Im stuck between buying a SGL21-61 ($540.00 including shipping and FFL), or buying a nice Aimpoint Micro to go one one of the other half dozen AK's I already own. Or more mags and ammo. Etc... I have the K-var link open on another tab, info filled in, just having trouble "pulling the trigger" The way I look at it, Aimpoint scopes will be the same price in a month as they are now. One can not say the same of SGL21s. I'd buy a SGL21 now if I were you. Chances are they won't be available this cheapy again anytime soon, (if ever). 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
bigsal 757 Posted November 7, 2009 Author Report Share Posted November 7, 2009 Im stuck between buying a SGL21-61 ($540.00 including shipping and FFL), or buying a nice Aimpoint Micro to go one one of the other half dozen AK's I already own. Or more mags and ammo. Etc... I have the K-var link open on another tab, info filled in, just having trouble "pulling the trigger" I agree with Post-Apocalyptic, these things will likely go back up into the $575-675 range soon. If your on the fence, buy now and buy the aimpoint later. If you are satisfied with you 1/2 dozen rifles, than get the aimpoint. I ended up buying a slr-106fr, as I allready have to many 7.62 saigas, don't know if you're in the same boat. So to each their own. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
saigamaui 0 Posted November 7, 2009 Report Share Posted November 7, 2009 (edited) If I understand right. These are just russian Saigas converted by Arsenal for $150? Does anyone do a simple conversion for the Saiga 12 for $150? I just want a simple pg conversion, no extras. I can only find them decked out for $1000 or more on backorder. Edited November 7, 2009 by saigamaui Quote Link to post Share on other sites
into_the_knight 22 Posted November 7, 2009 Report Share Posted November 7, 2009 If I understand right. These are just russian Saigas converted by Arsenal for $150? Does anyone do a simple conversion for the Saiga 12 for $150? I just want a simple pg conversion, no extras. I can only find them decked out for $1000 or more on backorder. If you want simple as in no change to handguard and no muzzle device, then you could do it for less than 150 yourself. Buttstock = 30, Trigger = 30, Pistol grip = 10, Pistol Grip nut = 8, bullet guide = 30. $108. You could perhaps do even better on price than that. If you've got a power drill and a dremel you're set as far as tools. You'll have to buy a die handle at lowe's or HD for like $5 bucks as well. And you're good to go. You could also fabricate your own feed ramp with a dremel, a file, a hand drill, and a piece of flat steel if you don't want to buy Dinzag's bullet guide. But no you can't find someone to do it for you for $150. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
bigsal 757 Posted November 7, 2009 Author Report Share Posted November 7, 2009 (edited) If I understand right. These are just russian Saigas converted by Arsenal for $150? Does anyone do a simple conversion for the Saiga 12 for $150? I just want a simple pg conversion, no extras. I can only find them decked out for $1000 or more on backorder. That is partially correct, the SGL21's have a Russian FSB, Russian Lug and a few other Russian parts that RAA saigas do not have when they enter the country. Edited November 7, 2009 by bigsal 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
shades_of_grey 1,092 Posted November 8, 2009 Report Share Posted November 8, 2009 If I understand right. These are just russian Saigas converted by Arsenal for $150? Does anyone do a simple conversion for the Saiga 12 for $150? I just want a simple pg conversion, no extras. I can only find them decked out for $1000 or more on backorder. They're more than just standard Saiga 7.62x39 rifles restored by Arsenal. They have quite a few more military parts and features. One of the most significant, (imo), and overlooked difference is that Legion Saigas, (one of which is the SGL21), have military barrels/chambers and therefore do not "step" cartridge necks as standard "sporter" (RAAC imported), Saiga rifles do. If want your rifle to have as many correct military features and parts as possible, (as most of us do), buy a SGL21. Imo they are a steal at ~$500. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
555JM 10 Posted November 8, 2009 Report Share Posted November 8, 2009 Hey, Post-Apoc; what's the difference between the SGL-20 and the SGL-21? You have both, don't you? I couldn't determine the difference from the K-var site. I'm aware that the 20's are not available any longer. Bob Quote Link to post Share on other sites
shades_of_grey 1,092 Posted November 8, 2009 Report Share Posted November 8, 2009 SGL21s have intact accessory lugs, SGL20s do not. That is the only difference. They both have bayo lugs, of course. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
555JM 10 Posted November 10, 2009 Report Share Posted November 10, 2009 Well....Heck!! ...and then some! Knew it was too good to be true. In this morning's Email: "Sales Order "cancelled" from K-VAR Corp" "Unfortunately, we do not ship rifles to customers with billing and/or shipping addresses in the state of New York. We apologize for any inconvenience this may cause. Thank you for your business - we appreciate it very much." Looks like that SGL21 will be going to someone else. Rats! Well...on to plan B: Ruger P345. Bob Quote Link to post Share on other sites
volkov 318 Posted November 10, 2009 Report Share Posted November 10, 2009 lancaster I bought has dropped 200$ as well . Oh well, I've had 200 dollars worth of fun with it easily (Better have, I've spent several times that on ammo since I got it) Quote Link to post Share on other sites
saiga12fury 0 Posted November 11, 2009 Report Share Posted November 11, 2009 Ill be picking one up soon. I didnt know they can accept any AK Double stack mil spec!!! Good to know before buying!! Time to stock pile 7.62 and mags!! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
havok 21 Posted November 11, 2009 Report Share Posted November 11, 2009 If I understand right. These are just russian Saigas converted by Arsenal for $150? Does anyone do a simple conversion for the Saiga 12 for $150? I just want a simple pg conversion, no extras. I can only find them decked out for $1000 or more on backorder. They're more than just standard Saiga 7.62x39 rifles restored by Arsenal. They have quite a few more military parts and features. One of the most significant, (imo), and overlooked difference is that Legion Saigas, (one of which is the SGL21), have military barrels/chambers and therefore do not "step" cartridge necks as standard "sporter" (RAAC imported), Saiga rifles do. If want your rifle to have as many correct military features and parts as possible, (as most of us do), buy a SGL21. Imo they are a steal at ~$500. Izhmash use AKM barrel's on saiga's. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
shades_of_grey 1,092 Posted November 11, 2009 Report Share Posted November 11, 2009 If I understand right. These are just russian Saigas converted by Arsenal for $150? Does anyone do a simple conversion for the Saiga 12 for $150? I just want a simple pg conversion, no extras. I can only find them decked out for $1000 or more on backorder. They're more than just standard Saiga 7.62x39 rifles restored by Arsenal. They have quite a few more military parts and features. One of the most significant, (imo), and overlooked difference is that Legion Saigas, (one of which is the SGL21), have military barrels/chambers and therefore do not "step" cartridge necks as standard "sporter" (RAAC imported), Saiga rifles do. If want your rifle to have as many correct military features and parts as possible, (as most of us do), buy a SGL21. Imo they are a steal at ~$500. Izhmash use AKM barrel's on saiga's. What are you saying.. that the barrels used to construct Saigas are several years old or..? Regardless, do you have any confirmation of this that you could link? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
shades_of_grey 1,092 Posted November 11, 2009 Report Share Posted November 11, 2009 Ill be picking one up soon. I didnt know they can accept any AK Double stack mil spec!!! Good to know before buying!! Time to stock pile 7.62 and mags!! Yep. No mods whatsoever required for mil-spec performance, (besides selective fire ). For ~$500, you can not beat that deal. Good news is that a lot of combloc steel 30-rounders are pretty cheap atm, and Russian 7.62 ammo is also currently decently priced. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
bigsal 757 Posted November 11, 2009 Author Report Share Posted November 11, 2009 If I understand right. These are just russian Saigas converted by Arsenal for $150? Does anyone do a simple conversion for the Saiga 12 for $150? I just want a simple pg conversion, no extras. I can only find them decked out for $1000 or more on backorder. They're more than just standard Saiga 7.62x39 rifles restored by Arsenal. They have quite a few more military parts and features. One of the most significant, (imo), and overlooked difference is that Legion Saigas, (one of which is the SGL21), have military barrels/chambers and therefore do not "step" cartridge necks as standard "sporter" (RAAC imported), Saiga rifles do. If want your rifle to have as many correct military features and parts as possible, (as most of us do), buy a SGL21. Imo they are a steal at ~$500. Izhmash use AKM barrel's on saiga's. That is incorrect. They use the 100 series barrels. The 103 is an updated AKM, so maybe that is where you got confused. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
havok 21 Posted November 11, 2009 Report Share Posted November 11, 2009 If I understand right. These are just russian Saigas converted by Arsenal for $150? Does anyone do a simple conversion for the Saiga 12 for $150? I just want a simple pg conversion, no extras. I can only find them decked out for $1000 or more on backorder. They're more than just standard Saiga 7.62x39 rifles restored by Arsenal. They have quite a few more military parts and features. One of the most significant, (imo), and overlooked difference is that Legion Saigas, (one of which is the SGL21), have military barrels/chambers and therefore do not "step" cartridge necks as standard "sporter" (RAAC imported), Saiga rifles do. If want your rifle to have as many correct military features and parts as possible, (as most of us do), buy a SGL21. Imo they are a steal at ~$500. Izhmash use AKM barrel's on saiga's. What are you saying.. that the barrels used to construct Saigas are several years old or..? Regardless, do you have any confirmation of this that you could link? No I'am saying that that barrel on the saiga is just as good as your Arsenal "mil spec" barrel. kalashnikov.guns.ru X39 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
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