New Arsenal SGL-20

[saigalupo 1]

Hey everybody,

 

 

 

Yesterday I picked up a new Arsenal SGL-20, along with 1000 rounds of wolf black box, 5 steel mags and 5 tapco mags for $1450. I decided to get an AK instead of another saiga 12 for a conversion like I planned. I had my sights set on a nice yugo AK for $525 but at the last min went with the sgl.

 

I went out and put 60 rounds through it this afternoon at the 50 yard indoor range with no problems, Im really happy with it. The only thing I did not like was the damn warsaw buttstock, way to small for me. Is it made for midgets? I had to crane my head back towards the end of the stock just so I wouldnt get

samcked in the face. Im either going to order a NATO length stock or go with the magpul crt sometime this week as well as a new thicker pistol grip.

 

What kind of groups at a 100 yards are people getting? Anybody have any problems with the sgl20s?

What ammo do people recommend to shoot and stock? Im not thrilled with the wolf 7.62x39mm as I am with the

12g 00 buck.

Edited May 16, 2010 by saigalupo

[superA 289]

Don't count out the stock if you are having accuracy problems. I have held the short stocks and they felt retarded for me. I haven't shot for groups on paper yet so I can't help you there but from shooting I can tell it get's my job done.

[rifleshooter474 2]

A UTG butt 1" extension pad will sure help that stock problem.

[echoside190 127]

Yeah it sounds like the first thing to do for you would be to change the buttstock or extend it. A longer length of pull would increase accuracy since you'd be more comfortable when shouldering definitely. The nato would offer you 1 1/4" longer LOP so I guess Imagine that on your rifle and see how you'd like it before buying a replacement so you can get what's best for your setup the first go around.

 

For ammo, when you buy bulk packs such as Wolf it'll be less accurate than stuff like American Eagle and the more expensive ammo available. I personally stock up on Wolf and Herter's ammo for my bulk, and for accuracy I'd get American Eagle by Federal and Seller & Bellot ammunition.

 

Hope this helps some man.

[saigalupo 1]

A UTG butt 1" extension pad will sure help that stock problem.

 

 

 

That looks good but I think Im going to go with a new stock.

[cobravenom39 17]

Are you facing the target with your shoulders square?

 

Or do you have your shoulders at a 45 degree angle from the target with only the lower part of the buttstock touching your shoulder?

 

I'm 6'1 200 lbs with pretty long arms and the Warsaw buttstock is fine for me.

[saigalupo 1]

Yeah it sounds like the first thing to do for you would be to change the buttstock or extend it. A longer length of pull would increase accuracy since you'd be more comfortable when shouldering definitely. The nato would offer you 1 1/4" longer LOP so I guess Imagine that on your rifle and see how you'd like it before buying a replacement so you can get what's best for your setup the first go around.

 

For ammo, when you buy bulk packs such as Wolf it'll be less accurate than stuff like American Eagle and the more expensive ammo available. I personally stock up on Wolf and Herter's ammo for my bulk, and for accuracy I'd get American Eagle by Federal and Seller & Bellot ammunition.

 

Hope this helps some man.

 

 

 

 

Yes it was very uncomfortable and seemed unnatural. Im a bigger guy 6ft 230 lbs and I have long arms so I need more lop.

Ive pretty much decided on the magpul, Ive used the same stock on an Ar I used to have and it was perfect.

I think Im going to do the same and stock the wolf and shoot others. Any word on the golden tiger stuff?

Edited May 16, 2010 by saigalupo

[saigalupo 1]

Are you facing the target with your shoulders square?

 

Or do you have your shoulders at a 45 degree angle from the target with only the lower part of the buttstock touching your shoulder?

 

I'm 6'1 200 lbs with pretty long arms and the Warsaw buttstock is fine for me.

 

 

I have very big broad shoulders so the warsaw stock is just not right for me. I shoot angled not squared even with handguns.

Ive had other AKs in the past with nato length buttstocks and they have both been fine, this is my

first warsaw buttstock, and my last. I could live with it if I had to but its an easy fix so Ill just get

what I like. Im going to go with the magpul.

[BrutalGardener 205]

The Warsaw Pact length stock is designed to be usable when wearing body armor or heavy winter clothing. Also, no offense, but I think that you overpaid a bit here.

 

I mean, 1000 rounds of superior Brown Bear ammo can be had for about $250. Surplus steel mags can be found for as little at $10 each and those Tapco ones are what, $20 each?. This means that you paid about $1000 for the rifle. I mean, a local store here has one on the shelf for that price and another one has it for $900, but both been sitting there for two years. Those are "Obama scare" era prices. You can get an SGL21 for $700 (+$20 shipping +FFL transfer fee) now.

[saigalupo 1]

The Warsaw Pact length stock is designed to be usable when wearing body armor or heavy winter clothing. Also, no offense, but I think that you overpaid a bit here.

 

I mean, 1000 rounds of superior Brown Bear ammo can be had for about $250. Surplus steel mags can be found for as little at $10 each and those Tapco ones are what, $20 each?. This means that you paid about $1000 for the rifle. I mean, a local store here has one on the shelf for that price and another one has it for $900, but both been sitting there for two years. Those are "Obama scare" era prices. You can get an SGL21 for $700 (+$20 shipping +FFL transfer fee) now.

 

 

 

 

Youre right I probley did overpay a bit. The gun itself was $940 which is about the going rate now give or take, the ammo $240 the tapco mags were $14 but the steel mags were $22 a pop, then add the tax. The cheapest Ive seen steel mags around here the last 2 years are $20,some shops sell them at $30.

Edited May 17, 2010 by saigalupo

[saigalupo 1]

My new magpul stock and saw grip arrived this morning from CSS, ordered them on Tuesday. They were installed in minutes and

not only looks great but feels 100% better, better cheek weld and I can get down on the sights a lot better.

[bigsal 757]

My new magpul stock and saw grip arrived this morning from CSS, ordered them on Tuesday. They were installed in minutes and

not only looks great but feels 100% better, better cheek weld and I can get down on the sights a lot better.

That does not look great. Please return it to its proper configuration. (BTW nice rifle, I hope you enjoy it).

[BrutalGardener 205]

Tapco SAW Grip on an SGL? Yuk! You should've gotten something like a Houge grip or MD Arms' new Molot style grip. Those would look a lot better on this weapon and would be more inconspicuous.

[saigalupo 1]

Tapco SAW Grip on an SGL? Yuk! You should've gotten something like a Houge grip or MD Arms' new Molot style grip. Those would look a lot better on this weapon and would be more inconspicuous.

 

 

 

 

I have to admit that it doesnt feel as good as I thought it would.

[shades_of_grey 1,092]

Tapco SAW Grip on an SGL? Yuk! You should've gotten something like a Houge grip or MD Arms' new Molot style grip. Those would look a lot better on this weapon and would be more inconspicuous.

 

I have to admit that it doesnt feel as good as I thought it would.

 

I like the MD Arms grips quite a bit, but one often overlooked quality AK grip is the ATI grip. I don't like most of the ATI furniture, but they definitely got the grip right. It fits my hand just about perfectly, and is extremely comfortable. Another advantage of the ATI, (and the MD), grip is that it uses the full-length standard pistol grip nut, (the one that came with your SGL20), not any smaller aftermarket hardware.

 

Here's a pic of 3 improvements I recommend for Legion rifles:

 

^

My SGL21 with ATI pistol grip, Tapco G2 triggergroup, and an all-black Bulgarian AK sling.

Edited May 22, 2010 by post-apocalyptic

[GregM1 241]

Here's a pic of 3 improvements I recommend for Legion rifles:....

My SGL21 with ATI pistol grip, Tapco G2 triggergroup, and an all-black Bulgarian AK sling.

 

 

do the sgl's come with the arsenal (of las vegas) FCG? Why did you feel a need to switch to the G2? I would recommend going with a Texas Trigger for replacement. In my opinion, way more enjoyable than the G2.

[corbin 621]

It's your rifle. As long as you like how it looks and feels, that's all that should matter. Arsenals aren't cheap AKs, so when we hear about puting Tapco stuff on one, we might twitch a little, but that's ok. LOL

[saigalupo 1]

It's your rifle. As long as you like how it looks and feels, that's all that should matter. Arsenals aren't cheap AKs, so when we hear about puting Tapco stuff on one, we might twitch a little, but that's ok. LOL

 

 

Youre right but they come recommended for the saiga 12 conversions so I figured it would work good on my arsenal. After it was mounted I liked the thickness but it

looked and felt cheaper in person than in pics, I actually just put the stock grip back on this evening.

Edited May 22, 2010 by saigalupo

[saigalupo 1]

Tapco SAW Grip on an SGL? Yuk! You should've gotten something like a Houge grip or MD Arms' new Molot style grip. Those would look a lot better on this weapon and would be more inconspicuous.

 

I have to admit that it doesnt feel as good as I thought it would.

 

I like the MD Arms grips quite a bit, but one often overlooked quality AK grip is the ATI grip. I don't like most of the ATI furniture, but they definitely got the grip right. It fits my hand just about perfectly, and is extremely comfortable. Another advantage of the ATI, (and the MD), grip is that it uses the full-length standard pistol grip nut, (the one that came with your SGL20), not any smaller aftermarket hardware.

 

Here's a pic of 3 improvements I recommend for Legion rifles:

 

^

My SGL21 with ATI pistol grip, Tapco G2 triggergroup, and an all-black Bulgarian AK sling.

 

 

I wish I could have an FAL grip on it I love the way it looks and feels.

[shades_of_grey 1,092]

Here's a pic of 3 improvements I recommend for Legion rifles:....

My SGL21 with ATI pistol grip, Tapco G2 triggergroup, and an all-black Bulgarian AK sling.

 

 

do the sgl's come with the arsenal (of las vegas) FCG? Why did you feel a need to switch to the G2? I would recommend going with a Texas Trigger for replacement. In my opinion, way more enjoyable than the G2.

 

Yes, SGL's come with the Arsenal fcg. However, I prefer the shorter pull of the G2.

Edited May 22, 2010 by post-apocalyptic

[GregM1 241]

 

Yes, SGL's come with the Arsenal fcg. However, I prefer the shorter pull of the G2.

 

Interesting, thats why I prefer the TX FCG over the G2. Thanks for the info.

[BrutalGardener 205]

Tapco SAW Grip on an SGL? Yuk! You should've gotten something like a Houge grip or MD Arms' new Molot style grip. Those would look a lot better on this weapon and would be more inconspicuous.

 

I have to admit that it doesnt feel as good as I thought it would.

 

I like the MD Arms grips quite a bit, but one often overlooked quality AK grip is the ATI grip. I don't like most of the ATI furniture, but they definitely got the grip right. It fits my hand just about perfectly, and is extremely comfortable. Another advantage of the ATI, (and the MD), grip is that it uses the full-length standard pistol grip nut, (the one that came with your SGL20), not any smaller aftermarket hardware.

 

Here's a pic of 3 improvements I recommend for Legion rifles:

 

^

My SGL21 with ATI pistol grip, Tapco G2 triggergroup, and an all-black Bulgarian AK sling.

 

I think that another great improvement for this rifle is a Krebs Enhanced Selector Lever. It improves the combat effectiveness, by letting you disengage the safety using your trigger finger, while gripping the pistol grip. It also adds BHO function, letting you better cool the weapon between salvos at the range, and run a boresnake through the barrel without field-stripping the weapon. The black Russian Navy AK sling is good too.

[Rhodes1968 1,638]

I have to use the NATO plus the recoil pad as shown in the above posts. One thing you may not remember is that in general the Com-bloc soldiers ran almost 3 inches shorter or more than NATO in particular in the 1950s and 1960s. Poor diet being the cause. What Ive always found is if you are uncomfortable with the stock change it to suit your tastes it will reflect in your shooting.

[Rhodes1968 1,638]

double post

Edited May 23, 2010 by Rhodes1968

[Klassy Kalashnikov 1,393]

What kind of groups at a 100 yards are people getting? Anybody have any problems with the sgl20s?

What ammo do people recommend to shoot and stock? Im not thrilled with the wolf 7.62x39mm as I am with the

12g 00 buck.

 

I would say, switch over to Brown Bear or Silver Bear ammo. I used to shoot Wolf, after buying Bear I won't go back. There is a noticeable different in accuracy with the ammo, and also, the rifle needs half as much cleaning with Bear.

 

As far as group size, I am not the greatest shooter or anything, with my 762 I usually do ~4-6" groups at 100 yards kneeling, but I'm also using a 4x scope. With Irons I'm maybe 8-12" at 100 kneeling. I don't do any bench shooting anymore, I do standing/kneeling/prone.

 

Between a new stock, ammo, and my third recommendation of better sights, you will definitely see improvement. Check out a PSO/POST 4x scope, or even better irons like Krebs or Mojo rear sights, can also get a thinner front post for the rifle too.

Edited May 23, 2010 by Klassy Kalashnikov

[saigalupo 1]

What kind of groups at a 100 yards are people getting? Anybody have any problems with the sgl20s?

What ammo do people recommend to shoot and stock? Im not thrilled with the wolf 7.62x39mm as I am with the

12g 00 buck.

 

I would say, switch over to Brown Bear or Silver Bear ammo. I used to shoot Wolf, after buying Bear I won't go back. There is a noticeable different in accuracy with the ammo, and also, the rifle needs half as much cleaning with Bear.

 

As far as group size, I am not the greatest shooter or anything, with my 762 I usually do ~4-6" groups at 100 yards kneeling, but I'm also using a 4x scope. With Irons I'm maybe 8-12" at 100 kneeling. I don't do any bench shooting anymore, I do standing/kneeling/prone.

 

Between a new stock, ammo, and my third recommendation of better sights, you will definitely see improvement. Check out a PSO/POST 4x scope, or even better irons like Krebs or Mojo rear sights, can also get a thinner front post for the rifle too.

 

 

Im going to pick up a case of silver bear in a few weeks 1000 rounds for $280. They have golden bear too which im guessing is better but more expensive.

I also want to get the krebs sight, the other day I looked at a .308 saiga with them installed and I liked it a lot.

 

That seems about average for most AKs not bench resting, I dont see it doing 1-2 moa at 100 yards, a standard M1A can barely do it with irons and they have the best irons of any rifle in my opinion.

[rifleshooter474 2]

The basic non-USA AK bbl. is pretty good with groups but it has it's limits, but to expect match grade bbl. groups from the this bbl, is a dream that is not going to happen.

[raidersfan_5544 57]

"Im going to pick up a case of silver bear in a few weeks 1000 rounds for $280. "

 

You can find it cheaper than that.