Why do you want a magwell? To use AR mags or just for a magwell?

[csspecs 1,987]

Well I was looking at some things today, I'd love a magwell on my .223 but no way on this earth am I cutting my trunnion. I have the machines to do it right, but I still don't want to cut anything that holds the gun together.

 

So what about a mag that was made to fit within the trunnion of the .223 yet would work in a AR (more or less). Perhaps they could be made if there is nothing out there, that way people who don't wish to cut their guns can use the magwells.

 

I found these but I can't see if thats what they are. Maybe someone has one or has seen one.

The front looks funny. Like a Galil mag that was made to work in an AR, weird huh?

 

(If a business member has these please post and I'll change links).

http://www.centuryarms.biz/proddetail.asp?prod=MA334

[vintagedude88 16]

Not exactly sure what you are asking.

 

I did the evil deed of cutting my trunion to make the AR mag adapter fit. Honestly the majority of the cutting was not to fit the adapter but more so to fit the AR mag into the magwell. Clearances was needed in the trunion in order for the AR mag to fit deep enough into the magwell for it to feed properly.

 

So basically regardless of who's adapter, you'll need to do some cutting on the trunion if you want to fit any AR mag in a Saiga .223

[csspecs 1,987]

Question is. Is the goal to have cheap AR mags fit? Or to have a magwell? If the goal is to use cheap mags there is not much I can do.

 

AR mags are square in the front because the AR has a square magwell. In theory a mag could be made that locked into a AR adapter, with no mods to the rifle. It would "function" in an AR-15, so one could rebuild their existing high caps, if they lived in a ban state (some states allow rebuilding of mags with new parts).

 

The link I posted was of some sort of new AR-15 mag that looks to have a tapered front. If it in fact has a tapered front, it could be an option to modifying the gun

[protected static 19]

It looks mostly like an Orlite for an AR15 - they don't have as good a reputation as the Galils. If it's something new, I'd be interested in checking it out.

 

Personally, I got the magwell for interop since I've already got a bunch of AR mags. I also figured in a SHTF/EOTW situation, AR mags are going to be a lot easier to come by - cheap mags was more like a bonus.

[christcorp 26]

I am not 100% familiar with the MSA adapter, but I do use the Renegadebuck AR/Saiga adapter. NO Modification to the gun is required to make the adapter connect to the Saiga .223. It connects to the gun the exact same way that a saiga magazine fits into the rifle. Takes 2 seconds to connect the AR adapter. The modification required is inside of the rifle, to allow the AR magazine fit all the way up inside of the rifle. A Saiga magazine has a deeper cut in it in the front. An AR magazine has only a slight cut out in the front of the magazine. So, the tabs inside of the rifle, when the magazines stops, needs to be ground down a little to allow the AR magazine to fit in deeper. NO modifications were done to the external parts of the gun. And I can take the AR adapter off in the same amount of time it takes to remove a Magaine. And with the Renegadebuck AR/Saiga adapter removed, I can immediately put in an OEM saiga magazine. No modifications necessary. So, I have the best of both worlds. I can use OEM, Surefire, and Pro-Mag magazines. OR, I can put the adapter back on (2 seconds) and use all the AR-15 magazines that I have or come across as needed. Don't need a bullet guide. Simple process. And I didn't even need to use a mill to do it. A dremel worked just fine.

 

Now, in all fairness, the MSA adapters might be exactly the same now. At one time, I read many posts of where the actual magwell of the rifle had to be altered via a mill/dremel. That's why I went with, and still support the Renegadebuck AR/Saiga adapter. It has zero effect on OEM operation.

Edited October 5, 2010 by christcorp

[notofnow 5]

So when will Renegadebuck's adapter be available. I've been emailing the guy since spring of this year and i still don't have one. The only response i've gotten is "wait a few more weeks".

 

Maybe i got dropped off the radar and he's ignoring me. Has anyone gotten one from him lately?

[Falcon09 22]

So when will Renegadebuck's adapter be available. I've been emailing the guy since spring of this year and i still don't have one. The only response i've gotten is "wait a few more weeks".

 

Maybe i got dropped off the radar and he's ignoring me. Has anyone gotten one from him lately?

 

I have been getting the same response from him. I believe he has had some problems with suppliers. He told me he would let me know when they are available.

[Bvamp 604]

Question is. Is the goal to have cheap AR mags fit? Or to have a magwell? If the goal is to use cheap mags there is not much I can do.

 

 

interchangeability is a huge plus to some people. I always tried at least to stay with certain calibers, and a lot of people do.

 

staying with the same mags falls right into the same boat from my particular perspective.

 

plus you have a magwell fed AK in 223....

 

Its a few factors overall, id imagine, although which weighs heavier is probably the magwell feed in this case....

[christcorp 26]

My reason was simple. For a little over $100, I could have a gun that shot multiple magazines. If the AR mag adapter required a permanent one way modification; in other words I wouldn't be able to use the standard OEM magazines again, then I never would have done the adaptation. But with the AR mag adapter; at least the Renegadebuck version I have, it is totally 100% compatible with existing OEM Saiga Magazines. I simply remove the AR mag adapter, just like it was a magazine, and I can use my Saiga, Surefire, and Pro-mag magazines again. So, the reason i did it, was so that I could have more flexibility if needed. Of course, putting on a 100 round AR drug magazine sounds fun too. Haven't tried it yet, but I know others who have.

[Zambidis 90]

The appeal to the adapter, for me at least, is to use AR mags. Like many people I already have a number of AR mags. The are becoming somewhat of a standard mag for 5.56 weapons. AR, Sig 556, MSAR E4 AUG clone, XCR, PLR-16, SU-16, SCAR, FS2000, ACR, etc all take AR mags. Its nice to have a big pile of mags that work in a number of one's weapons.

 

Added bonus is the mag well providing straight insertion and drop free extraction.

 

Another bonus is getting so called "AK purists" riled up by even further "AR-izing" an AK.

 

Sadly getting an AR mag adapter didn't really work out for me (and others).

[BKLYN_C 14]

Just as people above stated, the purpose of adapter is to be able to use AR mags. Plenty of cheap magazines and even in the "behind the enemy lines" states we can get cheap pre-bans. The last time I got 20 orlites from fulton armory for under $1 each.

 

Now, the issue with then is that the front part of the magazine doesnt fit the well in the trunion. So my solution was to build an adapter that would minimize the amount of material to be removed from the trunion. All together I had to remove about 1mm on each side. Surely, now it is weaker, but knowing how engineering in Russia works and the amount of extra strength inherited in the trunion by the time of its inception I doubt I jeopardized its integrity.

 

By now I found that not all magazines feed reliably in my build, I never had a single jam with GI mags or orlites, but steel ones just dont want to feed. Actually, it doesnt bother me a bit since I have lots of GIs.

So far I shot around 2K rounds with this mag adapter. Check it every time I come from range and clean the gun and everything seems to be exactly the way it should.

 

PS. Making S-308 to accept M14 mags would take much more work, remove a lot of material and the caliber is much more powerful than 223, so no adapter for me on S-308.

Edited October 10, 2010 by BKLYN_C

[canoecanoe 63]

Just as people above stated, the purpose of adapter is to be able to use AR mags. Plenty of cheap magazines and even in the "behind the enemy lines" states we can get cheap pre-bans. The last time I got 20 orlites from fulton armory for under $1 each.

 

Now, the issue with then is that the front part of the magazine doesnt fit the well in the trunion. So my solution was to build an adapter that would minimize the amount of material to be removed from the trunion. All together I had to remove about 1mm on each side. Surely, now it is weaker, but knowing how engineering in Russia works and the amount of extra strength inherited in the trunion by the time of its inception I doubt I jeopardized its integrity.

 

By now I found that not all magazines feed reliably in my build, I never had a single jam with GI mags or orlites, but steel ones just dont want to feed. Actually, it doesnt bother me a bit since I have lots of GIs.

So far I shot around 2K rounds with this mag adapter. Check it every time I come from range and clean the gun and everything seems to be exactly the way it should.

 

PS. Making S-308 to accept M14 mags would take much more work, remove a lot of material and the caliber is much more powerful than 223, so no adapter for me on S-308.

 

Are you saying you made your own adaptor? can you post any Pics? I wouold be intrested in seeing it.

[6500rpm 670]

I hated the way my Galil mags flopped around on the gun (early Century Galil receiver from CFS) so I milled it for the UA mag adapters made for the Galil and never looked back. Once I saw how reliable it was on the Galil I bought another and did some tweeking to both the adapter and the Saiga and I use nothing but AR mags in both.

Likes-the way the mags insert, the ability to use the same mags in multiple guns, the UA mag release

Dislikes-the fact that I had to mill on the trunion even though I've seen no negative effects thus far.

[BKLYN_C 14]

Just as people above stated, the purpose of adapter is to be able to use AR mags. Plenty of cheap magazines and even in the "behind the enemy lines" states we can get cheap pre-bans. The last time I got 20 orlites from fulton armory for under $1 each.

 

Now, the issue with then is that the front part of the magazine doesnt fit the well in the trunion. So my solution was to build an adapter that would minimize the amount of material to be removed from the trunion. All together I had to remove about 1mm on each side. Surely, now it is weaker, but knowing how engineering in Russia works and the amount of extra strength inherited in the trunion by the time of its inception I doubt I jeopardized its integrity.

 

By now I found that not all magazines feed reliably in my build, I never had a single jam with GI mags or orlites, but steel ones just dont want to feed. Actually, it doesnt bother me a bit since I have lots of GIs.

So far I shot around 2K rounds with this mag adapter. Check it every time I come from range and clean the gun and everything seems to be exactly the way it should.

 

PS. Making S-308 to accept M14 mags would take much more work, remove a lot of material and the caliber is much more powerful than 223, so no adapter for me on S-308.

 

Are you saying you made your own adaptor? can you post any Pics? I wouold be intrested in seeing it.

 

Dont have the detailed picture, but overall here it is:

 

[canoecanoe 63]

Just as people above stated, the purpose of adapter is to be able to use AR mags. Plenty of cheap magazines and even in the "behind the enemy lines" states we can get cheap pre-bans. The last time I got 20 orlites from fulton armory for under $1 each.

 

Now, the issue with then is that the front part of the magazine doesnt fit the well in the trunion. So my solution was to build an adapter that would minimize the amount of material to be removed from the trunion. All together I had to remove about 1mm on each side. Surely, now it is weaker, but knowing how engineering in Russia works and the amount of extra strength inherited in the trunion by the time of its inception I doubt I jeopardized its integrity.

 

By now I found that not all magazines feed reliably in my build, I never had a single jam with GI mags or orlites, but steel ones just dont want to feed. Actually, it doesnt bother me a bit since I have lots of GIs.

So far I shot around 2K rounds with this mag adapter. Check it every time I come from range and clean the gun and everything seems to be exactly the way it should.

 

PS. Making S-308 to accept M14 mags would take much more work, remove a lot of material and the caliber is much more powerful than 223, so no adapter for me on S-308.

 

Are you saying you made your own adaptor? can you post any Pics? I wouold be intrested in seeing it.

 

Dont have the detailed picture, but overall here it is:

 

 

Very impressive. You are a talented individual. Good job.

[BKLYN_C 14]

Very impressive. You are a talented individual. Good job.

 

Thanks, but its not a talent. Just 2 hours of steel cutting, bending and brazing. Oh, and a lot of measuring and fitting

Here are the pictures close up

 

 

 

 

The peice of rubber tubing works as a spring for AR mag lock

[The Sarge 34]

I enjoy a project just as much as the next guy. I have modified/cut/welded/tapped/drilled damn near every gun you could think of and many many Saiga's. I have a 5 axis mill, drill press and a turret lathe. I have a tool box that is taller than me filled with every tool known to man. I have air compressors and welders out the ying yang and am proficient with all the above.

 

I have read and listened to all the end of the world scenarios. Picking up dead folks magazines et al.

 

I have been shot/stabbed and slashed. I have put a living human being in my sights and converted him to the after world. More than once.

 

I just cannot get my ears around going through all this for what? The ability to run around with AR mags? I pick up 30 or 20 round Surefire mags for $25 bucks all day long at the gun show. I have converted all my Saiga 5.56's. I have threaded barrels etc. But I just cannot get to the point of doing two things to any of my S5.56's.....and that is painting them and this magwell conversion. I see MissArms has the 30 round Surefires for under $30 bucks now retail.

 

I dont "look down" on anybody that does this for sure.....a man's firearm is like his GF/Wife.....whatever floats your boat.....I just have held my big mouth for a long time over this subject and thought I would "share" my thoughts on the subject.

 

I will go to time out on my own now.

 

PS: That is some nice work in the post above me for sure.

Edited October 13, 2010 by The Sarge

[BKLYN_C 14]

I enjoy a project just as much as the next guy. I have modified/cut/welded/tapped/drilled damn near every gun you could think of and many many Saiga's. I have a 5 axis mill, drill press and a turret lathe. I have a tool box that is taller than me filled with every tool known to man. I have air compressors and welders out the ying yang and am proficient with all the above.

 

I have read and listened to all the end of the world scenarios. Picking up dead folks magazines et al.

 

I have been shot/stabbed and slashed. I have put a living human being in my sights and converted him to the after world. More than once.

 

I just cannot get my ears around going through all this for what? The ability to run around with AR mags? I pick up 30 or 20 round Surefire mags for $25 bucks all day long at the gun show. I have converted all my Saiga 5.56's. I have threaded barrels etc. But I just cannot get to the point of doing two things to any of my S5.56's.....and that is painting them and this magwell conversion. I see MissArms has the 30 round Surefires for under $30 bucks now retail.

 

I dont "look down" on anybody that does this for sure.....a man's firearm is like his GF/Wife.....whatever floats your boat.....I just have held my big mouth for a long time over this subject and thought I would "share" my thoughts on the subject.

 

I will go to time out on my own now.

 

PS: That is some nice work in the post above me for sure.

 

Damn, I definitely need to get some mill and lathe. Thats going to be a b-day present to myself after I get the bonus.

 

Back on the topic, for residents of NY and few other states the 30 round capacity of a magazine can be achieved only this way. Well, maybe one can find old Galil mags, but those are hard to come by. We still have the AWB laws and only mags prior to 1994 are GTG. This is the main reason why I went this road.

But besides the legal issues, there is also an economic one. Orlites are cheap as dirt and preban AR mags can get for around $10 off ARFCOM. I dint have to pay north of $100 for the adapter, so its win-win for me