t165 30 Posted January 9, 2015 Report Share Posted January 9, 2015 (edited) I have a chance to purchase a AR-15 Bushmaster carbine upper with the fixed carry handle. It is chambered in 5.56 Nato. There is no threading on the barrel for any muzzle device. The gentleman selling the upper claims to be a retired Illinois State Trooper. The upper is in almost new condition. He says he received it from the State of Illinois upon retirement. The price is $300.00. I don't visit AR forums often due to all the rudeness. I just got tired of fighting with folks all the time. Can anyone give me any advice on this upper. What's it worth? Why no barrel threading? I'm not a big AR fan (love Kalashnikovs). Edited January 9, 2015 by t165 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
YOT 3,743 Posted January 9, 2015 Report Share Posted January 9, 2015 (edited) A flash hider is to aid someone in combat from secreting their location. It has nothing to do with accuracy of the barrel. It is also not a compensator to help hold the muzzle down. Not needed on an AR except for tactical, tacticool, or battle operations. Most hunting, target, and match AR barrels are not threaded. The price is pretty good. http://www.bushmaster.com/products.asp?cat=6 ETA: Link ONLY posted for direct price comparison purposes. (Thanks, Pyzik) Edited January 9, 2015 by YOT Quote Link to post Share on other sites
pyzik 597 Posted January 9, 2015 Report Share Posted January 9, 2015 (edited) My opinion would be a NO. Especially with a fixed carry handle. Does it come with a BCG and charging handle?If so, that makes the deal okay. I still wouldn't buy it if was me.No, a muzzle device is not needed but they're nice to have.For the same price (plus shipping) you can get a similar quality flat top upper, with a threaded muzzle from PSA (including BCG and charging handle). For only just shy of $70 more you can get a GREAT upper with an FN cold hammer forged barrel, and full mil-spec, MP/HP tested BCG. EDIT: Just remembered I'm not supposed to post links. Go to palmettostatearmorty . com and click the AR15 tab then click barreled uppers. Edited January 9, 2015 by Pyzik Quote Link to post Share on other sites
semper299 284 Posted January 9, 2015 Report Share Posted January 9, 2015 With AR parts as cheap as they are right now, it really is just a meh deal. And that is IF it includes the bolt carrier group and charging handle. If not, I would offer $200. If it does include the BCG and CH, then maybe offer $250. But like someone else said, you can get better or at least similar quality, brand new, for about the same price and have it shipped to your house. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
magsite20 1,664 Posted January 9, 2015 Report Share Posted January 9, 2015 others pretty well covered the worth as to the why no threaded barrel, my guess was it was from the bad old days of the ban AWB as was stated a flash suppresser for most real world use is just a tacticool thing not a performance enhancement 3 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
BigChongus 765 Posted January 9, 2015 Report Share Posted January 9, 2015 (edited) I'd vote no. You can build yourself a nice new PSA upper for around that price and have a FN barrel when it's all said and done. ETA: just realized Pyzik already had this covered. Edited January 9, 2015 by W8lifter Quote Link to post Share on other sites
t165 30 Posted January 9, 2015 Author Report Share Posted January 9, 2015 Thanks for the replys. I went ahead and purchased the upper for $250. I haggled. It includes the bolt and charging handle. I just thought it strange a 16 inch barrel wasn't threaded. I don't ever remember seeing one that short absent threads. I admit I do not know much about AR's. I was told it's 4150 steel and chromed lined.....if that makes a difference. Again, thanks. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
BigChongus 765 Posted January 9, 2015 Report Share Posted January 9, 2015 Thanks for the replys. I went ahead and purchased the upper for $250. I haggled. It includes the bolt and charging handle. I just thought it strange a 16 inch barrel wasn't threaded. I don't ever remember seeing one that short absent threads. I admit I do not know much about AR's. I was told it's 4150 steel and chromed lined.....if that makes a difference. Again, thanks. With the BCG and CH included, that's actually not too bad of a deal at all. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
HB of CJ 1,263 Posted January 10, 2015 Report Share Posted January 10, 2015 (edited) Did the seller go into great detail WHY he sold it? If everything checks out OK, (you ARE going to have it checked out aren't you?) then you $scored$ well. Before I would shoot it, I would do the following inspections, but this is just me. Tear it all down and inspect the parts, especially the bolt head stuff. No need to pull the ejector; they usually give no trouble. Head space the bolt, make sure it does not close on that infamous civilian "field" head space gage. 5.56 x45 military spec chambers do tolerate looser head space. The bolt can close on a "NO GO" gage and still be OK as long as it does not close on the "FIELD" gage. Check the bolt lugs and barrel extension for wear. Probably no need to ... ... gage the throat and muzzle. Make sure it is chrome lined, which is a plus. ID the bolt carrier type. It might make a difference where you live. State laws. Probably no need to run a barrel straightness gage through the bore either. The cam pin wear is a pretty good indication on how the gun was handled, fired and cleaned. Check the firing pin tip for wear. Some polishing on the carrier body is OK and is normal. Make sure the key bolts are tight. They do NOT need to be staked. Just torqued up to first finger end knuckle pressure with a dinky wrench handle about 6 inches long. Make sure the key is centered. Big one ... make sure the gas tube is perfectly centered, does not strike the key and is not bent sideways. Is the delta ring plastic or aluminum? Do the hand guards have liners? Did your get hand guards? Does the front site base have taper pins or cheap roll pins? What is the barrel twist rate? 1X7 is best. It should be plainly marked on the barrel. Charging handles usually give no problems. What kind of assist knob does it have? Does it have one? Who made the upper? A1 or A2 rear sights? I for one would have held out for a threaded muzzle, but that again is just me. HB of CJ (old coot) PEM me if you want to for more stuff. All of this stuff added up makes a big difference. Some or a few items together may not make that much difference. Enjoy. Edited by HB. Sorry for the long post. I tend to do this. A dubious social skill. Yes I know my shit regarding AR15 rifles having built hundreds and assisted doing uncounted M16 rebuilds, but long ago and far away. Wish I knew more about gardening. Edited January 10, 2015 by HB of CJ Quote Link to post Share on other sites
t165 30 Posted January 10, 2015 Author Report Share Posted January 10, 2015 For better or worse I now own the upper. Here is a couple pictures of what I purchased. The upper doesn't look to have been used much. I'll have my gunsmith check it out to make sure everything is in spec and safe to shoot. 2 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
BigChongus 765 Posted January 10, 2015 Report Share Posted January 10, 2015 Looks good. Now send it to Adco and get it threaded. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
HB of CJ 1,263 Posted January 10, 2015 Report Share Posted January 10, 2015 Looks very good indeed. Yep ... you $scored$ big. It is easy to do your own inspection, or like already said before me better, just let a good AR15 gunsmith look at it. Person to person sales sometimes give me pause ... I did not mean to rain on your parade. Sorry. Great pictures. I need to learn how to do that. HB 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Spacehog 2,218 Posted January 10, 2015 Report Share Posted January 10, 2015 It is definitely a post ban, pre-ban sunset upper. Assuming everything is good to go, which I doubt that it is not, $250 is not a bad price. It is a 1:9 twist heavy barrel. 1:7's will allow you to shoot heavier grain bullets, but I have actually found that 1:9 twists tend to be more accurate with 55-62gr bullets, which accounts for most of the ammo currently on the market. If some thing is not up to snuff, replacement parts are cheap and plentiful. Shoot it and enjoy it. Lowers are ridiculously cheap right now. You can have a complete rifle for around 400-450 bucks. No need to thread the barrel unless you just want to. 4 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
BigChongus 765 Posted January 10, 2015 Report Share Posted January 10, 2015 AIM has Bushmaster lowers for $50 shipped right now. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Spacehog 2,218 Posted January 10, 2015 Report Share Posted January 10, 2015 I have seen Anderson lowers are as cheap as $39. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
t165 30 Posted January 10, 2015 Author Report Share Posted January 10, 2015 Thanks guys. $50.00 or less to complete a AR rifle looks pretty sweet to me. Maybe I'll grow to like it. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
BigChongus 765 Posted January 10, 2015 Report Share Posted January 10, 2015 It'll be just a bit more than that to complete it, since you need to finish building the lower, but PSA has a great deal on a complete mil-spec lower build kit for $85. Figure just a touch over $400 total by the time you pay transfer fees and shipping. Assuming your upper is good to go, that's a sweet little ~$400 rifle. 3 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
t165 30 Posted January 10, 2015 Author Report Share Posted January 10, 2015 Okay. Like I said....I don't know much about AR's. I'll figure all the aftermarket stuff out. I'm on AIM right now. My gunsmith is a close friend. He'll make sure it's all done correctly.....I hope. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Spacehog 2,218 Posted January 10, 2015 Report Share Posted January 10, 2015 I am sure it will be fine. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
mostholycerebus 415 Posted January 10, 2015 Report Share Posted January 10, 2015 Nice. Decent deal for what it is. I would spring for the slightly more expensive $50 Bushmaster lower just to keep it all Bushmaster. Then a Palmetto State Armory lower parts kit for $40-$50 and a stock kit for $50+. Personally, with a 1/9 heavy barrel I would go for an accuracy build and get an A2 or Vltor A5 stock, drop in an ALG ACT trigger and JP springs and get shooting. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
XD45 7,124 Posted January 10, 2015 Report Share Posted January 10, 2015 I have seen Anderson lowers are as cheap as $39. So have I. I'm looking at one right now. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
semper299 284 Posted January 10, 2015 Report Share Posted January 10, 2015 Get the bushmaster lower from AIM. The resale value will be more if the upper and lower are the same flavor. Not that you are going to sell it, but it won't hurt to spend $11 more and get the Bushy lower. 2 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
sjgusmc21 850 Posted January 11, 2015 Report Share Posted January 11, 2015 (edited) ^Agree with the above! When I built mine, I was not so worried about the same manufacturer parts, but the most bang for my buck and staying mil spec as much as possible. Plus I am not into the high-speed, low-drag M4 stuff. Mine is what I carried for many, many years....M16A2 minus the 3 round burst. Plus, I elected for 1/7 barrel, as I desire to shoot heavier grain bullets as well. I like the handle carry top, but that is just me. Have fun, these things are like lego's for grown men! Did I say, have fun? If not, have fun! Edited January 11, 2015 by sjgusmc21 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Spacehog 2,218 Posted January 11, 2015 Report Share Posted January 11, 2015 FWIW, I agree with getting the Bushmaster lower to match the upper. People like to see a gun that matches. $11 is chump change for the perceived value of an original gun. Just wanted to point out how ridiculously cheap AR lowers have gotten. Personally, I am still partial to Spikes lowers and will pay a little more for 'em. 2 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
mancat 2,368 Posted January 11, 2015 Report Share Posted January 11, 2015 Now you need the carry handle 4x optic for full 1980s action 2 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
t165 30 Posted January 12, 2015 Author Report Share Posted January 12, 2015 That makes sense. I'll go with a Bushmaster lower. Not that some are better or worse but perhaps the carpets should match the drapes. I owned a DPMS AR years ago. I shot (1) 30 round magazine through it and placed it back in my safe. It sat there for years. Then, when Obama got in and AR's were popping up everywhere I handled a Rock River at my local gun shop. I liked the trigger on the Rock River better than the DPMS. I traded in my DPMS for the Rock River AR. Then, a couple of days later, I purchased another Rock River AR exactly like it at the same gun shop due to the fear AR's were to be banned. I have never fired either of the Rock River Ar's. One is still in my closet in the plastic carry case in the original wrapper. I just don't like how AR's are set up. I much prefer Kalashnikovs. You have to punch yourself in the nose to chamber a round in a AR while prone. I have eight Kalashnikovs and they are fun. Four converted Saiga's. I don't like the idea of direct impingement and all the fouling it causes. Thanks for all the help and advice with this Bushmaster upper. If someone has a Saiga to trade I will deal. 2 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
semper299 284 Posted January 12, 2015 Report Share Posted January 12, 2015 That makes sense. I'll go with a Bushmaster lower. Not that some are better or worse but perhaps the carpets should match the drapes. I owned a DPMS AR years ago. I shot (1) 30 round magazine through it and placed it back in my safe. It sat there for years. Then, when Obama got in and AR's were popping up everywhere I handled a Rock River at my local gun shop. I liked the trigger on the Rock River better than the DPMS. I traded in my DPMS for the Rock River AR. Then, a couple of days later, I purchased another Rock River AR exactly like it at the same gun shop due to the fear AR's were to be banned. I have never fired either of the Rock River Ar's. One is still in my closet in the plastic carry case in the original wrapper. I just don't like how AR's are set up. I much prefer Kalashnikovs. You have to punch yourself in the nose to chamber a round in a AR while prone. I have eight Kalashnikovs and they are fun. Four converted Saiga's. I don't like the idea of direct impingement and all the fouling it causes. Thanks for all the help and advice with this Bushmaster upper. If someone has a Saiga to trade I will deal. That made me spit coffee. I have extended latches on all mine, and yes, I still occasionally punch myself. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
mancat 2,368 Posted January 12, 2015 Report Share Posted January 12, 2015 it is a surprise to me that there aren't many side-charged AR uppers, but it has been done Quote Link to post Share on other sites
james lambert 3,059 Posted January 12, 2015 Report Share Posted January 12, 2015 Reciprocating charging handles are crude.Right side charging handles are only correct for lefties several more advanced designs are out there 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
t165 30 Posted January 13, 2015 Author Report Share Posted January 13, 2015 I didn't know they made side charging uppers for AR's. Maybe I'm dumber than a bag of hammers but I am going to look into buying one of those. I hope they are not too expensive. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
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