BrutalGardener 205 Posted July 15, 2009 Report Share Posted July 15, 2009 So, I need some advice... I'm repainting my S12's receiver. I picked the Black Duplicolor 500 Degree Low-gloss Engine Enamel for the job. I decided to try it on the dust-cover first. I degreased the metal using Duplicolor prep pads, worked it over with ScorthBrite pads, blew away the debris with a can of compressed air and then wiped it with a clean piece of cloth soaked in 99% isopropyl, followed by a dry piece of cloth. I then hung the dust-cover on a tree branch and applied a couple of coast of Duplicolor Sandable Primer 10 minutes apart and let it sit for an hour. I then applied 2 light and 1 heavy coat of the enamel, also 10 minutes apart. Almost a day later, I am not very impressed by the results. See the pics. Some parts of the dust-cover look good and uniform black, while other parts look grayish, instead of black, as if some gray residue is sitting on top of the paint. I tried wiping it away with a piece of cloth and it's actually working, though the paint underneath ends up looking way too glossy. Any way, I'm going to paint the whole receiver soon and would like to avoid similar issues. So, can someone please tell me what could be the problem and where I went wrong with this? Any additional tips that you might have will also be appreciated. Thanks a bunch! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
JK-47 33 Posted July 16, 2009 Report Share Posted July 16, 2009 I've used the duplicolor 500 degree enamel too, and I find it to be borderline adaquate, it's better than bare metal anyway. I cleaned the parts with acetone, parkerized them, rinsed in water, and let dry. Then just spray on the enamel; light, even coats, allow 10 minutes to dry and flip the parts to spray the other side. On parts that didn't need parkerizing I just gave them an acetone wash, air dried and painted. I suspect that residue has to do with all the primer coats, or leftover residue from the isoprophyl alcohol. Make sure to wash the parts with fairly clean solvent. Oddly enough I got some similar odd powdery look on my top cover as well, but it seems to have gone away after oiling the surface. Acetone will remove the Duplicolor 500 degree enamel if you want to start again. It will also remove some of the stock sagia paint, turning the solvent purple in the process. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
cellsworth 21 Posted July 16, 2009 Report Share Posted July 16, 2009 I prep the parts by scuff sanding, and cleaning/degreasing with acetone. Then I apply the paint in thin even coats as JK-47 said. I have always gotten good results. I tend to agree with JK-47's diagnosis of the problem. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
BrutalGardener 205 Posted July 16, 2009 Author Report Share Posted July 16, 2009 It sucks to hear that Duplicolor Engine Enamel is just "barely adequate". From reading a bunch of old painting threads, I got the impression that it's about as good as the original paint, which would be good enough for me. Isn't it? It turns out that I was able to simply wipe off all that gray residue with a soft cloth, without even rubbing it hard. The cover looks very good now. I now painted the receiver and didn't get any residue on it. It must be some dust-cover specific phenomena - some material that they put on it. I think that 99% isopropyl is a decent choice for cleaning the surface. It's not supposed to leave much residue, as it's commonly used to prep CPU's before applying the thermal paste and attaching the heatsink, as well as other electronic component cleaning. Any way, I was going to apply three coats to the receiver, but ran out of paint after the second one. I don't know whether to leave it as is or apply another coat in a week. The two coats that I did apply were solid. I did apply three coats of primer before-hand. Any advice on that? The paint job looks pretty decent, considering that I've pretty much never painted any thing metal before. It looks about as good as the stuff that Arsenal Inc put on my SGL-20. I decided to repaint the S12 receiver because I screwed up my post-conversion paint touch up. I used some cheap-ass masking tape and a can of cheap, generic Rustoleum type of stuff. The stuff reacted with the adhesive on the tape and the factory paint, creating streaks of sticky, purple goo, which was really hard to remove and left bare metal in its place. :< Quote Link to post Share on other sites
JK-47 33 Posted July 17, 2009 Report Share Posted July 17, 2009 It's alright paint, it matches the saiga's factory paint pretty well and stands up to abuse almost as well. If it hasn't fully cured you can scrape it right off with metal to metal contact, give the stuff a week to cure if you have that level of patience. Also, a good solvent like acetone will eat it right off, something the saiga paint is more resistant to. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
paprotective 362 Posted July 17, 2009 Report Share Posted July 17, 2009 I used hi-temp 1200' Barbecue BLACK.. Rustoleum ALMOND (see pic on left). Covered the black easily. I'd use the BLACK same stuff without hesitation to redo the receiver... Doing conversion soon and will be re-touching the bottom 1/2 with Hi-Temp Rustoleum Black 1200'. $6/can. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
BrutalGardener 205 Posted July 17, 2009 Author Report Share Posted July 17, 2009 It's alright paint, it matches the saiga's factory paint pretty well and stands up to abuse almost as well. If it hasn't fully cured you can scrape it right off with metal to metal contact, give the stuff a week to cure if you have that level of patience. Also, a good solvent like acetone will eat it right off, something the saiga paint is more resistant to. I'm going to try to hold out for a week. I just got my Chaos tri-rail, Gunfixer plug, SAW pistol grip (my original pistol grip was a PoS that failed) and some AGP mags today. It's going to be hard. I don't plan on soaking the gun in nail polish any time soon. As far as the factory paint, I noticed that isopropyl thins it out pretty good after some moderate rubbing. A patch soaked with Hoppe's #9 also catches some black on it. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Lone Star Arms 2,047 Posted October 2, 2009 Report Share Posted October 2, 2009 Apply the Duplicolor sparingly and evenly. Use just enough to cover, and wait for it to completely dry to the touch before applying the next coat. You shouldn't need more than two or three coats - max. I think you will find your results are much more satisfactory. The instructions on the can are for painting engine parts, and aren't really useful for painting guns. If used the way I have suggested, I think you will find it is excellent paint for the S12, easy to apply, and easy to touch up. My guns get lots of use, sometimes take a beating, and no matter what finish I have used, I have found that the finish will invariably get scratched, marred, whatever. Duplicolor is very easy to touch up, and takes the abuse very well. WS 2 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Lone Star Arms 2,047 Posted October 2, 2009 Report Share Posted October 2, 2009 Apply the Duplicolor sparingly and evenly. Use just enough to cover, and wait for it to completely dry to the touch before applying the next coat. You shouldn't need more than two or three coats - max. I think you will find your results are much more satisfactory. The instructions on the can are for painting engine parts, and aren't really useful for painting guns. If used the way I have suggested, I think you will find it is excellent paint for the S12, easy to apply, and easy to touch up. My guns get lots of use, sometimes take a beating, and no matter what finish I have used, I have found that the finish will invariably get scratched, marred, whatever. Duplicolor is very easy to touch up, and takes the abuse very well. WS Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Gibbles 23 Posted October 2, 2009 Report Share Posted October 2, 2009 I used this http://www.brownells.com/.aspx/pid=1117/Product/ALUMA_HYDE_reg__II Cheap and durable, the only down side is it takes about a week or more for a full cure. I used krylon on one of my AK's and baked it, it worked ok, but after a while it started to chip away. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
eddieb 1 Posted October 23, 2009 Report Share Posted October 23, 2009 I used hi-temp 1200' Barbecue BLACK.. Rustoleum ALMOND (see pic on left). Covered the black easily. I'd use the BLACK same stuff without hesitation to redo the receiver... Doing conversion soon and will be re-touching the bottom 1/2 with Hi-Temp Rustoleum Black 1200'. $6/can. +1 on the BBQ Hi temp paint. Did mine recently and it came out great. Holding up well, too. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
avatar 4 Posted October 27, 2009 Report Share Posted October 27, 2009 After using duplicolor 30 mins to an hour baking in the oven at 250 to 350* cures the finish and makes it as durable as anything else. Brownells has some spray on baking laquers that are awesome, but the engine enamels are more than adequate for cheap. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
sjgusmc21 850 Posted October 28, 2009 Report Share Posted October 28, 2009 I have to say I am highly impressed with Aluma-Hyde II from Brownells. This stuff is really tuff. And you definitely have more patience then I do! I have done 4, 30 round Bulg. magazines (steel), 1 forty round Steel, my UTG Hand guard, (all in OD) Phantom flash suppressor (flat black), and just finished my 870 shotgun last night, in OD, and Dark Earth. It states that the curing can take up to 2 weeks, but what I have done is paint the parts, then bake them in the oven at 175-185 for 1.5 hours. Let them cool and assemble the parts. So far I have not had one blemish, mark, etc. I use Carburetor and Brake cleaner to degrease, the 409 and HOT water, air dry (or blow dryer if there is a lot of cracks and crevices), paint and bake. If the part has cheap paint on it, I Have stripped it, and painted bare metal. My 870 was parkerized, so all I did was ensure it was completely degreased before I painted. I used the High Heat BBQ paint when I did my conversion, and CLP gummed it all up. I will say that I was very surprised by Krylon Textured Black paint. Clp didn't touch it, and I had to coat it twice with Paint stripper to get it to start pealing off. I always used 409 as my last treatment to ensure all left over grease/Clp/fingerprints and residue is off. Off course, thoroughly rinse after using 409. Hope this helps. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
cmroles 0 Posted November 4, 2009 Report Share Posted November 4, 2009 I used hi-temp 1200' Barbecue BLACK.. Rustoleum ALMOND (see pic on left). Covered the black easily. I'd use the BLACK same stuff without hesitation to redo the receiver... Doing conversion soon and will be re-touching the bottom 1/2 with Hi-Temp Rustoleum Black 1200'. $6/can. +1 on the BBQ Hi temp paint. Did mine recently and it came out great. Holding up well, too. Same here. I just touched-up the bottom of the receiver during my conversion with the Rustoleum 1200' Flat Black. Very close match to the rest of the weapon and so far seems to be durable enough. Someday I'd like to try out a full Duracoat job, but its more than good enough for now. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
rocinante 100 Posted November 21, 2009 Report Share Posted November 21, 2009 I use the Duplicolor and it comes out okay. What is nice is it does dry pretty fast and seems to be reasonably durable. Never a problem with it flaking off or rubbing off with run of the mill gun cleaning chemicals. The original russian finish was a lot worst. I used the Rustoleum 1200 and it never cured even with baking. It was a smudgy mess. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
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