bullsi1911 2 Posted May 16, 2011 Report Share Posted May 16, 2011 I took my new, unconverted Saiga out on Saturday for some testing with various rounds I had laying about. I'll post the vid later, but here is my concern: It ran 100% flawlessly on every round. With the stock gas port set on #1, it fed, fired and ejected every shell I had laying around. 10 year old Federal and Winchester #7, buckshot, slugs, a 3" steel shot magnum or two... it ate everything. I even loaded one 5 round mag with a 3" Magnum, a slug, buckshot, Win #7.5 and Federal #7.5. It fired them all from top to bottom with no hangups as fast as I could work the trigger. So, now I'm worried. From everything I have read, the low power shells should not work well on setting #1. Is my gun overgassed? Am I just crazy and I should just smile and be happy that mine works so well? I'm going to start the conversion soon, but I just need to know if there is some action I need to take to make sure this gun lasts. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Paulyski 2,227 Posted May 16, 2011 Report Share Posted May 16, 2011 Good to hear it works, but get a V-plug, it's longer, therefore more able to cover the ports if your gas plug's threads are off. Sounds like your gas plug isn't in far enough in on setting 1 to choke it down. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Lone Star Arms 2,047 Posted May 16, 2011 Report Share Posted May 16, 2011 I took my new, unconverted Saiga out on Saturday for some testing with various rounds I had laying about. I'll post the vid later, but here is my concern: It ran 100% flawlessly on every round. With the stock gas port set on #1, it fed, fired and ejected every shell I had laying around. 10 year old Federal and Winchester #7, buckshot, slugs, a 3" steel shot magnum or two... it ate everything. I even loaded one 5 round mag with a 3" Magnum, a slug, buckshot, Win #7.5 and Federal #7.5. It fired them all from top to bottom with no hangups as fast as I could work the trigger. So, now I'm worried. From everything I have read, the low power shells should not work well on setting #1. Is my gun overgassed? Am I just crazy and I should just smile and be happy that mine works so well? I'm going to start the conversion soon, but I just need to know if there is some action I need to take to make sure this gun lasts. Sounds like you have a winner right out of the box. They almost never run that way. Your gun is probably one in ten thousand. If it were my gun, I would leave it just as is. If you're worried about the rear trunnion, just pick up a black jack buffer from the Saiga 12 E-store here, or from CSS. Congratulations! Post Script: S12s that run well out of the box typically loose some (or a lot of) efficiency after conversion. You may find that your gun does not run as well after it is converted. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
lunker 7 Posted May 16, 2011 Report Share Posted May 16, 2011 I am no expert, but I would say yes. If your gun cycles weak ammo on the 1 setting, it means there is enough gas going through the system to really pound your gun with the stouter ammo. The MD Arms gas plug is a cheap solution, since you are not going to be plugging any gas ports or making them smaller. The plug gives you five gas levels. The low gas settings should be enough to compensate for too much gas. I think other people's advice will be close to mine, but wait and take it all in. Good luck. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
erwos 12 Posted May 16, 2011 Report Share Posted May 16, 2011 Sounds like a good gun for a Tac47 auto plug. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
lunker 7 Posted May 16, 2011 Report Share Posted May 16, 2011 My fiance says I am overgassed. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Lone Star Arms 2,047 Posted May 16, 2011 Report Share Posted May 16, 2011 My fiance says I am overgassed. :lolol: Quote Link to post Share on other sites
RoughRider666 47 Posted May 16, 2011 Report Share Posted May 16, 2011 I took my new, unconverted Saiga out on Saturday for some testing with various rounds I had laying about. I'll post the vid later, but here is my concern: It ran 100% flawlessly on every round. With the stock gas port set on #1, it fed, fired and ejected every shell I had laying around. 10 year old Federal and Winchester #7, buckshot, slugs, a 3" steel shot magnum or two... it ate everything. I even loaded one 5 round mag with a 3" Magnum, a slug, buckshot, Win #7.5 and Federal #7.5. It fired them all from top to bottom with no hangups as fast as I could work the trigger. So, now I'm worried. From everything I have read, the low power shells should not work well on setting #1. Is my gun overgassed? Am I just crazy and I should just smile and be happy that mine works so well? I'm going to start the conversion soon, but I just need to know if there is some action I need to take to make sure this gun lasts. Sounds like you have a winner right out of the box. They almost never run that way. Your gun is probably one in ten thousand. If it were my gun, I would leave it just as is. If you're worried about the rear trunnion, just pick up a black jack buffer from the Saiga 12 E-store here, or from CSS. Congratulations! Post Script: S12s that run well out of the box typically loose some (or a lot of) efficiency after conversion. You may find that your gun does not run as well after it is converted. Buffers can actually cause damage to the receiver and trunnion by not allowing the bolt carrier to cycle all the way back and by hitting the buffer causing extra unneeded impact to the trunnion causing cracking. I took my buffers out of all my guns. Do some homework on this subject, and im sure others here will chime in with their knowledge and experience. I just dont wanna see you ruin your gun. -RR Quote Link to post Share on other sites
shades_of_grey 1,092 Posted May 16, 2011 Report Share Posted May 16, 2011 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
nattyiceking 33 Posted May 16, 2011 Report Share Posted May 16, 2011 I am no expert, but I would say yes. If your gun cycles weak ammo on the 1 setting, it means there is enough gas going through the system to really pound your gun with the stouter ammo. The MD Arms gas plug is a cheap solution, since you are not going to be plugging any gas ports or making them smaller. The plug gives you five gas levels. The low gas settings should be enough to compensate for too much gas. I think other people's advice will be close to mine, but wait and take it all in. Good luck. +1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Lone Star Arms 2,047 Posted May 16, 2011 Report Share Posted May 16, 2011 I took my new, unconverted Saiga out on Saturday for some testing with various rounds I had laying about. I'll post the vid later, but here is my concern: It ran 100% flawlessly on every round. With the stock gas port set on #1, it fed, fired and ejected every shell I had laying around. 10 year old Federal and Winchester #7, buckshot, slugs, a 3" steel shot magnum or two... it ate everything. I even loaded one 5 round mag with a 3" Magnum, a slug, buckshot, Win #7.5 and Federal #7.5. It fired them all from top to bottom with no hangups as fast as I could work the trigger. So, now I'm worried. From everything I have read, the low power shells should not work well on setting #1. Is my gun overgassed? Am I just crazy and I should just smile and be happy that mine works so well? I'm going to start the conversion soon, but I just need to know if there is some action I need to take to make sure this gun lasts. Sounds like you have a winner right out of the box. They almost never run that way. Your gun is probably one in ten thousand. If it were my gun, I would leave it just as is. If you're worried about the rear trunnion, just pick up a black jack buffer from the Saiga 12 E-store here, or from CSS. Congratulations! Post Script: S12s that run well out of the box typically loose some (or a lot of) efficiency after conversion. You may find that your gun does not run as well after it is converted. Buffers can actually cause damage to the receiver and trunnion by not allowing the bolt carrier to cycle all the way back and by hitting the buffer causing extra unneeded impact to the trunnion causing cracking. I took my buffers out of all my guns. Do some homework on this subject, and im sure others here will chime in with their knowledge and experience. I just dont wanna see you ruin your gun. -RR I'm laughing because this kind of contradictory information is typical on the S12 forum... All too often different points of view lead to pissing matches and flame wars. I say to each his own. I build these guns every day and have more range time in with them than I care to think about.. My suggestion is just that. A suggestion based upon my own experience - you may choose to take my advice or not. Makc the forum owner has successfully run buffers in his guns for years and swears by them. I personally have never seen a buffer do damage to a trunnion or anything else, and have no problem installing them for my clients when they ask for them. Good luck wading through, and sorting out differing points of view here, and good luck with your new gun! 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
TwentyNizzo 66 Posted May 16, 2011 Report Share Posted May 16, 2011 The problem in your gun most likely lies in the random threading of the gas block and gas plug. Setting 1 on your gun is probably closer to setting 2 on most guns. The only real way to confirm this is to remove the gas block and screw the plug in, but for now an aftermarket plug would be a good choice to limit gas. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Bvamp 604 Posted May 16, 2011 Report Share Posted May 16, 2011 if the gun is truly over gassed, the real damage will occur on the op rod first, in that it will bend or break, with 1 1/4oz 3" loads in time, or quickly. I have no suggestions, just that little tidbit of info to relay on whats going to fail first. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
csmw 98 Posted May 16, 2011 Report Share Posted May 16, 2011 I build these guns every day and have more range time in with them than I care to think about.. My suggestion is just that. A suggestion based upon my own experience - you may choose to take my advice or not. Makc the forum owner has successfully run buffers in his guns for years and swears by them. I personally have never seen a buffer do damage to a trunnion or anything else, and have no problem installing them for my clients when they ask for them. Good luck wading the through, and sorting out differing points of view here, and good luck with your new gun! Waffen, we make some of the buffers for BufferTech...we have run an AK buffer through a full-auto AK for over 60K full-auto rounds w/ no glitches. Haven't tried them on an S-12 yet. My personal gun is the 'torture/abused' tester...I'll give the buffer a try on your recommendation. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Lone Star Arms 2,047 Posted May 17, 2011 Report Share Posted May 17, 2011 I build these guns every day and have more range time in with them than I care to think about.. My suggestion is just that. A suggestion based upon my own experience - you may choose to take my advice or not. Makc the forum owner has successfully run buffers in his guns for years and swears by them. I personally have never seen a buffer do damage to a trunnion or anything else, and have no problem installing them for my clients when they ask for them. Good luck wading the through, and sorting out differing points of view here, and good luck with your new gun! Waffen, we make some of the buffers for BufferTech...we have run an AK buffer through a full-auto AK for over 60K full-auto rounds w/ no glitches. Haven't tried them on an S-12 yet. My personal gun is the 'torture/abused' tester...I'll give the buffer a try on your recommendation. 60,000 rounds with zero issues is about what I would expect. In fact I would expect that you've gone through a couple of buffers by now I've got a black jack buffer in one of my select fire S12s. It will be a while before I get that kind of round count through it, but I suspect my results will be much the same. All the same I'm interested to see what difference if any, putting a buffer in your gun makes. Thanks for your perspective 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
bullsi1911 2 Posted May 17, 2011 Author Report Share Posted May 17, 2011 Thanks for the info on the gas plug. That will definitely be swapped out for an Autoplug or V-Plug soon. Seems strange that I am going to purposely try to make a gun start jamming. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
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