DFM56 1 Posted January 11, 2012 Report Share Posted January 11, 2012 (edited) Well, I cut the shroud off of my Saiga yesterday. I tried to thread it with a 14mm die but it wouldn't cut. My father (30 years experience as a machinist) had the brilliant idea of taking some calipers to the barrel. Looks like I have a .591" barrel, unlike the .571" barrels most of them have... We're going to try to set it up in our biggest lathe at work, but neither of us are sure if it will actually fit. So, I really have two questions; 1. Since it needs to be turned down for whatever thread I want to put on it, is there any reason to use 14mm instead of 1/2x28? The brake I'm interested in (Spike's Dynacomp) is apparently going to be available in 14mm eventually, but other than that there is nothing that interests me for 14mm brakes. I originally wanted 14mm so I wouldn't have to turn the barrel down, but so much for that! 2. If we can't fit the barreled action in the lathe, can someone recommend a good smith that I can send it to for threading? Bonus points if they do cerakote since I want to get it refinished when tax returns roll in anyway. Edited January 11, 2012 by DFM56 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
DrThunder88 912 Posted January 11, 2012 Report Share Posted January 11, 2012 So long as you're taking a lathe to it, might as well go for 1/2"-28 threads. There seem to be many more options for .223 brakes and flash hiders using AR-15 threads than AK threads. This isn't to say a .223 projectile wouldn't work with a 7.62x39mm muzzle device, but the effect may be diminished. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
bopit 1 Posted January 11, 2012 Report Share Posted January 11, 2012 I threaded my 0.591" barrel using a .223 tat, cheap chinese die and lots of oil. The hardest part was getting it started. Although I wouldn't recommend it if you have other machine tools, it can be done at home. Currently the rifle has a 14mm x 1 L to 24mm x 1 R adapter and an AK-74 brake. Another thing I considered when starting this project was to turn down the very end of the barrel to allow the die to get started easier. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
DFM56 1 Posted January 17, 2012 Author Report Share Posted January 17, 2012 Bit of an update. It won't fit in the lathe. I mean, it kind of did, but we didn't want to start it because it probably would have come loose and killed someone. So I guess it didn't really fit... Anyway, I'll be calling around in the next few days to find a place that can do this. If anyone has any suggestions I would love to hear them. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
grimm100 13 Posted January 17, 2012 Report Share Posted January 17, 2012 (edited) Dinzag has a tool for rent/purchase to turn it down to the 0.571. http://dinzagarms.com/tools/mcp.html Edited January 17, 2012 by grimm100 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
The Grudge 3 Posted January 19, 2012 Report Share Posted January 19, 2012 Dinzag has a tool for rent/purchase to turn it down to the 0.571. http://dinzagarms.com/tools/mcp.html Yikes! I hate using core drills on a mill. I can't imagine using one in a hand drill. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
grimm100 13 Posted January 20, 2012 Report Share Posted January 20, 2012 Never tried myself, figured I would throw it out there. Contact Dinzag, I am sure he will be both helpful and honest. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
DFM56 1 Posted January 21, 2012 Author Report Share Posted January 21, 2012 We might be able to rig to the tool you linked to the spindle of a lathe and clamp the barrel to the tailstock. I would be much more comfortable using it that way than doing it with a cordless drill.. Right now we're going to try to stand the rifle up off of the bed of a mill and circle interpolate around the bore. Hopefully that works, but the dinzag tool is second on my list if it doesn't. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
G O B 3,516 Posted January 21, 2012 Report Share Posted January 21, 2012 If you have a large enough lathe, pop the barrel off and turn it. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
DFM56 1 Posted January 22, 2012 Author Report Share Posted January 22, 2012 The lathe is more than big enough to fit the barrel, but I don't have the equipment necessary to pull it or press it back in. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
josey88 21 Posted January 23, 2012 Report Share Posted January 23, 2012 I remember reading somewhere or seeing it on youtube , that in a case like that with a .591" barrel you use the 1/2x28 RH DIE first , to reduce the size of the barrel ... then you use the 14 x1 LH DIE to do the thread you need and finish . I think it will be a lot easier than taking it to a gunsmith and taking off the barrel . Quote Link to post Share on other sites
bulldog_shotgun 47 Posted January 25, 2012 Report Share Posted January 25, 2012 I remember reading somewhere or seeing it on youtube , that in a case like that with a .591" barrel you use the 1/2x28 RH DIE first , to reduce the size of the barrel ... then you use the 14 x1 LH DIE to do the thread you need and finish . I think it will be a lot easier than taking it to a gunsmith and taking off the barrel . this doesn't make sense to me. 14mm is larger than 1/2 inch. 14mm = .551" .500" = 12.7mm Nominal thread size is typically 2% smaller than named so a 1/2-28 threaded bbl measures .490 thats because standards call for a 75% of Pitch thread engagement. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
josey88 21 Posted January 25, 2012 Report Share Posted January 25, 2012 (edited) I remember reading somewhere or seeing it on youtube , that in a case like that with a .591" barrel you use the 1/2x28 RH DIE first , to reduce the size of the barrel ... then you use the 14 x1 LH DIE to do the thread you need and finish . I think it will be a lot easier than taking it to a gunsmith and taking off the barrel . this doesn't make sense to me. 14mm is larger than 1/2 inch. 14mm = .551" .500" = 12.7mm Nominal thread size is typically 2% smaller than named so a 1/2-28 threaded bbl measures .490 thats because standards call for a 75% of Pitch thread engagement. I must to had it wrong ... then it is another Die`s size , but I remember reading that this guy used another Die size to reduce the barrel as an effective method of doing it without the need for the Lathe and that the Die was right handed , also . Then , he used the 14 to 1 LH Die to finish . Obviously , I got the size wrong . I think it would be worth to look it up , in case it cut really work ... I read it about 6 months ago or so . Maybe it was a 5/8 to 24 RH... ? Am sorry I can not be more accurate on the spec ... I just can`t remember the damn Die`s size . Edited January 25, 2012 by josey88 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
g21322635 2 Posted February 14, 2012 Report Share Posted February 14, 2012 I got a larger barrel also and ordered the kit from Dinzag to thread my barrel it is the same size as the HK thread different but you have to go with the diameter of the barrel to fit the FH. He has a scale on his site to tell which dies to use on barrel diameter. Good kit worked well still on the rifle. He had a FH for that thread pitch in stock and it works great. Good luck. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
DFM56 1 Posted February 14, 2012 Author Report Share Posted February 14, 2012 opps, forgot to update this! We took it in a few weeks ago, made a fixture for the bridgeport and circle-interpolated around the bore. The normal 14mm die worked fine after that, so it's threaded now. It shot very well with just a slant brake I had kicking around, can't wait to get something a bit better. I find it funny that we have a lathe big enough to make drive shafts for industrial mixers (I can't even carry one of those things without help!) and we had to 'turn' the barrel down on a mill.. Should be concentric enough for a 7.62 brake and thats all I care about. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
SgtRaven 531 Posted February 19, 2012 Report Share Posted February 19, 2012 (edited) Good post, thanks for the information and update. I'm awaiting my 1/2 x 28 TAT and DPMS Miculek AR muzzle brake, having die and handle on hand already. Trying to list all my options, including SHTF scenarios. --- P.S.: No blood or tears, but plenty of sweat. Got my barrel threaded. Came out pretty good and works fine, but had to machine barrel OD down to ~.520. I'd never finish threading without such prep work. Edited February 24, 2012 by Sgt. Raven 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
pyzik 597 Posted November 19, 2012 Report Share Posted November 19, 2012 Good post, thanks for the information and update. I'm awaiting my 1/2 x 28 TAT and DPMS Miculek AR muzzle brake, having die and handle on hand already. Trying to list all my options, including SHTF scenarios. --- P.S.: No blood or tears, but plenty of sweat. Got my barrel threaded. Came out pretty good and works fine, but had to machine barrel OD down to ~.520. I'd never finish threading without such prep work. I know I am totally resurecting a dead thread here... But Sgt., you machined the muzzle down your self? I am wanting to get my .223 threaded to 12"x28 and am having a hard time finding someone local to accomplish this. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
SgtRaven 531 Posted November 20, 2012 Report Share Posted November 20, 2012 (edited) Yes, I did it by myself. Preparation is the key here, and patience is a must. If you ever threaded anything, then threading is not a big deal. TURNING YOUR BARREL DOWN IS! It is entirely up to you, but making few inquiries and checking on TOTAL cost (including UPS-ing your gun at very inexpensive "long rifle" rate both ways) might not be bad at all. Some customizing shops post decent rates for threading the Saiga barrel. I'll follow up with PM. Edited November 26, 2012 by Sgt. Raven Quote Link to post Share on other sites
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