Tough Gun Laws

[Dad2142Dad 6,559]

Glad to see that the many gun laws are really working in Chi town.....

 

 

The city’s first 80-degree day in seven months brought a wave of violence, with an average of one per hour at one point, NBCChicago.com reported.

 

http://usnews.nbcnews.com/_news/2013/05/02/18013866-10-year-old-boy-among-victims-as-more-than-20-shot-on-one-chicago-day?lite=

 

Maybe it was the heat? NOT

[U.S. Pratorean 1,234]

It's a gun issue not a race issue...............right?

[menace667 194]

It is not a race issue. It is a soicioeconomic issue coupled with lack of parental discipline and poor quality of life. Not many gang bangers come from normal homes, with both parents, and a comfortable income. Most come from broken homes with drugs and low to no income. Single parent homes, usually with multiple children from different fathers. those mothers for the most part were also raised, and i use that term loosely, in a very similar scenario.

 

Those types of homes cover all races. More than a race issue is a class issue where it has become acceptable to live off of the govt and rely on them for food, housing, and medical care. Couple that with how easy it is and those with little drive to do anything other than survive can thrive.

 

When i was a cop i had a CI who lived in section 8 housing in a three bedroom appt for free, got free food card, and a check for each of her four kids. The amazing part was that all her kids lived with their grandmother, not her. I made a comment once about reporting her and she literally laughed and said "they know, they just dont care." She even said her case worker told he that she didnt get paid enough to care. I did some rough math based off the cost of an appt, what she said she got in food stamps, and what she got in checks ("govt child support") and she made as much as i did. Then she told me how she pays no taxes, but gets a huge tax return every year.

[El Cabron 91]

05/01/13 American Casualty Count - Chicago: 3 KIA; 20+ WIA

 

05/01/13 American Casualty Count - Afghanistan: 0 KIA; 0 WIA (7 civilians killed in plane crash)

NOTE TO ILLINOIS GUNGRABBERS: YOU CAN CARRY A GUN IN AFGHANISTAN!!!!!

 

[Remek 771]

I guess they haven't denied enough permits to people!

 

Sad to hear that story, and I agree, its not a race issue, but appears so due to the economic background, and lack of solid family.

[menace667 194]

It does appear as a race issue and the amount of black and hispanic is disproportionate to other races. When you consider that major metropolitan areas have more welfare programs and encourage government dependence than do rural areas, those who use and abuse the programs will tend to flock to those areas. Then couple that with the voluntary segregation that is govt housing and the recipe is set.

 

I personally feel that the last two generations of adults have been more damaging to our country than any other. The 60's and 70's created our current situation. Prior to that, though blacks were treated different, they were a proud group for the most part. When the civil rights movement occurred it opened a flood gate of sorts. Then in the 70's that entire generation, of all races, became about "me me me", and a feeling of entitlement. Parents quit doing their jobs and started the partyig phase. The word family became synonomyous withthe word broken. Drugs took over for responsibility and gave an escape from having to care. From there it has been a steady decline.

 

Just my opinion and it is worth exactly that, but i have mixed hopes for our future. The new generations seem more engaged but still have a "me me me" mentality and are takers.

[Remek 771]

I agree with the analysis, menace, but how does subsidy and dependency on government mean its a race issue? It preferentially affects particular races, because they have larger populations on that end of the economic spectrum, but does that mean it is because they are black/hispanic?

 

On the flip side, I can see some argument that this did not happen with the modern asians who immigrated, but they haven't had the breakdown of family values. The pride of their people (like that of earlier generations of blacks) did not allow the to sit on subsidy today. However, if they had come to that position through the same developments as that of blacks and/or hispanics, would it be the same for them?

 

Its not "because" they are black or hispanic, its because they allowed their families/values to break down, and have no pride. I for one know I would kick my kid's butt if they were sitting on the dole and not trying to get ahead. I doubt the same can be said for the many broken families in this situation.

Edited May 2, 2013 by Remek

[thebuns1 4,323]

Skin color aint got a damn thing to do with it. Its laziness and simply taking the easy way out. These fuckers that go out and commit crime know damn well they dont have to. They choose to. I have no sympathy for someone who knows wrong from right and chooses wrong, then blames it on their upbringing. I know several that come from low income homes, dunk/druggie parents, the list goes on. They turned out pretty good considering. But its the overall integrity of the people that is gone in areas like this, and wont get any better anytime soon.

[menace667 194]

Family values has played a MASSIVE part, but i blame the external influence of socieity just as much. i have a ten year old in school now, and they had a "water day" for the kids who did well on their year end testing. The principal decided to give the treat to everyone regardless of their failure or success so as to not alienate anyone. All they essentially did was rewarded mediocrity or failure while simultaneously undermining all the hard work the other kids did.

 

I did not mean to imply that it was because theyr blacm they are on welfare. What i meant was there is a disproportionate number of "minorities" on government subsidies as compared to whites, this making it seem racially biased. Unfortunately there is no one single causeation for it so a fix is not easy to come up with.

 

You did hit the nail on the head with the Asian community and their long tradition of family values, but it also has to do with how quiet they are within their community and their distrust of the government. In LA the Asian community are regularly victims of gangs within their own group, but are not reported because they do not believe in involving outsiders. This info along with quite a bit of other interesting facts about the Asian community was in a paper i read in a psychology class. They said essentially the younger generations are exploiting the older members of the commjnity because the young ones have taken to the american way, but the older ones cling to traditional values.

 

I feel weird having a civil conversation on this forum. More often than not i tend to walk away from threads when inflamatory posts begin.

[Remek 771]

Sort of eeire, eh? HA!

 

Sounds like we are in agreement. The problem, having been identified, begs for a solution. I wish I had one, too. One of the best ones, is the tough-love program. Take them off the dole, and make them work for everything they got. Unfortunately, the liberals feel so good about themselves acting as a catch-all for the downtrodden, they just won't allow it. I don't know why it assuages their guilt, but it appears to. I don't know why they feel guilty either. Maybe they didn't care for their kids either, and had nannies do it, so its a substitute?

[Big John! 2,062]

I'mma call it as I see's it.

 

Race issue. Nuff said.

[menace667 194]

Remek, it has nothing to do with feeling good. They essentially get to use tax money taken from the masses to further their agenda and essentially buy votes.

 

If you put yourself in the position where your total livelihood comes from the govt for free, and there was a politician saying to end that it would be a huge motivation to show up and vote. No amount of advertising can buy that type of support, but free programs can.

 

Tough love would bever be considered as an option unfortunately. Especially since if we do not give them freebies we will still pay for it. Consider that Obamacare is supposed to actually save tax payers in one way, because they say that the completely uninsured who just go to hospitals and can not be denied stabilization and care and never pay is not supposed to be an issue anymore.

 

A co-workers wife runs a private ambulance service and she said they get to write off everyone who doesnt have insurance that they transport on their taxes, which makes their tax burden almost nill. Essentially we end up paying twice, while the dirtbag and the corporation both get freebies.

 

The common man, who is still the vast majority, has become complacent sheep. I myself am guilty as most all are. We would prefer to be able to live unbothered and let the politicians slowly push us to ruination than to fight. The worst part is i completely believe if we could bring our forefathers to todays time they would be disgusted with what we have become as a nation.

[Capt Nemo 882]

I just can't wait for the gubmint to go broke, and then watch their lazy asses scream!

 

"Those who do no work, neither shall they eat." Jesus.

 

In nature, there are no safety nets. You either succeed or get eaten.

 

Call in the scoops! Soylent Green is people!!!!

[menace667 194]

Nemo, if you think the govt will go broke google what the income tax rate was during WWII. As much as we complain now, we have it made conpared to back then.

 

The last entity to go broke in our country will be Uncle Sam, guaranteed. As long as they get theirs from our pay before we do there is no choice in that.

[semper299 284]

 

If you put yourself in the position where your total livelihood comes from the govt for free, and there was a politician saying to end that it would be a huge motivation to show up and vote. No amount of advertising can buy that type of support, but free programs can.

 

 

The common man, who is still the vast majority, has become complacent sheep. I myself am guilty as most all are. We would prefer to be able to live unbothered and let the politicians slowly push us to ruination than to fight. The worst part is i completely believe if we could bring our forefathers to todays time they would be disgusted with what we have become as a nation.

Well said sir...

[thebuns1 4,323]

The worst part is i completely believe if we could bring our forefathers to todays time they would be disgusted with what we have become as a nation.

I do agree, but I wouldnt do that to them. They've done enough already and deserve to rest in peace.

[Remek 771]

We are in agreement, actually, Menace.

 

With respect to the comments on feel-good stuff, I was pointing to the well-off people who vote for democrats, not the policy of the democratic machine. I do not think the people who vote for them realize what they are doing, but I would also not say that they would oppose it, as it gets them the win in poor areas.

 

With respect to the comments on tough love, I agree also. I was just saying its the real solution.

 

For healthcare, its true. They force us to spend much more money than the write-off that would come from the previously-uninsured.

 

As to complacency, I cannot blame people, except to say to speak out when chance provides itself. I too am very busy, and having family, and a fairly good life, I don't spend enough time pissed off to go work extra hard to change things; its much easier to spend time working to make sure I am still wanted at my job and time with family, and the balance following my hobbies. That said, when I am faced with people stating false facts, I correct them as best I can every time. It sucks as it hurts relationships sometimes, but in the end, you have to do what is right.

[dubya 198]

It is not a race issue. It is a soicioeconomic issue coupled with lack of parental discipline and poor quality of life. Not many gang bangers come from normal homes, with both parents, and a comfortable income. Most come from broken homes with drugs and low to no income. Single parent homes, usually with multiple children from different fathers. those mothers for the most part were also raised, and i use that term loosely, in a very similar scenario.

Those types of homes cover all races. More than a race issue is a class issue where it has become acceptable to live off of the govt and rely on them for food, housing, and medical care. Couple that with how easy it is and those with little drive to do anything other than survive can thrive.

When i was a cop i had a CI who lived in section 8 housing in a three bedroom appt for free, got free food card, and a check for each of her four kids. The amazing part was that all her kids lived with their grandmother, not her. I made a comment once about reporting her and she literally laughed and said "they know, they just dont care." She even said her case worker told he that she didnt get paid enough to care. I did some rough math based off the cost of an appt, what she said she got in food stamps, and what she got in checks ("govt child support") and she made as much as i did. Then she told me how she pays no taxes, but gets a huge tax return every year.

 

I wish I didn't read that. Of all things that piss me off in this country (and especially MN) its the lazy scumbag fucks leeching the $1000 a week in taxes the gov takes from me after I bust my ass 70 hours a week and can barely afford to keep my house! But is it really the scumbags fault? Nope, it's all the government. Fuckers.

[menace667 194]

It is a strange phenomenon, Remek, that there are wealthy people voting democrat when that party is full of takers with the rich bearing the brunt of it. From the best i can get is the super rich do not sweat money or even view like we do. When JZ and Beyonce have a 120ft. Yacht in the mediterranean sea staffed for when they want to go and are still so stupid rich that they could buy five more, taxes are probably something they do not even understand. It lets them feel good about being rich while there are kids who go days on end without food.

 

As far as complacency goes, i do not even know if that is the right word. Life used to be slow and tedious with long hard days work. While the hard labor has been replaced with more mentally based chores, the rest of life has become far more hecfic and busy. Their days were 12-14 hours labor for the man and the woman cared for the house and kids. We work 8-10 hour days for both parents to make ends meet with inflation still outpacing income, both trying to take care of the home and kids, and then deal with the responsibilities of life also. Not many people have the time available to have an in-depth and meaningful conversation with our spouse, much less right the wrongs of our country or humanity.

[Rhodes1968 1,638]

Culture issue, the Black community killed its culture.

 

Guess whose is on life support right now?

[Big John! 2,062]

It is a strange phenomenon, Remek, that there are wealthy people voting democrat when that party is full of takers with the rich bearing the brunt of it. From the best i can get is the super rich do not sweat money or even view like we do. When JZ and Beyonce have a 120ft. Yacht in the mediterranean sea staffed for when they want to go and are still so stupid rich that they could buy five more, taxes are probably something they do not even understand. It lets them feel good about being rich while there are kids who go days on end without food.

 

As far as complacency goes, i do not even know if that is the right word. Life used to be slow and tedious with long hard days work. While the hard labor has been replaced with more mentally based chores, the rest of life has become far more hecfic and busy. Their days were 12-14 hours labor for the man and the woman cared for the house and kids. We work 8-10 hour days for both parents to make ends meet with inflation still outpacing income, both trying to take care of the home and kids, and then deal with the responsibilities of life also. Not many people have the time available to have an in-depth and meaningful conversation with our spouse, much less right the wrongs of our country or humanity.

Well said sir. We've got way ahead of ourselve's IMO.

 

Culture issue, the Black community killed its culture.

 

Guess whose is on life support right now?

Yup... Sshhhhh... don't say anything though or you'll be a racist and that's bad.

[Rhodes1968 1,638]

It is a strange phenomenon, Remek, that there are wealthy people voting democrat when that party is full of takers with the rich bearing the brunt of it. From the best i can get is the super rich do not sweat money or even view like we do. When JZ and Beyonce have a 120ft. Yacht in the mediterranean sea staffed for when they want to go and are still so stupid rich that they could buy five more, taxes are probably something they do not even understand. It lets them feel good about being rich while there are kids who go days on end without food.

 

As far as complacency goes, i do not even know if that is the right word. Life used to be slow and tedious with long hard days work. While the hard labor has been replaced with more mentally based chores, the rest of life has become far more hecfic and busy. Their days were 12-14 hours labor for the man and the woman cared for the house and kids. We work 8-10 hour days for both parents to make ends meet with inflation still outpacing income, both trying to take care of the home and kids, and then deal with the responsibilities of life also. Not many people have the time available to have an in-depth and meaningful conversation with our spouse, much less right the wrongs of our country or humanity.

Well said sir. We've got way ahead of ourselve's IMO.

 

Culture issue, the Black community killed its culture.

 

Guess whose is on life support right now?

Yup... Sshhhhh... don't say anything though or you'll be a racist and that's bad.

 

 

Meh they gonna say it anyway may as well get it out of the way.

[VR762Shooter 838]

Then she told me how she pays no taxes, but gets a huge tax return every year.

 

The earned income credit is a nightmare of welfare. They get close to a down payment on a house or more (depending on kids ~3500 per) and never move away from slum. I see it daily in my area/family. This is why MA never votes anything but blue. So many people living for that EIC and food stamp check

Edited May 6, 2013 by VR6Shooter