saltydecimator 482 Posted September 7, 2015 Report Share Posted September 7, 2015 survival sitch obviously... seems like a good scale of economics. ie, get about 4-5 loads for a light 38-357 mag loading out of 1 12 ga no? also then you have the oz of lead, which is 437 grs, which at least 2-3 cast bullets, if you melt the shot down. which most people say its silly to melt shot down, as it took more effort to make shot than it does to form into bullets, ie its more valuable to trade as shot than as a single projectile....sure if you just buy a lb of powder its kewl too, but thats not already loaded ammo.... anyone followin me? maybe i just really love buyin shotshells and this is justifying it, lolz Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Heartbreaker 1,085 Posted September 7, 2015 Report Share Posted September 7, 2015 What kind of powder is in the shells? Is it even effective or safe to shoot from a handgun? Why would you waste the primers, hulls, wads, etc. to make substandard ammo? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
HB of CJ 1,263 Posted September 7, 2015 Report Share Posted September 7, 2015 Hand loading or reloading in a SHTF situation might not be the best use of available time and resources? Lots of other things to do. Might be easier just to lay in one box each of all odd ball calibers to insure that one has a little bit of ammo for whatever kind and caliber of pick up gun one might obtain by whatever means? It would be easy to go over board on guns and ammo at the expense of other needful things. Just me. Respectfully. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
macbeau 902 Posted September 8, 2015 Report Share Posted September 8, 2015 (edited) You could do it, but I would be more inclined to trade the shot shells for what I needed. Toting around a mold, lead pot, dies, powder measure, press, etc..is counter to what I would call a "survival sitch"... Just saying... Macbeau... Edited September 8, 2015 by macbeau 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
XD45 7,124 Posted September 8, 2015 Report Share Posted September 8, 2015 I'll just make bullets out of dead alien robots. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
saltydecimator 482 Posted September 8, 2015 Author Report Share Posted September 8, 2015 As far as what powder specifically, who knows. It's pistol powder though. Fast burning meaning. As far as wasting time maybe. I assume you will have a lot of free time. Spend in daylight hunting and gathering, evening hangin out by campfire singin koom by ya? Rose colored glasses everyone's just gonna be dead? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
gunfun 3,931 Posted September 8, 2015 Report Share Posted September 8, 2015 What kind of powder is in the shells? Is it even effective or safe to shoot from a handgun? Why would you waste the primers, hulls, wads, etc. to make substandard ammo? They tend to be the same ranges of powders. Some shells even say what they use, but that is not common. You could probably work it out by wasting a bunch and comparing burn rates, and physical appearance. Also, a light ~100-110 grain bullet will work pretty good with about 3.5 grains of red dot powder, or promo, in .38SPL which is a popular shotgun powder for trap loads. WSF is also a good pistol powder, as is UNIVERSAL. Blue dot is decent for magnums, as is longshot. Given the exigencies of an impending raid from Lord Humongous or whatever--- you could tear down handloads,with known powder, but for commercial ammo, you would be in risky territory trying to guess what powder you had. About the only safe-ish assumptions would be to use starting cowboy load data from a the fastest powder and hot primers and then assume every load is going to be slightly more mild than that, so long as you are under about 4 grains of powder for a 115 grain or lighter bullet. Then work up from about 2 grains to your max, and check for stuck bullets in the bore. Mouse farts out of a .357 should give you a wide margin of error, short of a squib obstruction. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
G O B 3,516 Posted September 8, 2015 Report Share Posted September 8, 2015 Melting shot for lead is a waste, if SHTF, every car has a lead battery. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
gunfun 3,931 Posted September 8, 2015 Report Share Posted September 8, 2015 Melting shot for lead is a waste, if SHTF, every car has a lead battery. Melting battery lead down is a great way to give your lungs chemical burns. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Capt Nemo 882 Posted September 9, 2015 Report Share Posted September 9, 2015 (edited) Melting shot for lead is a waste, if SHTF, every car has a lead battery. Melting battery lead down is a great way to give your lungs chemical burns. Not really! Just melt the grids minus all the sulphate. It's easy to push out the sulphate chunks from the grids. 8-10 lbs of lead that way. Now smelting the remaining sulphate. Yeah! Lots of sulphur dioxide smoke! (sulphuric acid when it hits your lungs) Edited September 9, 2015 by Capt Nemo Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Hawk451 2,230 Posted September 9, 2015 Report Share Posted September 9, 2015 Seems like I remember something about maintenance-free batteries having some arsenic alloyed into the lead. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
saltydecimator 482 Posted September 9, 2015 Author Report Share Posted September 9, 2015 Exactly why it's just easier to buy shots hells! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
gunfun 3,931 Posted September 9, 2015 Report Share Posted September 9, 2015 It's easier to buy a can of powder and a pile of scrap lead from a scrap yard. If you are getting primers, you've already been shopping for reloading supplies anyway, so the thought exercise has that plot hole in it. Unless you have some plausible way of making reliable primers macgyver style. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
G O B 3,516 Posted September 9, 2015 Report Share Posted September 9, 2015 The OP was talking SHTF! I would never melt batteries unless that was the last choice - melt batteries before melting shot! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
VR762Shooter 838 Posted September 9, 2015 Report Share Posted September 9, 2015 Since we are talking SHTF and melting crap. Say .gov completely fails and melting down post-1982 pennies is now an option. What are negatives to using zinc as a projectile (besides weight) if you absolutely needed to melt down something to turn into bullets? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Heartbreaker 1,085 Posted September 9, 2015 Report Share Posted September 9, 2015 Zinc melts at about 160°F higher than lead and has the same hardness as copper, in lb/ft3 it weighs 100 less than copper and 250 less than lead. It is brittle unlike lead and copper so if you dropped it on a hard surface it would probably shatter. So it would probably work, but the bullets would be lighter and wouldn't expand very well but may instead fragment. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
gunfun 3,931 Posted September 9, 2015 Report Share Posted September 9, 2015 (edited) Since we are talking SHTF and melting crap. Say .gov completely fails and melting down post-1982 pennies is now an option. What are negatives to using zinc as a projectile (besides weight) if you absolutely needed to melt down something to turn into bullets? What he said. You'd need to make sure your zinc slugs would fit down any chokes with the wadding or you would get cartoon barrel syndrome. Zinc is also a pain because it sticks to every metal, and is near the melting point of many things you would want to use as molds. I found that Zinc seems to lower the melting point of aluminum too, and had a custom machine mold basically dissolve. A lee pot just baaaarely gets hot enough to melt zinc. However you will find that bottom pour pots will be a mess with zinc because of the aforementioned zinc stickiness/ reactivity. It will want to bond to the valve on the pot, and lots of impurities. you can get it to take very precise detail, but you have to keep your mold and everything at around 900*f-1K in order to get good fill out. It takes a long time to cool enough to open the mold, and zinc's tendency to crystallize makes for problems with voids and unbalanced bullets. The harder material is also harder to cut and will wear out sprue plates and you quicker. I think there is potential for casting cheap .223 plinkers with it, but you would need to shoot a lot to justify the cost of a functional setup that can handle the heat, and not crud up constantly. Another big problem is that zinc pulls the tin and antimony out of lead. So getting a little bit of zinc in your lead casting equipment at least ruins the batch of lead, and might be enough of a hassle to scrap the tools too. It makes pretty rainbow colors and crystals though, so there's that. https://www.google.com/search?q=castboolits+zinc+contamination&espv=2&biw=1366&bih=643&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ved=0CAgQ_AUoA2oVChMIzpnDlt7qxwIVzgWSCh01AQOx Edited September 9, 2015 by GunFun Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Capt Nemo 882 Posted September 10, 2015 Report Share Posted September 10, 2015 Save the copper (pre 1982) pennies for bullet jackets if you have a swager. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Hawk451 2,230 Posted September 10, 2015 Report Share Posted September 10, 2015 Save the copper (pre 1982) pennies for bullet jackets if you have a swager. Or empty brass. 3 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
gunfun 3,931 Posted September 10, 2015 Report Share Posted September 10, 2015 Penny jackets would be worse than none. people do make good jackets from used cartridge cases. 40 for 45, 9mm for 40, .22LR for .223 I wouldn't mess with it though, it is a lot of work without any real evidence that it makes superior ammo. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Sim_Player 1,939 Posted September 11, 2015 Report Share Posted September 11, 2015 (edited) Buy the caliber that you need. Shots are more useful elsewhere. Edited September 11, 2015 by Sim_Player Quote Link to post Share on other sites
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