studmuff1228 0 Posted June 6, 2006 Report Share Posted June 6, 2006 is it possible to convert the .223 saiga to 22lr i know Ciner makes kits for a .223 ak but would this work ? and do any of you have a kit for an ak-47 if you do how well does it work ? thanks Quote Link to post Share on other sites
rangerruck 0 Posted June 6, 2006 Report Share Posted June 6, 2006 I could be wrong, but i don't see a 22 lr working the action of a long stroke, gas piston anything. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
studmuff1228 0 Posted June 6, 2006 Author Report Share Posted June 6, 2006 here look at these conversions http://www.22lrconversions.com/ i don't think they use the gas piston. I think it converts it to a blow back desighn like a ruger 10/22, is the inside of a saiga just like an ak ? if so this just might work Quote Link to post Share on other sites
termite 463 Posted June 6, 2006 Report Share Posted June 6, 2006 there's usually a saiga 22 for sale on GunBroker Quote Link to post Share on other sites
SSGTWC 0 Posted June 6, 2006 Report Share Posted June 6, 2006 I dunno know........I'm still trying to figure out WHY!!! Turning a .223 REM to shoot 22lr? Why? School me! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
ironhead7544 35 Posted June 6, 2006 Report Share Posted June 6, 2006 The 22 lr kits are for training. Low recoil for new shooters and a hell of a lot cheaper. Had a couple 22 kits for the Colt 1911. Used to shot 300 rounds or so of 22 and then a hundred or so 45s before a match. Helps a lot with trigger control. There are lots of 22 kits out there for different guns and I think they are a great idea. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
studmuff1228 0 Posted June 7, 2006 Author Report Share Posted June 7, 2006 o wow i didn't even know saiga made a 22 i will have to check them out. i would just want it so i coudl get more use to shooting the gun ya know use it for smaller critters and get comfortable with it + it would be cool. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
SSGTWC 0 Posted June 7, 2006 Report Share Posted June 7, 2006 The 22 lr kits are for training. Low recoil for new shooters and a hell of a lot cheaper. Had a couple 22 kits for the Colt 1911. Used to shot 300 rounds or so of 22 and then a hundred or so 45s before a match. Helps a lot with trigger control. There are lots of 22 kits out there for different guns and I think they are a great idea. Ok now see Quote Link to post Share on other sites
TWGLADF 0 Posted August 1, 2006 Report Share Posted August 1, 2006 it would be badass to accurately shoot those 60 grain sss aguila rounds. 24 inches of penetration at 200 meters. and they are quiet as hell. tried to shoot them out of my singleshot 22lr with i believe a 1:12 twist. that baby keyholed everytime! and it did one hell of a number on a water filled coke can. i need to do more tests! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
DaGroaner 2 Posted August 1, 2006 Report Share Posted August 1, 2006 (edited) The 22 lr kits are for training. Low recoil for new shooters and a hell of a lot cheaper. Had a couple 22 kits for the Colt 1911. Used to shot 300 rounds or so of 22 and then a hundred or so 45s before a match. Helps a lot with trigger control. There are lots of 22 kits out there for different guns and I think they are a great idea. They're also a whole ot of cheap fun. I have a .22 kit for my Glock 27 and it is an absolute blast to shoot. I wish someone would make a 20-30 round mag for it. Advantage Arms never will because they're located in the People's Republic of Kalifornia. Edited August 1, 2006 by DaGroaner Quote Link to post Share on other sites
charcoalburner 2 Posted August 3, 2006 Report Share Posted August 3, 2006 Would also be a great squirrel/rabbit/small game gun. Just one more thing the Saiga's would be useful for. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Ronswin 26 Posted August 3, 2006 Report Share Posted August 3, 2006 There is always the alternative of a trainer .22 cal AK: My Webpage I've seen these at gunshows and they are very good quality. An AK reciever with a .22 rifle built into it. They even have the scope side rail. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
IndyArms 10,186 Posted August 5, 2006 Report Share Posted August 5, 2006 24 inches of penetration at 200 meters. 24 Inches of what????? Air???? I dont believe the 60 grainers will even GO 200 yards, will they!?!?!?!?? Or do you haved to hold the rifle at a 45 degree angle? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
ironhead7544 35 Posted August 5, 2006 Report Share Posted August 5, 2006 Heavy bullets retain their velocity better than lighter ones. The 60 grainers would go a mile or more at 30 degrees elevation would be my guess. The penetration of 24 inches is in ballistic gelatin. This load was designed for supressors and needs a 9 to 1 twist for best accuracy. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
okie shooter 0 Posted August 7, 2006 Report Share Posted August 7, 2006 Heavy bullets retain their velocity better than lighter ones. The 60 grainers would go a mile or more at 30 degrees elevation would be my guess. The penetration of 24 inches is in ballistic gelatin. This load was designed for supressors and needs a 9 to 1 twist for best accuracy. Not totaly true, if this were the case 8" howitzer shells would penetrate better than 120mm smoothbore saboted rounds. Ballistics and penetration are a combinitation of velociety, energy, hardness of the penetrator and weight. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
IndyArms 10,186 Posted August 7, 2006 Report Share Posted August 7, 2006 I still find it VERY hard to believe that a 60 grain .22 LR will penetrate 24 inches of ballistics gelatin at 200 yards. So much so.. I will put a $20.00 bill on it!!! (Of course I would need to witness the testing myself...) Hell... I am so skeptical of the .22 LR 60 grain Aguila SSS loads... I currently own a half a brick of them myself, as far as penetration... I doubt it could penetrate 24 inches of ballistics gelatin at ANY RANGE!!!! If you remember... the case is a *SHORT* case and there is VERY MINIMAL powder charge in them (Hell, if any at all) I dont think there is enough bang in that buck to get enough oomph to do jack squat to a chunk of ballistics gel. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
TWGLADF 0 Posted August 8, 2006 Report Share Posted August 8, 2006 don't know what the hell they put in those casings but it's some bad shit. their super maximums are very close to 22 magnum performance. even hotter than stingers. those babies zing. as far as the penetration reports, those came from aguila. i've yet to do any testing but would love to attempt it. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
ironhead7544 35 Posted August 8, 2006 Report Share Posted August 8, 2006 I checked with someone who knows ballistics and he says the 60 grainers at 950 fps works out to a little more than 1200 yards. As far as penetration goes I saw a test where a Berreta Bobcat with a 2.75 inch barrel was used to test the 60 grainers in gelatin. The velocity was 650 fps and the bullet went in 10 inches. The high velociy 40 grainers went in about the same. Concerning the artillery, how did that get into a discussion about 22 kits? Interesting point but check out the range on mortors, even the ones used in the civil war. That heavy slug carries a lot farther than you would think. The sabot rounds use an entirely different principle of penetration than a lead 22 bullet. The sabot "spear" actually has such a high velocity that it burns a hole in the metal it hits. Thats what gives it such good performance. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Reverendfranz 160 Posted August 8, 2006 Report Share Posted August 8, 2006 I still find it VERY hard to believe that a 60 grain .22 LR will penetrate 24 inches of ballistics gelatin at 200 yards. So much so.. I will put a $20.00 bill on it!!! (Of course I would need to witness the testing myself...) Hell... I am so skeptical of the .22 LR 60 grain Aguila SSS loads... I currently own a half a brick of them myself, as far as penetration... I doubt it could penetrate 24 inches of ballistics gelatin at ANY RANGE!!!! If you remember... the case is a *SHORT* case and there is VERY MINIMAL powder charge in them (Hell, if any at all) I dont think there is enough bang in that buck to get enough oomph to do jack squat to a chunk of ballistics gel. ~Whistles. Try it. Balistics Gel can get pricey, so try these instructions. http://www.myscienceproject.org/gelatin.html The three links on the page are a little more specific, but after reading (and verifying) these guys' paper on jello shots, i have plenty of faith in them. Hop to, inquiring minds want to know. Oh, and if i recall, the shells in question are "Sans Poudre" i never paid much attention to them untill i saw a man shooting into a steel trap on his front porch in the middle of the day... Neat. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
IndyArms 10,186 Posted August 8, 2006 Report Share Posted August 8, 2006 Oh, and if i recall, the shells in question are "Sans Poudre" i never paid much attention to them untill i saw a man shooting into a steel trap on his front porch in the middle of the day... Neat. Exactly... sans poudre = WITHOUT POWDER... they are PRIMER FIRED ONLY!!! again... I have a half a brick of the things... personally I think they SUCK... and dont shoot worth a damn out of anything... I will pass on manufacture of ballistics gelatin, thank you... I will just live in my "little bubble of idiocy" that allows me to believe that these particular shells wont do jack shit at 200 yards to anything... Quote Link to post Share on other sites
studmuff1228 0 Posted August 22, 2006 Author Report Share Posted August 22, 2006 you guys runed my post....... but i want the gun b/c i want to hunt deer with an ak (not the 22lr kit) i thought it would help me get use to hunting with it before i go out after a more serious game. and i don't want a trainer ak that only has 10 round clips. anyway i would like to know how accurate these kits are. and to let you all know i will not be shooting the 60 grain subsonic rounds out of it. I want to kill something not hit it in the head and make it retarted, thanks though for all the info i'll rember it if i ever want to shoot bumble bees Quote Link to post Share on other sites
charcoalburner 2 Posted August 22, 2006 Report Share Posted August 22, 2006 Studmuff, If you are going to hunt deer with the .223 I would definitely recommend lots and lots of practice. You will need to put that baby right in the kill zone to bring it down. A majority of the people I know that hunt with a .223(which is very few) go for a neck shot on the spine. You have to be very accurate to take one down. I personally would recommend a 7.62 x 39 for this kind of hunting. I have shot deer with x39 using nosler ballistic tips and they turned the heart and lungs into jello. I assume you will be hunting whitetails, because I would not try the .223 on mulies.IMHO because YMMV. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
studmuff1228 0 Posted August 22, 2006 Author Report Share Posted August 22, 2006 yea i don't think i would hunt them with the 223 but the x39 is what i want to use or a 308 if they open up rifle in my area the x39 reminds me of the 30-30 and that would be a very nice round for the kind of hunting i do i don't think people will be happy with the fact that i will hunt with an AK but that is just b/c they have no respect for the gun. i forgot the original topic was on the .223 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
uzitiger 193 Posted August 26, 2006 Report Share Posted August 26, 2006 Instead of looking for a conversion kit for your Saiga, you can buy a Romanian AK trainer in .22 LR. I saw them at Dunham's for $249. It looks and feels like an AK and comes with two magazines. They only have ten round magazines available for them. There's an East German AK trainer which was available and the magazines will NOT work in the Romanian rifle. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Grim42 0 Posted November 14, 2006 Report Share Posted November 14, 2006 So, I take it that nobody has tried the Ciener 22lr kit on a Saiga? I too am interested in getting a .223 or 7.62x39 Saiga and putting one of these kits in it. Would allow me to shoot longer for less money and still be able to take it out and use it for something more serious if needed. I wonder if I have to add the feed ramp or if I could just put it in without doing anything to the stock rifle? Hmmm.... Grim Quote Link to post Share on other sites
jimmy_stikx 0 Posted November 23, 2006 Report Share Posted November 23, 2006 So, I take it that nobody has tried the Ciener 22lr kit on a Saiga? I too am interested in getting a .223 or 7.62x39 Saiga and putting one of these kits in it. Would allow me to shoot longer for less money and still be able to take it out and use it for something more serious if needed. I wonder if I have to add the feed ramp or if I could just put it in without doing anything to the stock rifle? Hmmm.... Grim From the looks of the mag, it has a feed ramp built into it. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
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