THE_HUNTER 2 Posted December 8, 2006 Author Report Share Posted December 8, 2006 Yep,I refuse to alter anything on my bolt though!AINT GONNA DO IT! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Z1500 0 Posted December 8, 2006 Report Share Posted December 8, 2006 Long story short, I was told by BATF that 10rd was the cut off point I should pursue. They made a very very compelling argument. We were very careful to make it fit 10 rounds and a little extra room only. Kevin Quote Link to post Share on other sites
gunboy69 50 Posted December 8, 2006 Report Share Posted December 8, 2006 I'm sure it was very compelling. 10 is plenty in a stick mag. Any longer and this thing would be resting on my foot. By the way,beautiful mag Kevin! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Crow 2 Posted December 8, 2006 Report Share Posted December 8, 2006 So Cobra, yer telling me I gotta grind away on my bolt to make these work? I just got some 2 3/4" slugs and they wont let me pull my bolt back either, and they jam up exactly the same way as my big ole 3 inchers. Now if a nurse the first couple thru it will feed the rest so there's an improvement, I guess. My gun cycles everything I can throw it at with a 5 rounder so I simple math tells me it ain't the gun. I ain't against modifying though, someone toss a link my way if such exists. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Cobra 76 two 2,677 Posted December 8, 2006 Report Share Posted December 8, 2006 So Cobra, yer telling me I gotta grind away on my bolt to make these work? I just got some 2 3/4" slugs and they wont let me pull my bolt back either, and they jam up exactly the same way as my big ole 3 inchers. Now if a nurse the first couple thru it will feed the rest so there's an improvement, I guess. My gun cycles everything I can throw it at with a 5 rounder so I simple math tells me it ain't the gun. I ain't against modifying though, someone toss a link my way if such exists. Whoa now hold on. I'm not suggesting anyone grind away their bolts. That picture shows what one of our members did to help with the loading on a closed bolt issue even with factory mags. Do a search for posts by Stimpsonjcat I think. He had success with his but I remember he said he bought a spare bolt to try it with and kept his original intact. I have been meaning to try it myself but I want an extra bolt first. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
expeditionx 1 Posted December 9, 2006 Report Share Posted December 9, 2006 (edited) Long story short, I was told by BATF that 10rd was the cut off point I should pursue. They made a very very compelling argument. We were very careful to make it fit 10 rounds and a little extra room only. Kevin According to what your saying, if someone starts making 11 through 100 round drums for the Saiga 12, they will reclassify as a DD. Just wonderfull. Long story short, I was told by BATF that 10rd was the cut off point I should pursue. They made a very very compelling argument. We were very careful to make it fit 10 rounds and a little extra room only. Kevin According to what your saying, if someone starts making 11 through 100 round drums for the Saiga 12, they will reclassify as a DD. Just wonderfull. It might be time for a permanent sticky with Kevins statement to warn future newbies and idiots about not discussing, attempting to create, or suggesting 11 round plus magazines for the Saiga shotguns. Edited December 9, 2006 by expeditionx Quote Link to post Share on other sites
THE_HUNTER 2 Posted December 9, 2006 Author Report Share Posted December 9, 2006 OK,here is an interesting idea.For the guys like me who have trouble with the 10th round with a closed bolt cycle,is there a shorter round that WON'T CATCH on the bolt bottom for that 10th round so I might have a round in the chamber and 10 in the mag?I was thinking maybe of the shorty slugs?Has anyone tried these in a S12 yet?Shoty probably wouldn't get hung up on the bottom of the bolt and then I could have standard length rounds for the remainder....Also,has anyone played with the Russian steel cased rounds in a S12? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
AegisDei 2 Posted December 9, 2006 Report Share Posted December 9, 2006 It might be time for a permanent sticky with Kevins statement to warn future newbies and idiots about not discussing, attempting to create, or suggesting 11 round plus magazines for the Saiga shotguns. There's a difference between creating magazines with capacity 10+ and producing them for commercial sale (I think). Otherwise my 20ga creations might be trouble. It's like I can produce my own alcohol...but I can't produce above a certain amount or produce it for resale. I was thinking maybe of the shorty slugs?Has anyone tried these in a S12 yet?Shoty probably wouldn't get hung up on the bottom of the bolt and then I could have standard length rounds for the remainder....Also,has anyone played with the Russian steel cased rounds in a S12? Check the energy of the shorties. I'm not sure that they have enough power to cycle the S12. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
oldandslow 3 Posted December 9, 2006 Report Share Posted December 9, 2006 OK,here is an interesting idea.For the guys like me who have trouble with the 10th round with a closed bolt cycle,is there a shorter round that WON'T CATCH on the bolt bottom for that 10th round so I might have a round in the chamber and 10 in the mag?I was thinking maybe of the shorty slugs?Has anyone tried these in a S12 yet?Shoty probably wouldn't get hung up on the bottom of the bolt and then I could have standard length rounds for the remainder....Also,has anyone played with the Russian steel cased rounds in a S12? I shoot USPSA 3-Gun. My local reloader and fellow shooter makes "shorty" 12 gauge shotgun shells. Using them as the top round in the magazine (obviously), they make loading a Russian built 8 round magazine much easier. I don't notice any difference in loading with the new AGP magazine using shorties or regular 2 3/4 inch shells. I have reshaped my bolt to remove the "bump" that seems to get in the way when reloading. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
98k plinker 0 Posted December 9, 2006 Report Share Posted December 9, 2006 (edited) factory AGP mags dont like 10 slugs loaded from a closed bolt, they smash the heck outta the top one and its near impossable to yank the bolt back after you get them loaded, they work great with buck and shot loads though, but if you must have the mags be fully loaded with slugs and insert them on a closed bolt, you can modify the follower and spring guide to be like a russian 5 round mag, and then cut 2 or 3 coils off the spring. thats how i got mine to work with slugs, i prolly wont do it with all my mags though, just leave this one as my slug mag. or you could just load 9 instead Edited December 9, 2006 by 98k plinker Quote Link to post Share on other sites
THE_HUNTER 2 Posted December 9, 2006 Author Report Share Posted December 9, 2006 Thanx Mon!I just got 3 extra 5 shot S12 mags and i had to adjust one a little with a file but they all work awesome hand cycling now.I also got 2 20 rounders for my Saiga .308.NICE!They lock up hand hand cycle like a charm!Maybe in a week or so I will get out to the club to play with everything now.Yeah,I'm leary of cutting on my 10 rounder so i will do the open chamber thing if necessary.I even need to do that though with bird shot and buck shot with mine in my 2 S12's.There goes the old 1 in the barrel 10 in the mag!I would have liked that! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Gummerfan 0 Posted December 12, 2006 Report Share Posted December 12, 2006 So, if I stick with 2 3/4" shells, I'm gaining ease of loading, better feeding reliability, greater slug accuracy, less recoil and faster recovery time, and I'm only giving up a few more pellets downrange and a marginal increase in velocity? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Crow 2 Posted December 12, 2006 Report Share Posted December 12, 2006 Yup I just grabbed some 2 3/4" and it cycles fine. Guess I'll leave my big ole 3" for the 5-rounders. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
THE_HUNTER 2 Posted December 12, 2006 Author Report Share Posted December 12, 2006 Yep,glad to hear the 2 3/4 shells work good.I still have to load on an open bolt for the 10 shot.I do like the 5 rounders still!I just got 3 more! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Crow 2 Posted December 12, 2006 Report Share Posted December 12, 2006 I'm with ya on that Hunter. I actually prefer the 5 rounders, I just got some 10 rounders for the fun of it. I can't imagine any situation short of a full on pitched battle where I'd need anymore than 5 at a time. And I have 7 5 rounders myself. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
getitat 609 Posted December 12, 2006 Report Share Posted December 12, 2006 Hello, Crow With ya there...Shooting at the range, the fives are the only way to go off the bench. Not to say that I won't purchase an absurd amount of tens to go with my stable of eights, just 'cause I can..... Respectfully posted, Guido2 in Houston Quote Link to post Share on other sites
THE_HUNTER 2 Posted December 12, 2006 Author Report Share Posted December 12, 2006 Yep,the 10's are good for shock value but the 5's are all purpose.I personally keeping a Saiga 12 with a 5 rounder in for home security even though I now have that 10 rounder.Probably will get another 10 when the feed lip problems are fixed...can't wait to get out to try my new 10 though!I'm sure to excite and anger some at the club! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Vangcomper 0 Posted December 14, 2006 Report Share Posted December 14, 2006 If you cut a coil or two off the mag springs in order to make them work with 10 rounds, will that hinder the life of the mags in anyway? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Cobra 76 two 2,677 Posted December 14, 2006 Report Share Posted December 14, 2006 Kevin said early on that the springs were overkill and could be trimmed back some for better fit if necessary. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
THE_HUNTER 2 Posted December 14, 2006 Author Report Share Posted December 14, 2006 I even tried using the 5 rounder mag spring in the 10 and still had problems... Quote Link to post Share on other sites
98k plinker 0 Posted December 14, 2006 Report Share Posted December 14, 2006 I even tried using the 5 rounder mag spring in the 10 and still had problems... yeah you have to modify the follower and spring guide to be like whats in the russian mags also for a full package of slug rounds to work. maybe AGP can offer 2 types of followers for us guys that MUST load 10 slugs Quote Link to post Share on other sites
THE_HUNTER 2 Posted December 14, 2006 Author Report Share Posted December 14, 2006 I would like that! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
THE_HUNTER 2 Posted January 7, 2007 Author Report Share Posted January 7, 2007 I just bought some shorty buckshot loads (Aguila minishells) from the gun show today.I put in 9 standard 2 3/4" shells and topped off my 10 round AGP with 1 shorty buckshot.I can insert a fully loaded mag into the gun and hand cycle the first shell in no problem.Now I just need to see if they will function in my 2 S-12's.....Theoretically I could have 1 regular buckshot load in the chamber,top shell as a minishell in my AGP mag,followed by all regular buckshot loads after that.I wonder if the shorties will work in my Benelli and my High Standard M10B bullpup.......that would really be sweet! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
stimpsonjcat 0 Posted September 21, 2007 Report Share Posted September 21, 2007 Hi guys! Beeen a long time since I posted...I have a 2 year old and she gets all my spare time! I did buy a spare bolt and carrier, but I have never needed them. The modded bolt is still happily eating slugs and such, no wear or failure. This mod was a big help in addition to the stimpcatch (which is a dead project until I get a few more things off my plate). Sorry guys, but the Saiga stuff kinda fell off my radar when I started shooting 3-gun regularly as I found I was faster with a tube gun single loading...I know, I know...sinner and all, but the ability to choose ammo type by the round is a big deal at our matches. Since I last posted I have acquired a 10"x54" mill and a hobby lathe I have already made a suppressor on...so my skills/gear have been improving. At some point I intend to automate the mill and then stuff like the stimpcatch may surface again. I still have plans to make my own BHO design work...but the 8mm FAL project is first (it already shoots, but the prototype ejector design failed), then the PPS43, then the Bren...did I mention I have a mill now?...then maybe the Saiga stuff. Can I freaking retire now please? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
MadMax 0 Posted September 22, 2007 Report Share Posted September 22, 2007 Can I freaking retire now please? Nope, not until that 8mm FAL is done. Been watching your progress on FAL Files and I am dying to see that thing breathing fire. I love how you fixed the cartridge OAL issue. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
stimpsonjcat 0 Posted October 12, 2007 Report Share Posted October 12, 2007 Can I freaking retire now please? Nope, not until that 8mm FAL is done. Been watching your progress on FAL Files and I am dying to see that thing breathing fire. I love how you fixed the cartridge OAL issue. I meant can I retire so I can work on just guns? The day job gets in my way! The 8mm FAL already works...cycles fine...but she destroyed the first version of ejector I tried. I am going to try putting the ejector on the bolt next. Gotta tear the mill head apart first. It's nice to be loved! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Cobra 76 two 2,677 Posted October 12, 2007 Report Share Posted October 12, 2007 Welcome back Stimpy! Thanks for the update on the bolt mod. I've been thinking about trying that but waiting to find an extra bolt. I wonder if Tantal still has bolt carriers and bolts in stock? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
G O B 3,516 Posted October 12, 2007 Report Share Posted October 12, 2007 Good to see Stimpy back! welcome home! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
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