Others weigh in...my first handgun options.

[Shellshock1918 1]

I'm stuck at the moment about which handgun to buy. I've been looking at the following pistols.

 

East German Makarov

pros: small for CCW, accurate durable, collector's piece

cons: ammo can't be bought at walmart

 

Sig 225/P6

pros: its a SIG, 9mm can be bought any where, medium size (in between 1911 and Makarov)

cons: single stack 9mm

 

Rock Island Arsenal 1911A1

pros: ITS A FRIGGIN 1911 MAN, 45 ACP, ammo can be bought anywhere

cons: kinda big for CCW

 

 

Thoughts? Opinions? Experience?

 

 

Thanks.

[paprotective 362]

Had a Mak in 380 with Hi-Cap 12 rounds. Nice, safety/decoker. Sold (moron) can't find another like it.

 

Have a Sig 228, 225's cheap right now has hammer drop/decocker also (I think).

 

The Sig and 1911 are almost the same size. My Sig stabs my gut at 1pm carry IWB (getting fat). Used to carry my Mak at 5pm with no problems.

 

Getting my Glock 30 (45acp) back Monday from the police (car was stolen last year with it in it). Best carry piece for me at 1pm (no hammer to dig into me)

 

Go with the Sig 225. 9mm plenty. Sig has good service. Reliable. IMHO

[Motopilot1 37]

had the rock insland, wont feed hollow points, nothing a ramp job cant fix but just so you know. i would go with the 1911

[buckandaquarterquarterstaff 5]

The 225 is a very very nice gun, but won't feed all hollowpoints. You'd need to stick to something like a hornady xtp and make sure that whatever you use works well in your gun.

 

The Mak is probably the best ccw choice, is accurate and dead on reliable. It's underpowered vs what the sig 225 can handle however.

 

The 1911 is an OK choice but bear in mind it's not the most intuitive thing to carry cocked and locked, nor is it the safest. The rock islands (and even some of the much more expensive ones aren't great at feeding hollowpoints. You'll get many defending the 1911, and in it's day it was a hot ticket. Now, compared to some other guns it's hard to justify spending the dough to tune one up (expecially as a first handgun).

 

If it were me I'd get the sig or Mak, and skip the 1911

[Shellshock1918 1]

How is the trigger on the SIG?

[jrance@iacwds.com 716]

Hard to understand the reasoning on the statement about 1911's "not the most intuitive thing to carry cocked and locked, nor is it the safest".

Intuitive? - You pull it out, push the safety down and fire.

Unsafe? - You not only have to take the safety off, you have to engage the grip safety and engage the trigger. (series 70 have 2 safeties, series 80 have 3 safeties)

 

Glock - engage the trigger and off you go. (No safety)

 

No need to defend, just a few facts. Buy the 1911.

 

1911

[jrance@iacwds.com 716]

something is screwy!!

Edited April 6, 2008 by 1911

[jrance@iacwds.com 716]

double post

Edited April 6, 2008 by 1911

[buckandaquarterquarterstaff 5]

Points taken... What I meant by safest was you have to remember to turn off the safety to fire a 1911, not that it isn't a safe gun to carry otherwise.

 

With the sig you have a double action trigger pull (a "positive" police action type one), or single action and a decocker. I haven't met anyone who recommends cocked and unlocked, and that would be the comparison to the sig's double action. The sig is a really comfortable gun. No need to worry about hammer bit either.

 

Not trying to start a flame war, just saw that my earlier post's meaning didn't translate...

 

Oh and by the way, I would recommend a 3 in bbl 357 mag revolver stoked with +p 38's as a first handgun over any of the above (but that wasn't one of the choices - and just my opinion).

Edited April 6, 2008 by buckandaquarterquarterstaff

[Shellshock1918 1]

Oh and by the way, I would recommend a 3 in bbl 357 mag revolver stoked with +p 38's as a first handgun over any of the above (but that wasn't one of the choices - and just my opinion).

 

This isn't going to primarily be a CCW, its going to be a general purpose handgun.

 

How is the trigger on the SIG 225?

[paprotective 362]

Remington Golden Saber 124 and 147's in the 9 have no feed issues. The FLATTOP Federals are iffy in alot of firearms. I had a cheapy LLama Mini-Max 45 that was horrible even after a trip back to the importer. Gave that to my FFL with other firearms for $100 and was happy with loosing $225 on that POS.

 

I did notice in my Mak if I ran federal (remember 380 version) it would be a feeding challenge. Corrected with GS in 102 grains.

 

Single action on the Sig is like an XD and pretty smooth. Even DA mode is smooth.

 

Alo of places have the P225 for I think like high $3xx or so.

 

You make the call. Also remember the Mak may be harder to get spare grips, mags, etc. The Sig is off the shelf and can get ported barrells, mags, slides, um... kitchen sink. .

[buckandaquarterquarterstaff 5]

The double action of the sig is a heavy but smooth pull (the weight of pull will depend on who it was originally issued for - you can swap out springs pretty quickly to soften it up). The SA pull is really nice. If you have small to medium hands the sig is very comfy. The sig breaks down quickly, and is easy to service.

 

The rock island is a pretty good 45 for the money and all around not a bad utility gun, if that's what you're after. The only thing I would definately replace on it is the firing pin (right out of the box). It's an inexpensive part to replace, and get one that's a good tool steel. The stock RIA ones have been known to mushroom. All around it's OK (think of it as sort of a truck gun). It's generally known to be reliable and the 45 is definately the best stopper of the three (though the 9's ok too).

 

I don't have a mak, but have shot them and also the cz82. They have nice triggers and are really simple guns to break down. The blowback actions have pretty decent accuracy since the barrel is fixed on the frame. They are a little bit short on power, and good 9x18 ammo is not easy to find. If you have your C&R and reloading equipment, the cz82 is probably the best value of the three (delivered with 2 mags and a holster for under $200). They are sure to go up in value.

 

The revolvers best features are often overlooked in that the 357 mag can shoot 38's for practice, and you can go from mild to wild in one gun without having to contemplate spring weights. There's something to be said for being able to collect your brass without crawling around. The reason I suggested a 3 in was that it would likely have a full length extractor.

 

Let us know how it turns out for you once you decide.

[shaneman153a 39]

Unsafe? - You not only have to take the safety off, you have to engage the grip safety and engage the trigger. (series 70 have 2 safeties, series 80 have 3 safeties)

 

Glock - engage the trigger and off you go. (No safety)

 

1911

 

I didn't feel safe carrying a 1911, but now I carry a Glock (as 1911 and I have discussed at great length). The main reason is that I've spent a couple years of my life carrying a 92f, and anytime it's in a holster without a tang strap, it would shift and the safety would dis-engage.

 

I've never had that happen with my (old) 1911, and it shouldn't, considering that the safety design is different than the beretta (down vs. up, frame, etc.), but it was always in the back of my mind when I carried it. Also, the trigger on it was so light and short, it could hypothetically go off very easily if it moved in and out of the holster (not likely). I think if it didn't have the big-ass ambi-safety I wouldn't have any problems with it.

 

That being said, I feel pretty safe with the Glock. If you don't use "mexican carry" (no holster), don't use a thumb break holster, always be mindful of the trigger when putting it in, and keep yer finger off it 'till yer ready to use it, it won't go off. Note - You should do this with all guns, BTW

 

But, the "G word" wasn't even a choice up there, so why are we even talking about it?

 

OP'er - I've had a hard-on for Mak's lately, so I say go with that. Also, if this is your first handgun and you DO intend to carry it, it may be a good idea to get the most concealable one out of the bunch. That way it the least uncomfortable for you when you first start carrying. Less chance of you to get discouraged and leave it at home.

 

And one more note - the 9x18 compact in your waistband is more effective than the midsize (huge) 9mm, or the fullsize .45 in your nightstand. Just my .02

[Shellshock1918 1]

Interesting input. I will let you guys know how things progress in the coming weeks!

[nalioth 405]

East German Makarov

pros: small for CCW, accurate durable, collector's piece

cons: ammo can't be bought at walmart

Not an option, IMHO. SD ammo is just not available in any variety.

Sig 225/P6

pros: its a SIG, 9mm can be bought any where, medium size (in between 1911 and Makarov)

cons: single stack 9mm

I don't see any cons here. It's not about the number of rounds in the gun, it's where you put them. If you think you'll need more than the 9 rounds the pistol carries, throw an extra mag in your pocket.

Rock Island Arsenal 1911A1

pros: ITS A FRIGGIN 1911 MAN, 45 ACP, ammo can be bought anywhere

cons: kinda big for CCW

Again, I suspect you'll be surprised at how easily this conceals. It has a flat profile, unlike the bulging bellies of the 17 round wonder-nines.

 

A wide variety of 9mm and .45 ACP SD ammo from Federal, Winchester, Remington, etc, ad nauseum is available. Most of it is issued or approved for police use.

[shaneman153a 39]

One other thing to consider is cost of ammo. I think current Wal-Mart prices, for Win range ammo (box of 100) are:

 

.45 ACP 32.99

 

.40 S&W 26.99

 

9mm 18.99

 

9x18 (Mail order)

[jrance@iacwds.com 716]

CCI Blazer at Natchez Shooters Supply

 

 

CC3570 BLAZER 45 ACP 230GR FMJ In Stock $13.99

 

See there Shane, it is cheaper to practice with a .45acp than it is a 9mm. As far as not feeling safe carrying a 1911a1, feelings are not really the issue are they?

[shaneman153a 39]

That's only 50 rounds per box bra'. 10 boxes/500rds 158.86 shipped vs. 99.65 for same-brand 9mm

 

Actually, if I can't forget about the gun, I'll be constantly tryin' to sneak-a-peek, checkin' safety, etc.

 

If one carry gun fit everyone, there would only be one, same with holsters, carry methods, calibers, etc.

 

 

p.s. - I usually carry a .40.

Edited April 7, 2008 by shaneman153a

[jrance@iacwds.com 716]

True, True. They may not be for everybody but I like em.

[shaneman153a 39]

I still like 'em, I just didn't trust the one I had. I need to get me a beat-up, loose-as-hell tolerances, GI model.

[philg80 1]

Just went over the same options with a friend. He wanted a gun for CC and for practice at the range. I personally love CZ or any of its copies as a dual purpose gun. A CZ or copy points well and can hold 14 plus rounds of 9mm depending on model. I think you will highly regret buying a Mak or a 225. Single stack is great for CC but limits range times due to reloading issues and the Mak is underpowered for a lot of purposes and the 225 is about the same size as most double stacks of the same caliber. 1911's are wonderful and can be very safe for CC and make excellent range weapons because it seems to me you do a "different" type of shooting. The 45 has the power to stop with one hit so only having around 8rds is fine. If you can try and check www.centerfiresystems.com out. They have some great deals on handguns. The Rock Island copy of a CZ in four different models as well as the 1911's. If you choose the 1911 go ahead and pay the extra for the Tactical. If comes with the features most people add to military 1911s(guide rods, beaver tail, extended ambi safety, better sights.....).

[SuAside 2]

as a first gun? either get a .22LR or the 1911.

[Shellshock1918 1]

as a first gun? either get a .22LR or the 1911.

 

 

First handgun.

[paprotective 362]

More people killed in US by 22 cal than other sizes. BTW. Its not about the Cal. (ok yeah it is)

 

Walther P22 with SPECIAL ADD-ons. (with stamp of course) NICE...

[Shellshock1918 1]

My fickle mind has changed again so I'll add two pistols to the list:

 

Steyr M40A1

 

Kel-Tec PF-9

[nalioth 405]

My fickle mind has changed again so I'll add two pistols to the list:

 

Steyr M40A1

 

Kel-Tec PF-9

Some European countries use the Steyr for their military issue pistol. It is the same size as a Glock 19 and very smooth. The fellow who designed it worked with old Gaston Glock for around 20 years, so think of it as an "improved Glock". They're not really well known here because their importer sucks in the publicity department.

 

http://www.steyrclub.com for more info.

[Vultite 57]

If your gonna go with a CCW handgun, get whatever will fit your hand properly and still small enough to conceal, but if its gonna be a range gun, you can build a 1911 style gun from the ground up, but if you want a easy suggestion....

 

CCW : G19, springfield XD compacts, KAHR MK9, New Ruger .380 acp ($275 from on point supply and better then a kel-tec), Ruger SP101

Range guns: STI, Laes Baer, RRA, Colt Delta (if you like 10mm)

 

Notice how i didn't mention Kimber? cause they suck =) btw, if you choose a POCKET 1911 like a Para Hog 9, plan on swapping out the recoil spring earlier then other handguns, they wear out faster.

Edited April 7, 2008 by Vultite

[Shellshock1918 1]

My fickle mind has changed again so I'll add two pistols to the list:

 

Steyr M40A1

 

Kel-Tec PF-9

Some European countries use the Steyr for their military issue pistol. It is the same size as a Glock 19 and very smooth. The fellow who designed it worked with old Gaston Glock for around 20 years, so think of it as an "improved Glock". They're not really well known here because their importer sucks in the publicity department.

 

http://www.steyrclub.com for more info.

I've been to the steyr club website and I am a member on that forum. They are interesting handguns.

[ravenwolf 0]

Walther P99, or a version of.

[shaneman153a 39]

Steyr M40A1

 

Hell yeah! Awesome gun for the money. I don't own one, but I love 'em. The first generation had lots of issues, so they have a bad name in some circles, e.g. Shotgun News. (Anyone else read that article dogging them out? They didn't even mention the A1's)

 

I've only known one person personally who owns an A1, and he's had no problems with it.