Saiga 12 will not cycle low brass, I expected this but want to make su

[Roadblock 1]

Just picked up a S-12 Sporter. Just finished my conversion. Bought some Herters 2 3/4 7 1/2 target loads which are low brass and it will not cycles on the number 1 or number 2 positions.

 

So far all I had done was add the C.S.S. piston to the gas system.

 

My understanding is that this is somewhat normal. Some people report they have S-12's and never had any issues but it sounds like the majority do?

 

I saw the thread about opening up the gas block to more of a D shape if the ports were obstructed. Well, I can actually see all 3 ports OK'ish when taking the regulator plug out but it's no where as open as what I would get if I modified the gas block.

 

I did order the DPH plug and enhance spring which will give me all 3 parts that would come in the "Fixer" kit that C.S.S. sells.

 

Should I still open up the gas block or should I wait for the gas regulator? Why would this gas regulator work better then the factory one if one of the settings is FULL open but still doesn't cycle?

 

Seems most people on this forum prefer to keep the stock print over the enhanced one that claims to be 2 3/4 low brass freidnly.

 

Comments? Thoughts? Suggestions?

[lbsrdi 1,078]

My advice is that you need to read the stickies and search the forum to become more knowledgable about your gun. You may get responses here that satisfy you, but by reading up on these types of threads you will get a broader perspective.

[poolingmyignorance 2,191]

Do the mods. Drop in parts are bandaide fixes

[misterT 174]

Did you shoot it BEFORE you converted to make sure it cycled well in stock form?

[Eric Pate 478]

IIRC the "D-mod" on the gas block is usually not recommended. I believe correctly sizing the barrel ports is the preferred method for getting undergassed guns to cycle weak loads.

 

Read up. Theres tons of info here and some of it is conflicting.

[Nephilim7 107]

Will a mod PLEASE remove the freaking "Modification to repair FTE issues on Saigas with blocked gas ports" from the stickies?!?!?!?  In my opinion, it is the most destructive post on this forum.

 

 

To the OP:

 

Welcome!  We are glad to have you.

 

***Slow down and read A LOT.  Some info on here is crap, but some is good.  Learn to discern it before you tear up your gun.  We get too many posts just like this one, and we are drowning in misinformation.

 

-DPH plug (every plug, for that matter) is more constrictive than the factory plug on setting 2.  If it won't run there, then the DPH plug will only choke off more gas needed to cycle.

 

-The softer recoil spring you bout is trash if you plan on shooting anything other than 3 dram loads.

 

-When comparing "cycling power" of loads, look at the dram equivalent.  3 dram is the accepted minimum to shoot for.

 

-You may not need port work.

 

-You may have four ports, not three.

 

-Read, then read some more.  Use Google to search the forum for topics.

 

Good luck! 

[Mullet Man 2,114]

Will a mod PLEASE remove the freaking "Modification to repair FTE issues on Saigas with blocked gas ports" from the stickies?!?!?!?  In my opinion, it is the most destructive post on this forum.

 

 

That's quite a statement. It worked great for me.

IIRC the "D-mod" on the gas block is usually not recommended. I believe correctly sizing the barrel ports is the preferred method for getting undergassed guns to cycle weak loads.

 

Read up. Theres tons of info here and some of it is conflicting.

Opening the gas block is one part of clearing obstructions. How one chooses to do it, whether its a D shape, drilling it, or just beveling it to allow flow, is IMO, dependent on how obstructed the ports are. Some need clearance some don't.

[Nephilim7 107]

 

Will a mod PLEASE remove the freaking "Modification to repair FTE issues on Saigas with blocked gas ports" from the stickies?!?!?!?  In my opinion, it is the most destructive post on this forum.

 

 

That's quite a statement. It worked great for me.

 

I stand behind my statement.  I said that post is destructive.  I did not say that gas block windows should never be clearanced for ports or that it doesn't work.  The thread is well-intentioned but misleads people to hack up their gas blocks (sometimes when clearancing is not even needed).  I will clarify.

 

Here we go again...  The post to which I referred is destructive, because it can be risky and is shown executed incorrectly in at least two ways.  First, the gas block impingement window is cut too far because the flat side of the "D" shape extends into the channel just beyond the regulator threads.  Second, the cut itself is done by cutting thru the entire thickness of the gas block window.  As stated many times before, it would be better to leave the inside suface of the gas impingement window (inside of gas block) in tact as it comes from the factory and bevel away from that inside edge to the port side of the gas block wall so as to uncover all ports just enough.  Ports can be positioned directly behind the bevel, but should be fully uncovered at the contact of the barrel to the barrel side of the gas block window.  This should form a kind of "cone" shape gas impingement window in the gas block wall to funnel gas from all uncovered ports up into the block through the factory sized hole on the inside of the gas block.  I will state again that it is not very common to need to do this mod, and it can make quite a mess if executed poorly.  I am very glad Mullet Man executed it well (he knew what he was doing).    

 

I will reiterate:   Mods, PLEASE remove that junk thread!!!  If I had a gun with a faulty window, I would gladly take pics of the propper way to fix it and make a tutorial.  Maybe someone will take the lead on this...

 

I am done commenting about gas block mods in this guy's thread.  It was not my intention to take it over, but the misinformation should be addressed, especially at it's source (That blasted thread!).

Edited October 15, 2013 by Nephilim7

[poolingmyignorance 2,191]

Drilling holes bigger won't make any difference if they are still covered by the gas block once it's put back on.

Also drilling previously unblocked ports bigger can often land you in a piston where the larger hole is now partially covered. Just something to be aware of

[bobabuee 29]

 

+1 Nephilim7

 

 

 

just get rid of part where it says to make the letter "D" in gas block no reason for doing this.....!

 

The letter "D" stands for dumb info and destructive..... wrong wrong wrong don't do it!!!!

 

increase the size of the gas hole if any port is blocked by the gas block hole, and do not go in direction of gas plug threads.

 

if it is 3 port gun increase port size 1 or 2 sizes reinstall block test.

 

if still not working remove gas block drill another hole start with original size hole reinstall gas block test.

 

if not working remove block drill 4 hole bigger re install gas block & test.

 

using stock puck,gas plug and spring

 

also make sure you bolt carrier is sliding free polish the carrier rails. rough spots on the assembly and the FCG.

 

also hand cycle carrier bolt couple hundred times this helps too.

 

if still having problems add css puck & test

 

should fixed by now....

 

ammo choice should be 2 3/4, 3dram and 1200 and above anything below 3dram and 1200 your going to have trouble with.

 

Winchester wally world bulk pack just plane sucks remember it only costs couple cents more to shoot better stuff and less FTE's

or FTF's

Edited October 16, 2013 by bobabuee

[burntpowder 23]

OP........The Herter's Field and Target Loads (dark red hull with gold print) that you purchased, were they the....

 

1-1/8oz - 7-1/2 - 1,200 FPS

 

OR

 

1oz - 7-1/2 - 1,290 FPS

I have heard of people having some issues with the lighter 1oz version (I never shot it myself.....always got the 1-1/8th oz case)

Either way it sounds like you just bought the gun, never shot it, converted it and hoped to shoot very inexpensive low brass right out of the gate........most of the time that does not happen.  If it did this site would have about a million less posts on it.

 

If you must shoot Herter's (I do....nothing wrong with it) on a brand new-never shot firearm, pick up a case of the Select Field Pheasant in #4 or #5.......it is only $20 more a case than the stuff you got, is High Brass and 1-1/4oz. @ 1,220 FPS.  Roll though a half a case of that on the #1 gas setting on your FACTORY plug and then try your low brass on the #2 setting of your FACTORY plug.  If all works out, then put that DPH plug in and play around with it but you should get it cycling on factory parts first before changing things out.

Edited October 16, 2013 by burntpowder

[gunfun 3,931]

Those shells are the right power. I will add my vote to not doing a D cut. The bulk of Neph's advise is spot on.

 

If you have a port that is covered, only remove enough metal to uncover it. This can be done better with a drill bit most of the time.

 

My only quibble with what Neph said is this: A port is either blocked or it isn't there is no such thing as "more unblocked." there is such a thing as bigger. 

 

There is no advantage or benefit to trying to direct gas in a sealed cylendar. PSI and an opening is all  that matters once it is in. I wish I still had the links to some scientific tests that were done to debunk manufacturer claims about a similar notion in another application.

 

I put links in my signature line specifically because I think those threads address it better than the D mod thread. If you are planning to have a bolt profile done, do that first. Otherwise, slick up the rails and  then fix the hammer profile as shown in the "trigger" link below, and move back to front or front to back. Be as systematic as possible and don't solve problems you may not have. Your problem could go away just with spending 15 minutes contouring the hammer with a file or sander and removing burrs and paint off the rails. If not gas work  is less scary than you would think. Getting the trigger group installed the firs time is harder IMO, and you've already managed that.

[foooman 0]

Im a newbie but my biggest mistake with my new saiga that FTE was too light of shells, improper break in and failure to oil properly, with emphasis on oil properly. Once I oiled properly, changed to heavier load, (Federal bulk pack instead of Winchester) my unmodded saiga works like a charm.

[gunfun 3,931]

You don't really need to "break in" It's a waste of money and time. Cycling the spring by hand by working the action a hundred times in a few minutes does the same thing as $60 worth of buckshot for free. As for wearing in the rails, etc. Some fine sandpaper and oil will do a much better job than allowing friction to wear where it pleases. 10 minutes  of obvious clean upwill do more good than the 100 rounds of buckshot that many people suggest.

[poolingmyignorance 2,191]

Gun fun is right on with the sanding versus break in. If your not in a big hurry, you can have a pro, reprofile your bolt and carrier and really improve things. The carrier is easy, but the bolt must be done correctly so don't try it at home with out somebody with experience for guidance. Reducing the extreme corners on your hammer face is another good place to reduce drag.

[burntpowder 23]

You don't really need to "break in" It's a waste of money and time. Cycling the spring by hand by working the action a hundred times in a few minutes does the same thing as $60 worth of buckshot for free.

Some do not view shooting a firearm as a waste of time and money but may view jacking your action a few hundred times monotonous and the leading cause of carpal tunnel among S12 shooters.

[Roadblock 1]

First off I want to say thank you for the replies. Also I have been doing a TON of reading here which was why I posted my questions. This is my first shotgun. When I say first shotgun, I mean FIRST shotgun! Picked a hell of a shotgun to learn on huh? =)

 

I've big into 1911's and AR-15's. I've never bought a off the shelf AR before, I've always build my own. I've also re-worked all of my 1911's and build two of them from bare Wilson Combat frames and slides. I like to tinker.

 

I've also done a conversion on an HK USC to UMP and a SL8 to G36K.

 

Funny story, I went clay shooting about a month ago with some friends from Chruch. I'd never done this before but with my first box of shells I was out shooting others who has been doing it for years with someone elses Remington 870. I was hooked so I went out to buy a Remington 870 Express which then turned into a Benelli M4. Just as I was about to buy the B-M4 for $1800 dollars, I saw the Saiga 12. I ended up getting the S-12 and another COLT 1911 instead.

 

I've sene plenty of S-12 conversions, I'd just never thought to do one. I'd never seen a Saiga 12 in a local shop before. This purchase was done on a whim for sure!

 

That said I do not like the 3-gun looking Saiga's or the ones with the rails. They look stupid to me. I'm trying to keep it looking at much like a Russian military style shotgun as possble so I've not really changed anything yet. The only things I've done other then the pistol grip, stock and FCG are the C.S.S. puc. I did the puc because I needed a 922r part. Unless I can find another 922r part to install, I've got to keep the C.S.S. puc.

 

I have the K-Var front RPK style hand guard set coming but I need this to compenstate for the fact that I won't be running a U.S. made pistol grip, I just recieved a factory Izhmash Saiga 12 pistol grip in the mail yesterday.

 

That said I can clearly see 3 ports. They look to be drilled properly. They are clean and I do not see burrs or shavings in them. One of the ports is clearly visable and the other 2 I can see appear to be RIGHT on the edge of the gas block hole but not covered. I do not see a forth port.

 

As for the shells, they are Herters 1oz, 2 3/4, 7 1/2 1290 FPS low brass.

 

I would prefer not to hack anything up or drill anything if I don't have to. I have no fear of doing this but it looks like the gas blocks are hard to get for the S-12 and the barrels look to be impossible to get! I do not plan to use this for home defense or when the Zombie's attack so if I have a failure here an there, it's no big deal. However right now I basically have a pump action S-12! =)

 

I've skimmed the responses, I'm at work right now. I will read all of them with more attention to detail when I get home tonight. I might have more questions.

 

Thank you everyone!

[Cobra 76 two 2,677]

 

 

Will a mod PLEASE remove the freaking "Modification to repair FTE issues on Saigas with blocked gas ports" from the stickies?!?!?!?  In my opinion, it is the most destructive post on this forum.

 

 

That's quite a statement. It worked great for me.

 

I stand behind my statement.  I said that post is destructive.  I did not say that gas block windows should never be clearanced for ports or that it doesn't work.  The thread is well-intentioned but misleads people to hack up their gas blocks (sometimes when clearancing is not even needed).  I will clarify.

 

Here we go again...  The post to which I referred is destructive, because it can be risky and is shown executed incorrectly in at least two ways.  First, the gas block impingement window is cut too far because the flat side of the "D" shape extends into the channel just beyond the regulator threads.  Second, the cut itself is done by cutting thru the entire thickness of the gas block window.  As stated many times before, it would be better to leave the inside suface of the gas impingement window (inside of gas block) in tact as it comes from the factory and bevel away from that inside edge to the port side of the gas block wall so as to uncover all ports just enough.  Ports can be positioned directly behind the bevel, but should be fully uncovered at the contact of the barrel to the barrel side of the gas block window.  This should form a kind of "cone" shape gas impingement window in the gas block wall to funnel gas from all uncovered ports up into the block through the factory sized hole on the inside of the gas block.  I will state again that it is not very common to need to do this mod, and it can make quite a mess if executed poorly.  I am very glad Mullet Man executed it well (he knew what he was doing).    

 

I will reiterate:   Mods, PLEASE remove that junk thread!!!  If I had a gun with a faulty window, I would gladly take pics of the propper way to fix it and make a tutorial.  Maybe someone will take the lead on this...

 

I am done commenting about gas block mods in this guy's thread.  It was not my intention to take it over, but the misinformation should be addressed, especially at it's source (That blasted thread!).

 

 

 

^^^^^ THIS!!! ^^^^

 

            

 

 

 

 He's right it's a very destructive thread and needs to be voted off the forum apparently, as I know I'm not the only one who is tired of bitching about it and still seeing people every day reading it then hacking up a perfectly good Saiga 12. It's really getting ridiculous mods. WTF does it take?

 It is certainly NOT... I REPEAT N-O-T just that retarded "D" mod that makes the whole thread possibly the worst one on the entire forum either. I have also said this many times. Who listens to me though... nobody.  pssssh! whateva....

 

 I will say it ONE more time and if y'all wanna leave that bullshit up on your forum just great. You do that. Maybe it's job security for people selling shotguns IDK....

 

 The WHOLE thread is written as a step by step guide. People who are just starting out have NO IDEA that if they follow a step by step "tutorial" on the leading forum for S-12 info on the web, that happens to even be a STICKY for crying out loud!!! They have no idea anything in there could possibly be dangerous. All they see is all the people cheering on the modifications and say "good job awesome thread...".  They have no idea which parts to leave out and will not bother listening to the bold disclaimers and warnings that have apparently been added after the fact. This is proof RIGHT HERE!

 

 JUNK it! Lose it to the very bottom of the trash bin that is no longer even visible. It is OUT DATED and very BAD INFO.

 

 Geez just the part alone about "ROUNDING OFF CORNERS ON CAMS AND BOLT CARRIER CHANNELS, TIMING GROOVES" (or whatever whoever wants to name these parts...) is so ridiculously dangerous I still cannot believe that crap is still able to be seen here! I have personally gotten more sets in here for service than I care to remember, which were TOAST from being ruined in this manner. I could not (WOULD  NOT) even service these sets because I didn't want to be held responsible when someone loses half their face one day from a catastrophic failure due to the gun finally coming apart! I had to send one guy a brand new set I managed to get from Clyde because he was nice enough to scrounge one up for the guy under warranty. That particular one had eaten itself without having been ruined by someone with a dremel and bad info. It was just a factory defect... but the damage is the same and it is irreparably Irreplaceable!

 

 Is this thread not enough final proof for you guys to strike that crap down for good????      

 

 

 

 Roadblock I'm sorry but this can of worms needs to be tossed out it has been smelling up the place for too long man. Thank you for bringing it back into the light.

 

 I know what's wrong with the gun and you don't want to go hacking up the gas block to fix it. If anything, AFTER the other reliability mods have been made to the bolt, carrier, hammer, and smoothing the rails, etc, then and only then should you bother with the gas block. And even then the ports need only clearance 'd a small bit and only from the underside on a bevel.

 

 Nephilm7 is telling it like it is. And BTW I did already post a tutorial on the CORRECT way to fix the obstructed gas ports problem, complete with good photos I spent some time taking and posting. But it's not in any "sticky" like that BS that has people hacking up their guns. Nobody listened to me because I'm a vendor here making money on fixing people's guns to run the right way. The info was totally free but is long buried under a million DIY threads posted by people who don't know anything....

 

 

 Rant off.... 

[Mullet Man 2,114]

I guess I just fail to see how the D mod is dangerous or considered "hacking up your gas block". I definitely understand how messing with the mechanics and timing can be dangerous. I didn't know that stuff was in that topic. I wisened up and sent mine to Pauly so he could fix another vendors hack job on my parts.

 

There are countless S12's, mine included that run great using the gassing portion of that DIY tutorial. Anyway, like I said it worked great and continues to work great for me.

[pedal2alloy 206]

The D mod came from a rare occurrence where the gas block was blocking some gas ports on a few guns from one batch.  But speaking of paying attention, I remember Cobra or Mike D saying that it only needs to be opened up enough to let the gas thru, and if you do more you are increasing the volume which reduces the gas energy.  To me that's the best reason not to do it, just bevel it like Cobra said

[Mullet Man 2,114]

The D mod came from a rare occurrence where the gas block was blocking some gas ports on a few guns from one batch.  But speaking of paying attention, I remember Cobra or Mike D saying that it only needs to be opened up enough to let the gas thru, and if you do more you are increasing the volume which reduces the gas energy.  To me that's the best reason not to do it, just bevel it like Cobra said

Sure I get that.

But if that volume and pressure was never there to begin with (blocked ports, small ports, not enough ports, etc.), how does anyone know exactly how a particular gun is affected by the miniscule amount of material that gets removed from opening the window? Removing the gas block in the first place means you are in there to fix some issue, one of those is volume (port size). The D topic isn't just about the gas block window.

And the whole aiming the gas at the piston idea is absurd. Its about pressuring the gas block until the only moveable object....moves.

 

My only point is from the amount of material I removed to form the D shape in my gas block had no adverse effect. And I didnt even open my ports like everyone suggests 3-4 all at the same size. I have two different size ports (3 ports total) that feed my D window shaped extra volume having gas block and it cycles.

Edited October 17, 2013 by Mullet Man

[gunfun 3,931]

 

You don't really need to "break in" It's a waste of money and time. Cycling the spring by hand by working the action a hundred times in a few minutes does the same thing as $60 worth of buckshot for free.

Some do not view shooting a firearm as a waste of time and money but may view jacking your action a few hundred times monotonous and the leading cause of carpal tunnel among S12 shooters.

 

 

1. It is a monotonous waste of time to tell someone with 2 blocked ports to spend a frustrating range trip trying to cycle through 100 shells munching every other one. That takes more time. Instead do things that are certain to work and check the things that matter. Springs don't care how they are compressed just whether they are compressed. If your wrist can't handle working the bolt a hundred times in five minutes 12 Ga is more than you can handle anyway.

2. If your gun will cycle the ammo, it's fun. Trying to make an unreliable gun work by clearing jams for an hour is not fun. It is not the most cost effective way to achieve reliabilityeither. Moreover it doesn't give you the information you need. You can eliminate the spring break in before you even get to the range. If you take the standard 3 dram test load to the range and have deburred the rails, you can set the gas to #2 and your first couple of mags will tell you whether you need to do more work. No BS about "give it another couple of trips, maybe then it will be broken in enough to work." Eliminate variables definitively and move on. You can elimiate friction , and spring wear, and spring stacking before you even get to the range. That leaves only bolt profile and gas flow to assess. Then your first range trip is guaranteed to be productive. When you come home, you will know from trip 1 whether you want to knock the block off or not.

[Mullet Man 2,114]

+1 Nephilim7

 

 

 

just get rid of part where it says to make the letter "D" in gas block no reason for doing this.....!

 

The letter "D" stands for dumb info and destructive..... wrong wrong wrong don't do it!!!!

 

increase the size of the gas hole if any port is blocked by the gas block hole, and do not go in direction of gas plug threads.

 

Please tell me why it is destructive.

And just which way are you suppose to open the gas block window if the ports are obstructed in the direction of the threads? 

My ports were covered in the direction of the threads. They are in the shape of a triangle and two of them were towards the threads.... help me. Drilling the window hole larger would increase the volume way more then the D mod, just beveling the original hole would still not uncover the outside edges of the holes, especially after enlarging them, so how do you go about it?

Edited October 17, 2013 by Mullet Man

[Roadblock 1]

After some careful examination, I've learned that I actually have four (4) ports in my barrel.

I can not actually see one of them from the gas block BUT if I shine my 300 lumen Surefire LED light down the barrel from the threaded end and look into the gas regulator, I can clearly see 4 points of light shining. They are in a diamond formation with one at the back, two to the sides and one in the forward most position of the formation. The one forward most seems to be JUST either under or right on the edge of the gas blocks large hole because I could not see it without light shining threw it.

Also Cobra, I think I found the picture you where referring to with the beveled edge... Looks like the bevel might not necessarily uncover a covered gas port but would allow the gas to come up and maybe deflect off the bevel as it goes up into the gas chamber... Is that the picture?

[Cobra 76 two 2,677]

If you have a gas block already off it is very easy to tell just how much (if any) partial obstruction you have. There is an obvious shadowed or darkened area printed on top of the barrel from the carbon. If the port is really actually blocked it will be obviously outside the circle or cut into the edge of it. However the gas block hole is designed that way with a bevel on the lower surface of the block, to give it a smaller hole on the topside, while still allowing access from below for the gas to get through by following the beveled away part. This is not because they didn't think it over well. The ports are drilled at a rearward angle to keep as much crud and plastic from getting shaved off as possible when the shot cup or slug goes past. I have mirrors I use to hold inside the gas block and can see back up under the lip of the gas hole to tell just how much if any is really blocked, whether you can see the port or not from the front opening. Even sticking a bent wire back in there it is still not as easy to tell if the port is fully open or not, and possibly only looking or feeling obstructed from above.

 

 Cutting out the entire area square, even past the point even close to necessary is just plain stupid. Some people are just that way I guess so they do it anyway because they saw a picture of another guy doing that. This is why that picture and the "tutotrial" telling people to do that should be removed. In that pic it plainly shows where the cut was made so deep it actually entered the recessed ring that runs around the base of the threads of the gas plug, Bye bye gas seal... hello shitloads more carbon able to build up there.  Stupid.

 

 Let's see... If ya want to use a double hook trigger in a receiver like the Saiga with only one notch... do you :

A. Drill and cut another matching notch neatly on the other side of the trigger hole to clear the sear... or...

B. Hack out a huge square hole just because you can and some guy happened to post a tutorial on an AK forum saying to do that to fix the binding prob???

 

 Stupid is as stupid does Forest said... 

 

 Edit to add yes Roadblock the pics I posted of this easy fix without disfiguring and possibly ruining the whole gas block is probably the one you found. All that is really necessary is to clear enough away from the obstructed part of the hole, at a bevel the same direction of the port angle in the block above, so that gas is free to enter the entire round hole of the port without pinching off the diameter  / bore size of the port. After that is is expanding into the manifold area and driving the piston back. Removing any more than that is a waste of time and only copying a picture. It isn't helpful.

[Nephilim7 107]

Roadblock,

My gas system is exactly the same as you described. My gun runs like a sewing machine and it has never had the block off. I was able to take a sharp dental pick and delicately run the tip from inside the forward port against the forward edge into the gas block until it slid easily past the lowest edge of the gas window. I stopped at that point and pushed back down into the port and the hook hung on the edge of the port. This proved the port walls where exposed at the farthest toward the gas block window they could be. I had to probe around for a few minutes to feel it out like a blind man with a cane. Worked very well for me. You can also break a small mirror and fix the shard to a stick or some such armature at a 45 degree angle to take a look. My dental mirror was too wide to fit into the gas block. I bet this is much to do about nothing. I really think your gas block and ports are fine.

 

Mullet Man:

I will make one exception to my "no more comments" rule since it seems appropriate, and we have already blown up this guy's thread.

 

I do not know what I am talking about at this point, but I will make a guess. I would put forward that in the event of a port untraceable by bevelling, that port can be abandoned and a better positioned one drilled. It not, perhaps the gas block needs to be repinned in proper alignment. This would be a very very extreme case. Again, this advice would need to be verified with someone who has much more wisdom than I and has addressed a similar problem before.

Edited October 17, 2013 by Nephilim7

[Roadblock 1]

Unfortunately I'm not sure I'm any more ahead then before I asked the question. I'm almost more confused now I think!

 

I don't think I'm going to give up on the S-12 yet but I think I want to pick up a good ol Remington 870 Express too!

Edited October 17, 2013 by Roadblock

[poolingmyignorance 2,191]

Remove the block. It's easy. Drive out the two pins. You'll be able to tell typically which side they were driven in from because that side will be mushroomed, or just more flush. Then you can either press the block off, or drive it off with a rubber mallet.

Once it's off it will be easy to tell if your ports are obstructed. I recommend opening your ports up now while the block is of, or adding an additional port if you only have 3. Make them all.093 you won't hurt anything.you will need to maintain the factory angle of the gas ports. So you don't get a gaff block fill of crud. If your enlarged ports extend beyond the foot print of your gas block opening, then those are the spots you need to open on your gas block. Just enough to clear those spots. Reinstall block. Enjoy shot gun.

Edited October 17, 2013 by poolingmyignorance

[Roadblock 1]

Looks like I have 4 ports, not 3.

 

Cane someone give me the size for a 4 port barrel? Also what size drill bit?

[Nephilim7 107]

To quote a great philosipher:

 

 

Read, then read some more.  Use Google to search the forum for topics.

 

Good luck! 

 

 

Not to be rude, but it's all here many times over.  Learn by reading old threads.

 

This will get you started:   http://forum.saiga-12.com/index.php?/topic/81707-gas-ports-under-sized/