XD45 7,124 Posted May 8, 2014 Report Share Posted May 8, 2014 Topic. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
jwulf 179 Posted May 8, 2014 Report Share Posted May 8, 2014 Tool, but I still find that I hit the target better if I don't rely on the laser and use the sights instead. I say tool because if someone breaks in and you light them up, they may halt and I can avoid having to clean the carpet...I hate cleaning the carpet. In the absense of them immediately halting though...carpet can be cleaned or rreplaced. 3 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Doug Hartley 526 Posted May 8, 2014 Report Share Posted May 8, 2014 I say tool. They make getting hits much easier in low light situations. I have them on my HD guns and if I still worked with guns professionally I would have them installed. Lasers are not a substitute for good gun handling skills but when you can't see the sights they are there for you. The intimidation factor is an important added benefit. If you are using night vision, the IR lasers are fabulous. Here is a link to a shoot house we did several years ago with Crimson Trace IR laser vertical grips installed on SBRs. Without the NVGs you can't see the laser, with NVGs it looks like a green stick attached to your gun touching the target. The guy on the clock is Iain Harrison of Top Shot fame. Doug 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
james lambert 3,059 Posted May 8, 2014 Report Share Posted May 8, 2014 Good for mall ninjas and maybe old blind guys . Quote Link to post Share on other sites
magsite20 1,664 Posted May 8, 2014 Report Share Posted May 8, 2014 IMHO depends on the user and how used. most of the ones I've seen are just used as a toy but I guess they have a real world use too. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Dad2142Dad 6,559 Posted May 8, 2014 Report Share Posted May 8, 2014 Good for mall ninjas and maybe old blind guys . Hey now one day you'll be an old blind guy Tool if it is Green or IR in conjunction with night vision. Can also be just a fun toy (Red) for plinking Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Capt Nemo 882 Posted May 8, 2014 Report Share Posted May 8, 2014 Tool. I've used an old LS-45 HeNe to back a couple of punks down. They work well for that! The big thing is quality that most seem to lack. In that case, a lot are toys! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
james lambert 3,059 Posted May 8, 2014 Report Share Posted May 8, 2014 Good for mall ninjas and maybe old blind guys . Hey now one day you'll be an old blind guy Tool if it is Green or IR in conjunction with night vision. Can also be just a fun toy (Red) for plinking Too late...I am an old blind guy But I dont need a laser to make a shot count Jim 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
YOT 3,743 Posted May 8, 2014 Report Share Posted May 8, 2014 I understand both tool and toy, but I would never consider being dependent of one during crisis, even for a second. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
RED333 1,025 Posted May 8, 2014 Report Share Posted May 8, 2014 Well tool on a firearm, toy if the dog or cat is chasing it. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
toothandnail 275 Posted May 9, 2014 Report Share Posted May 9, 2014 I've found that most who discount laser's have never shot in low/no light, awkward, barricade, moving target situations. Many of those same guys will say a weapon light is of no use either. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
james lambert 3,059 Posted May 9, 2014 Report Share Posted May 9, 2014 I shot 100% on my night quals... no lasers allowed Many departments dont allow them. We can and do use weapon lights when we need them Jim Quote Link to post Share on other sites
ChileRelleno 7,071 Posted May 9, 2014 Report Share Posted May 9, 2014 (edited) They are tools & toys. They help us in certain scenarios, augment our capabilities and performance. And we can have all sorts of shooting fun with them. But they are no substitute for basic shooting skills with irons. We've two friends, the Powells, they both shoot & carry, but they rely way too much on their lasers. My wife and his go one of our local indoor ranges to shoot, my wife out shoots her with irons while she relies entirely on the laser. Same thing with her husband, he can hit the target with irons, but he has no consistency, no grouping to speak of. Edited May 9, 2014 by ChileRelleno Quote Link to post Share on other sites
ktcm7271 999 Posted May 9, 2014 Report Share Posted May 9, 2014 Laser bore sighters are great tools that save a lot of time. Laser sights are toys that are fun, but also have a degree of usefulness. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
toothandnail 275 Posted May 9, 2014 Report Share Posted May 9, 2014 Don't know what quals are like in your area, but around here Draw , shoot 4 shots in under 30 seconds, 7 yards, strong hand/weak hand. Draw shoot 2 shots under 4 seconds, 3 yds Same from behind barricade. No need for a laser, or sights for that matter. We're working along with their new trainer,(he's a great guy, pushing them to be better)trying to get them to train better, most are not interested. SWAT guys are for the most part, others not so much. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
LuPiN8oR 333 Posted May 9, 2014 Report Share Posted May 9, 2014 Lasers aren't meant to be a substitute for shooting with irons imo. They're only supposed to fill the niche of when its too dark to properly use your iron sights. Outside of that qualifier i think theyre just for fun. And that they are! I have a CT laser on my sr22, its fun to use the laser but if it weren't for its usefulness in some way shape or form i wouldn't have bothered. Did i mention i have a wife? LOL! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
SHOTGUN MESIAH 855 Posted May 9, 2014 Report Share Posted May 9, 2014 never liked lasers for the mere fact that they give away your position. I would rather be sighted on by a laser than some guy with iron sights/ scope out of my view . you have a split second of awareness when you see the laser, you have none with a scope or iron sights. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
pjj342 632 Posted May 9, 2014 Report Share Posted May 9, 2014 (edited) No one mentioned that a laser is a great tool to combat sloppy trigger control or flinching. I have always had a problem with anticipating shots. Im worse with some pistols than others, but having a laser to use occasionally 're learn' the proper trigger squeeze is pretty useful. Plus, the wife loves using them and anything that makes her want to shoot more (than she already does), is a good thing. Im not sure if id ever rely on one for an sd situation, unless I tested it alot, the pressure switch was reliable, and knew for sure it would work. Im always leery of chinese circuitry. I assume most under 100bucks are junk. I had a laserlyte v2 and it broke unexpectedly. It worked great until it didnt. Edited May 9, 2014 by Boomsick42 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
james lambert 3,059 Posted May 9, 2014 Report Share Posted May 9, 2014 Don't know what quals are like in your area, but around here Draw , shoot 4 shots in under 30 seconds, 7 yards, strong hand/weak hand. Draw shoot 2 shots under 4 seconds, 3 yds Same from behind barricade. No need for a laser, or sights for that matter. We're working along with their new trainer,(he's a great guy, pushing them to be better)trying to get them to train better, most are not interested. SWAT guys are for the most part, others not so much. Sounds like that departments quals are a joke. Our dept (Sheriffs) and State along with some special groups use a higher bar Quote Link to post Share on other sites
getitat 609 Posted May 9, 2014 Report Share Posted May 9, 2014 I say tool. They make getting hits much easier in low light situations. I have them on my HD guns and if I still worked with guns professionally I would have them installed. Lasers are not a substitute for good gun handling skills but when you can't see the sights they are there for you. The intimidation factor is an important added benefit. If you are using night vision, the IR lasers are fabulous. Here is a link to a shoot house we did several years ago with Crimson Trace IR laser vertical grips installed on SBRs. Without the NVGs you can't see the laser, with NVGs it looks like a green stick attached to your gun touching the target. The guy on the clock is Iain Harrison of Top Shot fame. Doug Hello What he said. I had written off lasers as a joke until I got my PVS-14 and helmet rig, suddenly IR lasers are a wonderful tool. -Guido Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Dogster 577 Posted May 9, 2014 Report Share Posted May 9, 2014 As an old, not blind, but in tri-focals, geezer, they are a tool for me. Difficult balancing between 3 lenses for rear, front sights and target. Once properly zeroed, they have most assuredly helped my shooting. If I could have em functional on long guns, I would. Tool or toy, depends on your needs/use. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
XD45 7,124 Posted May 9, 2014 Author Report Share Posted May 9, 2014 I find lasers the perfect tool for trigger control. When I tell a student that their shots are going low and left because they're anticipating the recoil and jerking the trigger they don't always believe me. Or maybe they do but they can't stop doing it. The laser dry fire is the best tool for learning trigger control. As far as using a laser in a real situation... Mixed feelings about that. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
ChileRelleno 7,071 Posted May 9, 2014 Report Share Posted May 9, 2014 My Dad was sheriffs deputy with the Lubbock County Sheriffs Dept, and their quals were 200rds. Varied distance, targets, time, number of rounds and reloads, and they had to shoot at least 150/75% on target. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
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