polik6887 0 Posted January 16, 2007 Report Share Posted January 16, 2007 who here has actually built a s-12 bullpup? i know there were a few pics floating around, but they didn't mention how the stock/trigger group was altered to work with the s-12. anybody been succesfull? as far as i can see this is the next evolution, i would love to see what tony at tromix could do with it. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
badman400 3 Posted January 16, 2007 Report Share Posted January 16, 2007 who here has actually built a s-12 bullpup? i know there were a few pics floating around, but they didn't mention how the stock/trigger group was altered to work with the s-12. anybody been succesfull? as far as i can see this is the next evolution, i would love to see what tony at tromix could do with it. I would also be interested in a Saiga 12 pup. I own the Bushmaster M17S, and I plan on owning the new Kel-Tec RFB as soon as it's released. Anyone have links to pics of Saiga pups? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Azkamidaka 26 Posted January 16, 2007 Report Share Posted January 16, 2007 Its ALL the way at the bottom of this page Quote Link to post Share on other sites
KySoldier 2 Posted January 16, 2007 Report Share Posted January 16, 2007 Good find Azkamidaka, hadn't seen those pics in a long time. Can't find the old topic but as I recall... 1 He made it during the ban (hence the PG turned quasi thumbhole) 2 Reenforced the plastic stock with aluminum 3 Said he'd never try making one again Quote Link to post Share on other sites
rebelyell76t 0 Posted January 16, 2007 Report Share Posted January 16, 2007 Good find Azkamidaka, hadn't seen those pics in a long time. Can't find the old topic but as I recall... 1 He made it during the ban (hence the PG turned quasi thumbhole) 2 Reenforced the plastic stock with aluminum 3 Said he'd never try making one again If there were detailed instructions I'd love to try it. I'd definately have to do a thumbhole style because of the deuche bag politics in N.Y. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
shaneman153a 39 Posted January 17, 2007 Report Share Posted January 17, 2007 (edited) Damn, that thing is badass!! Does anyone remember the OAL? I'm sure it would require a tax stamp or something. If it were long enough to make the cutoff, I guess that would defeat the purpose. Says he used this stock: http://www.mountsplus.com/products/Muzzeli...nstrustions.pdf Looks like a lot of work to convert, but can you imagine how evil that would look w/ a 10 rounder?? Edited January 17, 2007 by shaneman153a Quote Link to post Share on other sites
jgillaspy 24 Posted January 17, 2007 Report Share Posted January 17, 2007 What about this: http://www.k-var.com/shop/product.php?prod...=256&page=1 Is there enough difference in the receiver dimensions to prevent this from working? I have never seen an S-12 in person, so I don't have a clue. At least it is designed for the AK family of weapons. the trigger wire would have to be replaced w/ a trigger rod or the trigger pull would be horrible. . . Quote Link to post Share on other sites
PolarBearBait 3 Posted January 17, 2007 Report Share Posted January 17, 2007 (edited) What about this: http://www.k-var.com/shop/product.php?prod...=256&page=1 Is there enough difference in the receiver dimensions to prevent this from working? I have never seen an S-12 in person, so I don't have a clue. At least it is designed for the AK family of weapons. the trigger wire would have to be replaced w/ a trigger rod or the trigger pull would be horrible. . . Back in the 90s a friend and I put that kit together, or should I say tried. Think we got it from Duck Soup, it never really worked and the quality was low. Total POS!! But just my 2 cents I remember a while back, there was a guy from HKPro that made a working G36C stock for an Akins 10/22 that was fantastic. The guy is a wiz with fabricating plastic, now someone like that could maybe do this. Think it was MPfiveengineer. David Edited January 17, 2007 by PolarBearBait Quote Link to post Share on other sites
polik6887 0 Posted January 18, 2007 Author Report Share Posted January 18, 2007 the key seems to be the trigger assembly, anyone figure out a good way to make it work? anyone know how to get in touch with the guy that put the saiga in the muzzlelite stock? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
shaneman153a 39 Posted January 18, 2007 Report Share Posted January 18, 2007 I think the tough part would be fitting a 12 guage reciever and barrel in a .22 stock. that's gotta be a bitch Quote Link to post Share on other sites
kresk 10,063 Posted January 18, 2007 Report Share Posted January 18, 2007 I know of one very experienced gunsmith who did a bullpup AK conversion and said it was a royal pain in the ass and he'd never do another one. The bitch is a very long and contorted connection to the trigger which tends to be too flexible due to its length. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
badman400 3 Posted January 18, 2007 Report Share Posted January 18, 2007 Thnx for the finds guys! Interesting and informative. Maybe one of these days... Quote Link to post Share on other sites
G O B 3,516 Posted January 19, 2007 Report Share Posted January 19, 2007 It would seem to me that the only way to do a bullpup and get a decent trigger would be to use a power tool trigger, a battery and a solenoid. An electric trigger would not have lincage problems. (Don't use for HD, the damned batteries in everything always go dead at the worst time!) Quote Link to post Share on other sites
csspecs 1,987 Posted January 19, 2007 Report Share Posted January 19, 2007 (edited) metro barrel How about using the short length to include one of these? Quiet and short(well kinda short). Maybe cut the barrel down to below 18 and have it mounted permanently. Edited January 19, 2007 by csspecs Quote Link to post Share on other sites
IndyArms 10,186 Posted January 20, 2007 Report Share Posted January 20, 2007 Adding length to the "overall" is against the POINT of a bullpup in the first place... So... NO... you wouldnt want to add that... Quote Link to post Share on other sites
whatmanual 44 Posted January 21, 2007 Report Share Posted January 21, 2007 (edited) The bullpup looks nice in that pic. Too bad I'm a "lefty". Oh well for me. I wonder how loud that would be being right next to your ear though. Yikes. ~S Edited January 21, 2007 by whatmanual Quote Link to post Share on other sites
MadMax 0 Posted January 21, 2007 Report Share Posted January 21, 2007 (edited) --><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(G O B @ Jan 18 2007, 07:29 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->It would seem to me that the only way to do a bullpup and get a decent trigger would be to use a power tool trigger, a battery and a solenoid. I wouldn't recomend this - just imagine the problems if you had a short and it started sending random pulses to the firing mechanism. I have thought through some bullpup designs before. One way to tackle the long linkeage is to have the bar/rod rotate torsionally. This way the length of this connection does not matter all that much. There are a few other design issues introduced by this but that is the nature of design. Another way - the way KelTek did their new 7.62 bullpup - is to make the likeage transfer motion of the "hammer" (which is controlled directly by the trigger) to the second or actual hammer which strikes the firing pin. In other words, there would be a small, light lever where the hammer would usually be in the firing mechanism up front where the grip and trigger are. When the trigger is pulled this lever is released. As the lever rotates forward it pulls the actual hammer through a connecting rod. In the case of the KelTek they have used a set of dual rods (more like a set of linkeages) between this forward lever and the hammer in the rear. Complex, yes, and I expect the lock time would be not so great. But given that the Saiga is not a sniper weapon the lock time should not be such a big deal. Edited January 21, 2007 by MadMax Quote Link to post Share on other sites
BobAsh 582 Posted January 21, 2007 Report Share Posted January 21, 2007 Mad Max is correct...I don't know if it would even be legal. After all, Full-Auto conversion on a electrically-fired weapon would be trivial and require no extra hardware. Hmmm.... Quote Link to post Share on other sites
jman 0 Posted January 21, 2007 Report Share Posted January 21, 2007 My Valmet M82 has a pretty good trigger feel, and I've thought about adapting an S12 to this setup, but finding an M82 stock for a transplant is nearly impossible. And theres no way I would butcher a complete Valmet for this conversion. But I think it would be a nice setup if anyone could come up with a stock and trigger assy. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Make 5 Posted January 27, 2007 Report Share Posted January 27, 2007 (edited) Some sort of DIY bull-pup: http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=c08e111ab1 :D:D Edited January 27, 2007 by Make Quote Link to post Share on other sites
IndyArms 10,186 Posted January 27, 2007 Report Share Posted January 27, 2007 That looks cool... Very COARSE.. but functional... It makes me kinda leery, though... I feel as though I am watching some jihad video... "Death to the infidels", "heres the guns we use"...sort of thing... as I cant understand a word of what they are saying... ROFL!!! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
shaneman153a 39 Posted January 29, 2007 Report Share Posted January 29, 2007 (edited) Some sort of DIY bull-pup: http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=c08e111ab1 :D:D Goddamn, I thought the warsaw stocks were too close to the scope. Did you notice the name of the video was "If Cobra76two spoke derka" Edited January 29, 2007 by shaneman153a Quote Link to post Share on other sites
blkbd 0 Posted January 29, 2007 Report Share Posted January 29, 2007 (edited) I love Bullpups but that thing is a POS, And I'm sure the guy is touting how he is the PREMIER gunsmith in the area and the desgn is a one off original of his desgn. I might try the Muzzlelite but the quality of the plastic sucks and the other is to much cash. Edited January 29, 2007 by blkbd Quote Link to post Share on other sites
bugeye 2 Posted January 29, 2007 Report Share Posted January 29, 2007 I say when it comes to AK's....... buy AMERICAN! Democracy is two wolves and one sheep voting on what to have for dinner,..... Liberty is one well armed sheep contesting the vote Quote Link to post Share on other sites
shaneman153a 39 Posted January 30, 2007 Report Share Posted January 30, 2007 I say when it comes to AK's....... buy AMERICAN! Hmmmm....... I'd say, when it comes to gunboards....... GO SOMEWHERE ELSE!! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
aurbis 1 Posted January 30, 2007 Report Share Posted January 30, 2007 Buy Russian ARs! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
shaneman153a 39 Posted January 30, 2007 Report Share Posted January 30, 2007 Buy Russian ARs! If you show me one, I will. Just to piss off the AR community (The 10/22 community all grown up!) Quote Link to post Share on other sites
BattleRifleG3 16 Posted January 30, 2007 Report Share Posted January 30, 2007 I'm a fan of the long barreled bullpup. I don't really like bullpups that are butt-heavy, but fitting a long barrel inside something a foot or so shorter is my cup of tea. I'm greatly looking forward to seeing the new Kel-Tec 308 bullpup in person with a 32" barrel. Ballistics approach 300 win mag levels, and the muzzle blast should be pretty tame, not to mention the recoil. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
inparidel 4 Posted January 30, 2007 Report Share Posted January 30, 2007 Good find Azkamidaka, hadn't seen those pics in a long time. Can't find the old topic but as I recall... 1 He made it during the ban (hence the PG turned quasi thumbhole) 2 Reenforced the plastic stock with aluminum 3 Said he'd never try making one again If there were detailed instructions I'd love to try it. I'd definately have to do a thumbhole style because of the deuche bag politics in N.Y. I haven't had to address this since the AWB, but. . .ANY state that forbids PGs on any firearm, views thumbhole stocks AS the SAME as PG. Be advised. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
PolarBearBait 3 Posted January 31, 2007 Report Share Posted January 31, 2007 I'm a fan of the long barreled bullpup. I don't really like bullpups that are butt-heavy, but fitting a long barrel inside something a foot or so shorter is my cup of tea. I'm greatly looking forward to seeing the new Kel-Tec 308 bullpup in person with a 32" barrel. Ballistics approach 300 win mag levels, and the muzzle blast should be pretty tame, not to mention the recoil. The KEL-TEC RFB Rifle is very nice!! I don't want to wait a year to get one!! Kel-Tek RFB Rifle Link David Quote Link to post Share on other sites
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