Positive thread for LEO's

[Koliadko 207]

Seems like alot have vented their frustration at LEO's. I know, as do they (LEO's), that there is no group of people out there that are all good. But I think for the most part, they are all out there doing the best they can, as are they rest of us. But to condemn all of them is totally irrational. There are some here that are really great guys. How about a +1 for all of them? :super: :super:

[GPalmer 1]

:super: They're people like any others. I spend a lot of time on a LEO forum and it has really opened my eyes to see both sides of the story. I'll tell you I could never do their job though...

[Cobra 76 two 2,677]

Can I get a HELL YEAH!

No matter what a few negative assholes have to say...I do NOT believe the majority of police officers are bad people and dammit I have met quite a few of them! Some of those times were not the best for me either. I don't think anyone is ever happy when they or one of their friends are wearing handcuffs. You have to think about what it was you were doing that landed you in those chrome bracelets. These guys do their jobs, and some of them them go far out of their way to do them very well, and actually care a great deal about helping people. Have you ever needed help from a police officer and gotten that help?

 

I have.

[jrance@iacwds.com 716]

Obviously there are a many, many great LEO. Every one we have here is an exemplary example! So Cobra, "Hell Yeah!" You gentlemen have a tough job and are greatly appreciated.

 

1911

Edited May 2, 2009 by 1911

[hallboss 1]

Thank you.

 

I have known hundreds of great LEO's and only a hand-full of bad ones. I can't say that I was either one, but I did my best and gave 110% everyday to be the best cop I could be.

[GeorgiaPD 408]

++++++++1 to what Hallboss said. Thank you back...

[Bvamp 604]

I think highly of all LEO I have personally known, and knowing thier caliber of person, have come to respect "the man" for who and what they are and have to do. You REALLY have to want to help people to do that line of work. I just cant help everyone. I guess Im "biased" or some shit. Thats the HARD question for these guys and gals, and it aint an easy one.

 

Some of the best human beings I have known in my lifetime are LEOs.

[Nailbomb 10,221]

I have never been put into a position where i have needed them, but i cannot deny the need. I was looking at possible state or federal employment as a LEO befior i landed my gig as a union pipefitter.

 

That said i have noticed a large difference between the state or federal and local cops in my area. I won't speak highly of the local cops but we have a state trooper barracks nearby and they have never been anything but considerate to me. as a matter of fact i have a state trooper patch on one of my leathers... don't ask, but those guys have been cool to me.

 

one of my ex's is also a immigration officer and i keep telling her the stupid spics she is dealing with are not held under the constitution so she dosn't have to treat them like human beings but she does anyway...

 

whatever +1 to her too

 

in my own way and take it for what you will, i'm admitting they arn't all bad

 

god bless the good ones who arn't power drunk or there hiding behind a badge. i can respect anyone who can shake my hand at the end of a day as a human being. and yeah i have met them. I was doing 72 in a 40 befor and one had the courtesy to not tow my vehicle and take my liscence away on the spot. basicly he was suprised that i was honest when he asked how fast i was going, but the end result is he reduced it to 10 over and told me to quit that shit. I havn't done over 15 over scince.... thats a start right?

[SOPMOD 254]

There are some really good cops out there and I have met a few of them.Like one guy I've known for 20 years kicked off his shoes and dropped his gunbelt to swim out into a contaminated and nearly freezing Arkansas river in an attempt to save a drunk woman who's car went off the road into the water.I was there,in person,I watched him do it and that guy is what I thought law enforcement was all about when I was a younger and I am sure there are many "not so great" cops that would be better if the system and the culture of modern law enforcement allowed them to be.

 

I don't have the stomach for the things cops have to see anymore either and I'm glad they are there.Injured or dead babies,telling mammas that their kid died in an accident,having to be around Pedophiles and not being able to smash their skulls in,talking rape reports from brutalized women.All kinds of misery and tragedy I have witnessed and never want to see again.

 

Society cannot function without men and women who will look these things in the face on a daily basis and I appreciate that aspect of their service and dedication very much.

[Nailbomb 10,221]

Society cannot function without men and women who will look these things in the face on a daily basis and I appreciate that aspect of their service and dedication very much.

+1 I get alienated toward the human race too easy you don't want me doing it. at the very least be thankful of that.

[emptythemag 1]

People often talk about all the bad stuff they hear about police but seldom do people discuss all the good things we often do, without being noticed. Its like watching the news...all you ever hear is 97% all the bad stuff and 3% something positive.

 

Police officers come out of todays society and as a result, there are great cops, good cops and no doubt ...ones that are crappy as can be.

 

It's nice to hear from people who personally know a police officer, not just as a guy in a uniform, but as a guy with a wife and a family. Were real people, no different than the local plumber, carpenter or office worker. There are good and bad people in every race, religion and profession.

[Azrial 1,091]

Law Enforcement as a job leaves a lot to be desired. There is the danger, lack of money, poor working conditions, stress and they fact that you miss most holidays with your family. But, it is a calling and if you stay in it you are either a glutton for punishment, or there is something inside of you that requires this service to others.

 

True, we do attract our share of power hungry narcissists who really hate themselves deep down inside, but they usually don't last. There is too much of a down side to the job and it usually offsets the pleasure they derive from being an "authority figure."

 

Thanks for all the kind words, RaceGal and others, they are seldom heard.

[22_Shooter 1,560]

For my recent trip to SC, with my girl, we stayed with our friend and her husband. He's a cop near Myrtle Beach. Super nice guy, as was his buddy he introduced us to (also a cop).

 

The only thing I didn't like about him......................he took us to the range..........he brought his department issued M4..........he let me shoot it...........but of course, the range didn't allow FA/burst fire. So, only for the fact that it was a giant dick-tease, I HAAAAAAAAATE him!!!!!!!!

 

No seriously though......I've run into WAY more "good" cops than "bad" ones. You're going to find shitbirds in every profession.

[Bounce12 407]

Racegal, I agree wholeheartedly, but what LEOs have done in the past and what they're doing now isn't the half of it.

 

I think they're going to be put in a completely unfair and untenable position as time goes on.

 

Right now, at this very moment, the Obama administration is about to replace their first Supreme Court Justice and they're using skin color, racial lineage, economic class and sex to make that decision - NOT KNOWLEDGE OF CONSTITUTIONAL LAW.

 

Obama is in the process of eliminating long-standing standards of PROPERTY RIGHTS as he STEALS wealth from the Chrysler bond holders and gives it to the UAW and takes it for the government.

 

Obama is making criminals out of our National Security personnel. Did you see that they outed the interrogators a day or two ago - with their PICTURES!

 

He's turning the forces and the power of the DHS against our military people.

 

The LEOs are not going to be immune to this process. They will themselves be "watched" and "used" to drive Obama's agenda as well.

 

When the law is cast aside in favor of "minority payback" and "redistribution of wealth" (I can see the stars lining up with the crap I am hearing about the next SCOTUS nominee), and when we no longer have PROPERTY RIGHTS (which is exactly what's happening at Chrysler right now and will happen at GM and elsewhere), the rule of law will break down.

 

Just like in Atlas Shrugged, investors will stop investing, capital will dry up, and the economy will continue its downward spiral. The only answer will be for Obama to clamp down HARD and that will necessarily mean a further erosion (or elimination) of our Constitutional rights.

 

The LEOs will be thrust into untenable positions and be left with impossible decisions. With a shitty economy (no other job to fall back on) and families to support, the "Here are the directives. Do what you're told or you're out!" mandate will put them in a position that's impossible to deal with.

 

My hat's off to their performance in the past. However, I damn sure don't envy them going forward.

 

I'm telling you, this is going to suck - and not just for them... For everyone!

[Bounce12 407]

Edited May 2, 2009 by Bounce12

[dancapostagno 0]

I will start off by saying this is a good thread because people need to remember that, even in the crappiest places, there are still good cops, and that says something. I grew up in one of those places, where lawlessness was rampant and the police seemed unable or unwilling to do much about it, but I still had the honor of knowing the best cops on the force, who watched over me and mentored me throughout my youth. So long as guys like them are still around, I can never truly speak ill of the police. In fact, I feel that a well-defined police force is integral to the functioning of a society, and when I was going to a new country, I always looked first at their police and their reputation, as that was always a good indicator of what that society would be like. In fact, one of my best friends on this earth is a cop from Romania. I think any ill will that comes towards our police these days comes from a place of disappointment, precisely BECAUSE we hold our police in such high esteem. And, as always, remember that America is a bigass nation, so one can expect to see some regional variation in the character of the jobs the police will have to fill, and the cops who fill them. For example, where I live now, the people are so well-mannered and decent towards each other, there is relatively little police. There are few stop signs and few cops needed to enforce them. So the police around here are actually subcontracted out from the city next door, which is much larger and operates a somewhat privatized police force. If you'd have told me that some years ago, I would have portended doom for such an arrangement, but out here it works astoundingly well.

 

 

oh and Bounce, please don't pirate this thread about Obama.

[SOPMOD 254]

I think any ill will that comes towards our police these days comes from a place of disappointment, precisely BECAUSE we hold our police in such high esteem.

 

 

There is more truth in that statement(at least for me) than I have ever heard previously.

 

My view of human authority figures was probably tainted by my expectations.As a child I believed police to be the modern day embodiment of a Nazirite Judge from the Bible.An incorruptible, morally motivated courageous symbol of our civilization's character

 

That is a very sophisticated observation,you wouldn't happen to be a sociologist or anthropologist would you?

Edited May 2, 2009 by SOPMOD

[dancapostagno 0]

Close. Political Science with an emphasis on comparative government and geopolitics. I do study history, religion, and other cultures, but I consider it as a requisite component of that.

[cvhanh20 1,052]

To often in our society we draw a line, them or us, but the reality is they are us, at least for the most part. They slip on a uniform and became, assholes, tough guys, hero's, corrupt, pig headed, helpful, kind. You know why? Because these are all of the faces we all have to some degree. When I was younger I really had it out for the law, they always seemed to show up after the fact, as though to be saving their own ass, and looking back on it, it still looks that way to me, about those cops, but I seen many kind and noble acts of both men and women of law enforcement. I watch and officer on youtube struggle for 1/2 hour against a real piece of shit, trying he best not to use lethal force, I would have fucked that guys world in one minute flat. I believe its easy to criticize, and place blame upon people that we feel serve us, the public. I know this, I could not do their job under the current laws that inhabit law enforcement from working to start with. Dirty Harry had it right, bend some rules, kill the really, really bad guys with a really, really big fucking gun and have sex afterwards to relieve all that stress. To all the good LEO's, my thanks goes out to all of you out there busting your asses for your follow man, and to all the bad cops, I hope the good LEO's catch up to your ass and burn you down for tarnishing their good image.

[Azrial 1,091]

Racegal, I agree wholeheartedly, but what LEOs have done in the past and what they're doing now isn't the half of it.

 

I think they're going to be put in a completely unfair and untenable position as time goes on....

Villainizing a group of people, any group of people, for what you fear they might do is completely irrational. Particularly when that group, has, per you, given honorable service in the past.

 

As to your fears of LEOs being forced into a compromise between the law, and doing what is right and consistent with the Bill of Rights, let me be the first to assure you that not doing one's job is an old and expected function of government. The leftist weenies will not change that!

[Bounce12 407]

Racegal, I agree wholeheartedly, but what LEOs have done in the past and what they're doing now isn't the half of it.

 

I think they're going to be put in a completely unfair and untenable position as time goes on....

Villainizing a group of people, any group of people, for what you fear they might do is completely irrational. Particularly when that group, has, per you, given honorable service in the past.

 

Maybe I wasn't as clear as I should have been Azrial, but I didn't intend to "villainize" LEOS. I intended to villainize the current administration for creating a no-win situation FOR the LEOs.

 

 

 

As to your fears of LEOs being forced into a compromise between the law, and doing what is right and consistent with the Bill of Rights, let me be the first to assure you that not doing one's job is an old and expected function of government. The leftist weenies will not change that!

 

 

I was never given an unlawful order, but I was handed directives and edicts from above that amounted to unmitigated stupidity. Now that you mention it, being given an UNLAWFUL order is pretty easy to handle. It was our DUTY to say "no." It must be the same with you. It was the STOOOPID orders that were so tough. We couldn't say no to those.

 

A quick aside about not following orders to the letter - In the USAF as in the airlines, there is no honor in the ranks that I could see. It was a strange situation in that you could absolutely trust the guy standing next to you with your life, but not with your money, your wife or your career. They'd stab your ass in the back in a heart beat if they thought it meant there would be one less obstacle to their next promotion. Hopefully, it's not like that in the LEO ranks.

 

The ONE THING that gives me pause is what happened in Nawlins after Katrina. My only point is, things have gone bad in emergency situations in the past. I'd love to know "why" those guys made the decisions they made at that time.

 

I very much appreciate your service and your attitude. I support the police and what you guys do. I don't think you guys get anywhere NEAR the pay and credit you deserve considering all the crap you have to do and put up with.

 

I think we're going to see some clashes with the Constitution before this is over. Every fucking day there is a new outrage and they're getting WORSE, not better. I, for one, am concerned about it.

[Ruffian72 548]

Still hold my reserve deputy/training officer status. As posted a couple months ago. I resigned for the second time from a Fed. agency due to policies against the people we are to serve, and the constitution I swore to uphold. So, yes I'm very pro-law, yet too many times agencies local, state, or fed. can go off course. Good officers, constantly have to decide their course of action. A younger brother has been a police chief in two locations, both times, was brought in to clean up departments that had become (jacked booted thugs) instead of law enforcement officers. Usually lose 1/3 to 1/2 of original officers, replaces with officers, not bullies with badges. The (thugs) move to juridications that want that mentality.

[SOPMOD 254]

Still hold my reserve deputy/training officer status. As posted a couple months ago. I resigned for the second time from a Fed. agency due to policies against the people we are to serve, and the constitution I swore to uphold. So, yes I'm very pro-law, yet too many times agencies local, state, or fed. can go off course. Good officers, constantly have to decide their course of action. A younger brother has been a police chief in two locations, both times, was brought in to clean up departments that had become (jacked booted thugs) instead of law enforcement officers. Usually lose 1/3 to 1/2 of original officers, replaces with officers, not bullies with badges. The (thugs) move to juridications that want that mentality.

 

 

Been There,Done That.

 

I am still an Oklahoma CLEET and Federal FEMA and security contractor's certification/background check card holder and keep my certs current but have ZERO interest in violating people's constitutional rights and until further notice I have no interest in these jobs under their current ROP/SOP.

[Bounce12 407]

Still hold my reserve deputy/training officer status. As posted a couple months ago. I resigned for the second time from a Fed. agency due to policies against the people we are to serve, and the constitution I swore to uphold. So, yes I'm very pro-law, yet too many times agencies local, state, or fed. can go off course. Good officers, constantly have to decide their course of action. A younger brother has been a police chief in two locations, both times, was brought in to clean up departments that had become (jacked booted thugs) instead of law enforcement officers. Usually lose 1/3 to 1/2 of original officers, replaces with officers, not bullies with badges. The (thugs) move to juridications that want that mentality.

 

 

 

That takes balls Ruffian! Big ones.

 

When I left the USAF, I had nothing but knowledge and experience. I had no job, I didn't have much in the way of savings.... It was scary as all hell and the economy was booming at the time.

 

Walking away for any reason isn't such an easy thing to do. I've been there.

 

Thanks for your service.

[Azrial 1,091]

... I didn't intend to "villainize" LEOS. I intended to villainize the current administration for creating a no-win situation FOR the LEOs.

We agree on many points. However, this sentence illustrates one of the big differences in my philosophy and that of some others here on the board. In my view, we are in a quite dismal situation, but hardly a "no-win" one. The problem with this mindset, is the minute you accept the fact that you can not win, you are correct. None of these people that have come to power have done so by force of arms, they all need votes to perpetuate their plans, and the cooperation of the American People, including law enforcement. I do not believe that they necessarily have that.

 

.... The ONE THING that gives me pause is what happened in Nawlins after Katrina. My only point is, things have gone bad in emergency situations in the past. I'd love to know "why" those guys made the decisions they made at that time. ...

Have no doubt; they will always be able to find some amoral men that will follow their tyrannical orders and plans, no matter how evil. Every tyrant in history has found them. The question is what percentage of the profession that is, I say it will be a low one and these are folks that we should work to together to weed out, now. The rest are our allies.

 

I think that this is a better plan then alienating the whole profession under the presumption that all its members are corruptible. That is the average plan of the average blow hard "kill all the Pigs" "Internet Patriot/Commando."

[Ruffian72 548]

Well put Azrial. Just as in society, 10% good, 10% bad, it's just how the other 80% will fall that determines a agencies actions. And thanks Bounce 12.

Edited May 3, 2009 by Ruffian72

[G O B 3,516]

To often in our society we draw a line, them or us, but the reality is they are us, at least for the most part. They slip on a uniform and became, assholes, tough guys, hero's, corrupt, pig headed, helpful, kind. You know why? Because these are all of the faces we all have to some degree. When I was younger I really had it out for the law, they always seemed to show up after the fact, as though to be saving their own ass, and looking back on it, it still looks that way to me, about those cops, but I seen many kind and noble acts of both men and women of law enforcement. I watch and officer on youtube struggle for 1/2 hour against a real piece of shit, trying he best not to use lethal force, I would have fucked that guys world in one minute flat. I believe its easy to criticize, and place blame upon people that we feel serve us, the public. I know this, I could not do their job under the current laws that inhabit law enforcement from working to start with. Dirty Harry had it right, bend some rules, kill the really, really bad guys with a really, really big fucking gun and have sex afterwards to relieve all that stress. To all the good LEO's, my thanks goes out to all of you out there busting your asses for your follow man, and to all the bad cops, I hope the good LEO's catch up to your ass and burn you down for tarnishing their good image.

 

 

Still hold my reserve deputy/training officer status. As posted a couple months ago. I resigned for the second time from a Fed. agency due to policies against the people we are to serve, and the constitution I swore to uphold. So, yes I'm very pro-law, yet too many times agencies local, state, or fed. can go off course. Good officers, constantly have to decide their course of action. A younger brother has been a police chief in two locations, both times, was brought in to clean up departments that had become (jacked booted thugs) instead of law enforcement officers. Usually lose 1/3 to 1/2 of original officers, replaces with officers, not bullies with badges. The (thugs) move to juridications that want that mentality.

Well said. The majority of LEO,s are truly the best and finest, It is the unfortunate lack of oversight and the militarization of law enforcement that is the danger that we must all work together to minimalize.

[SOPMOD 254]

Well said. The majority of LEO,s are truly the best and finest, It is the unfortunate lack of oversight and the militarization of law enforcement that is the danger that we must all work together to minimalize.

 

The "community policing" strategies that communities have come up with to solve this problem have failed miserably in all but a few cities.The concept of "productivity" and goals in law enforcement have to do with arresting more suspects rather than maintaining order and the result is the officers are made to feel that if they aren't prowling and fault finding for their whole shift that they are doing a piss poor job.

 

 

Telling a type A personality that they need to find fault means that they end up becoming an unwelcome menace because their mere presence and attention is an inference of wrong doing which pisses innocent people off to the max and make guilty people "up the ante" and resort to violence where they might not have otherwise.The "assumption of guilt" against innocent people is the main stumbling block and this comes from Administration not individual officers.Tell officers that the absense of calls of criminal activity is their goal and give commendations to them when their patrol area remains pacified for extended periods of time and take the onus off of them to follow random people around and bother them looking for an "excuse" to make a stop and go on a fishing trip and the way ythey execute their duties will change dramatically.

 

I remember when only crooks and weirdos dreaded the police showing up and frankly I miss it.

[dnp 1]

Well said. The majority of LEO,s are truly the best and finest, It is the unfortunate lack of oversight and the militarization of law enforcement that is the danger that we must all work together to minimalize.

 

The "community policing" strategies that communities have come up with to solve this problem have failed miserably in all but a few cities.The concept of "productivity" and goals in law enforcement have to do with arresting more suspects rather than maintaining order and the result is the officers are made to feel that if they aren't prowling and fault finding for their whole shift that they are doing a piss poor job.

 

 

Telling a type A personality that they need to find fault means that they end up becoming an unwelcome menace because their mere presence and attention is an inference of wrong doing which pisses innocent people off to the max and make guilty people "up the ante" and resort to violence where they might not have otherwise.The "assumption of guilt" against innocent people is the main stumbling block and this comes from Administration not individual officers.Tell officers that the absense of calls of criminal activity is their goal and give commendations to them when their patrol area remains pacified for extended periods of time and take the onus off of them to follow random people around and bother them looking for an "excuse" to make a stop and go on a fishing trip and the way ythey execute their duties will change dramatically.

 

I remember when only crooks and weirdos dreaded the police showing up and frankly I miss it.

Edited May 3, 2009 by aynew

[Bounce12 407]

... I didn't intend to "villainize" LEOS. I intended to villainize the current administration for creating a no-win situation FOR the LEOs.

We agree on many points. However, this sentence illustrates one of the big differences in my philosophy and that of some others here on the board. In my view, we are in a quite dismal situation, but hardly a "no-win" one. The problem with this mindset, is the minute you accept the fact that you can not win, you are correct. None of these people that have come to power have done so by force of arms, they all need votes to perpetuate their plans, and the cooperation of the American People, including law enforcement. I do not believe that they necessarily have that.

 

 

OK, fair enough.

 

Let me explain what I mean by "no-win."

 

I don't mean to belabor the point, but please hang with me for a minute....

 

"No win" to me means that you are given an offer you cannot refuse. Do it, or else. In my mind, that means being handed orders under threat of losing your job.

 

Now, you believe the LEOs will simply disregard edicts like that (you're obviously in a position to know what you're talking about), and I hope you're right. Believe me, I am praying that what you're telling me turns out to be what happens.

 

I've seen it happen (twice) in my life where the only realistic choice I had was to quit.

 

I might have mentioned this in another post along the way, but I'll briefly explain it again... When I was an F-16 puke we put our lives in each other's hands all the time - every day. I THOUGHT I KNEW the guys I was with. Later, some of the guys I THOUGHT I KNEW as F-16 pilots turned out to be union thug liberal democrats (as airline pilots) who went over the edge supporting the leftist politicians.

 

I got in a couple of faces about it, too. I had HAD IT with what I considered to be their Marxist ideology and it was time to have it out.

 

I asked one guy, "What the fuck has gotten in to you? What's up with this Marxist union-thug liberal bullshit? We put our lives on the line FIGHTING this shit, REMEMBER???"

 

The basic answer I got from him was, "That was then and this is now. Things are different now. Plus, what are you going to do, QUIT?"

 

What the guy was telling me was that he was as malleable as he needed to be to keep his paycheck coming in.

 

I told him that I was really glad I was never in a POW camp with his malleable collaborator ass. We then told each other to fuck off and that was the end of it. (as an aside, I watched a story on the military channel about how Hitler was able to arrest power - support from people like this had a lot to do with it)

 

I queried other airline pilots as to why they supported a union that not only supported liberals (which had fucked our national energy policy - which is very important for pilot careers), but oversaw the demise of the entire airline industry. They gave me the same basic answer the first guy did. "What am I supposed to do about it? I've got bills to pay and a family to support, don't you? I have EVERYTHING invested in this career. I've got nothing else."

 

 

THAT is what I mean when I say "no win." The steam roller is rolling. You're not going to stop it. The only question is, are you going to get on board or not? If the answer is "not," you better have another way to pay the bills. They ultimately hold the power of the paycheck over your head.

 

The biggest gut check for me was in my ability to tell them, "Keep your damn money and the career. I am getting OFF this train. I'll find another way." (which I did) The airline eventually went bankrupt, the pilots sucked up a 40% pay cut, lost all their retirement and the airline is still losing about $9 million a day right now! AND NOT EVEN THAT IS ENOUGH TO GET SOME OF THEM TO QUESTION THEMSELVES!

 

Now, if you are in a position to NOT get on the steam-roller and still NOT lose your paycheck (avoid the "no-win" situation), then hey, I'm all for that.

 

You're telling me the "no-win" situation can be avoided - GREAT. I feel a whole lot better. (no joke)

 

It's just that in my life, the powers that be have had ways of making it a pretty tough choice (a deal breaker).

 

The only way I could "WIN" was to leave - separate myself from the situation entirely. AND THAT meant doing without their money.

 

Sorry for the rambling.