Looking to finally buy a saiga

[Niff 1]

After saving up some cash, my goal is to have a saiga by the time classes end. However, I have a few questions first:

It appears I should be able to successfully convert it myself with fairly minimal tools correct? (I have watched a few videos, does not look too bad)

As for actual items, I am looking at buying it from gilbertsguns for $469, it also has the Bolt Stop Hold Open already installed (as I understand not all do?)

As for the conversion items, I am thinking about buying from carolinashooterssupply, and getting one of their kits with a tri rail, trigger, collapsible stock etc...

 

Now, in terms of "non essentials" I want to get both a drum magazine and a sight.

 

After some research I have heard some good things about MD arms drum mags as well as the adjustable gas plugs, should I get one from em?

 

The last thing I am not really sure about, but I know I want something besides iron sights. Currently I am looking at the calssportingarmory's Zeiss Compact Point Red Dot Sight for 400. Thats about what I am willing to spend, but I am open to any other suggestions or brands as well. Also, I want this mounted towards the back of the gun, so I will probably need some sort of rail as well...

 

 

 

Basically, if you can tell me what I should get, and the best place to get it from, I would be quite grateful.

 

 

Thanks in advance guys, I have been lurking for awhile and you all seem pretty cool.

-Niff

 

PS: my total budget for all this is about $1200

[physicsnerd 139]

The manual bolt hold open is standard no matter where you buy it.

 

Unless you live in or around Frankfort you could order your Saiga from one of the forum sponsors like Carolina Shooter's Supply.

 

MD Arms drums are the gold standard for drums so you can't go wrong with them. They're even $75 now on sale from MDarms.com and that is a steal. You could get several. I can't speak for the V-plug but if you want a manually adjustable gas knob you can't go wrong for $20.

 

I can't speak to your sight options but good luck getting everything together. You'll love your S12 once it comes.

[Bridis 319]

If you're looking to get a red dot/holo sight you may want to get an extended quad rail. I would recommend a Choas rail, www.chaosus.com. If you're looking for a red dot that'll work and not break the bank you could look into the Burris Fast Fire. I hear they stand up to 12 ga. abuse. You certainly want to go with the MD Arms drums and do all your S-12 specific shoppoing at Carolina Shooters Supply.

 

GL HF

[psl sniper 963]

The manual bolt hold open is standard no matter where you buy it.

 

Unless you live in or around Frankfort you could order your Saiga from one of the forum sponsors like Carolina Shooter's Supply.

 

MD Arms drums are the gold standard for drums so you can't go wrong with them. They're even $75 now on sale from MDarms.com and that is a steal. You could get several. I can't speak for the V-plug but if you want a manually adjustable gas knob you can't go wrong for $20.

 

I can't speak to your sight options but good luck getting everything together. You'll love your S12 once it comes.

i can speak for the v plug, it works great!

[Chowderhead72 13]

I think you will either forget the $400 scope or add a bit more to the budget. $800 for a built S12 is pretty meek. It can be done but it will require alot of compromise. Lose the scope or maybe consider a $200 burris fastfire (nice mid-range red dot) and that will add $200 to the budget. For 1000 you can build a respectable S12.

[Chowderhead72 13]

If you're looking to get a red dot/holo sight you may want to get an extended quad rail. I would recommend a Choas rail, www.chaosus.com. If you're looking for a red dot that'll work and not break the bank you could look into the Burris Fast Fire. I hear they stand up to 12 ga. abuse. You certainly want to go with the MD Arms drums and do all your S-12 specific shoppoing at Carolina Shooters Supply.

 

GL HF

 

agreed... Check out ultimak also if you are interested in having your optic further back (you mentioned the was important to you I believe). The chaos rail looks great and for not much more you can add the HK mp5 type sights built into the extended rail.

[JAldrich2008 28]

I bought my S12 from Gilbert's, and I definately reccomend them. As for optics, I have a Bushnell Trophy 1x28 red dot. I got it from a forum member through the classifieds for $55 and it has been great.

[Niff 1]

To add: I am not terribly set on anything in my post other than I will have a moved trigger group, a collapsible stock and a holographic sight. So if you have cheaper alternatives that will stand up to the saiga (only mentioned the zeiss because a old friend swears by his. It just needs to be under 1200, college students gotta eat you know!

 

so far: I will look into the extended rail, add the V plug to my list (if anyone has pictures of iton a saiga, that would be really helpful, because like i said, want to make sure the optics are pretty far back... might also be in the market for some flip up iron sights if anyone knows some. Also curious how it mounts as I don't quite see it...

 

thanks for the replies so far. Ill be getting that drum asap (hope the sale lasts till I get some cash freed up!

 

-Niff

 

EDIT: It seems Chaos is having a sale at the moment... might be worth getting the full extended quad rail instead for 100... My question is I dont have the saiga yet because I will need to zoom on up to los alamos in the next few months to talk to my FFL friend, as I won't keep this at my college (no safe, and stupid rules) so whats Chaos's policy on warranties/customer service (I know returns require 7 days, but I obviously won't have a saiga in that time) MD arms I am not worried about as they claim a lifetime warranty.

Edited September 30, 2010 by Niff

[Niff 1]

Well after looking around and doing some thinking, I am going to go with having CGW do the conversion as his christmas special. I do think it would be fun to do myself, but I want this to be a christmas gift for myself, and I just dont see me being able to make enough trips to the range and mess around with polishing, etc making sure it can cycle cheap wally world birdshot/buck.

 

This still leaves me open to looking for a holo sight on my gun, as alot of the cheaper ones I have looked at probably will not hold up to a 12 gauge round... So to rephase: I dont think I need an amazing nice sight, but how close to a 150 buck optic can i get without just screwing myself down the line?

 

I checked out the burris fastfire, but are there any ones with a bit bigger "aperture" (honestly don't know the right term, the glass front where the dot projects)

 

 

Thanks again guys, all of you have been really awesome.

[Niff 1]

*bump* i guess.

 

Also still looking for ways to mount said optics.

[shades_of_grey 1,092]

*bump* i guess.

 

Also still looking for ways to mount said optics.

 

Dude, you live in New Mexico? You really should talk to Mike at Lone Star Arms, (also in NM). I'd highly recommend that you do some reading in his biz section, (he's a business member of this forum), and possibly call/email him also before you decide exactly how you want to set your S-12 up. He does amazing, (and in some ways unique), work.

 

Hell, if I lived in NM I'd probably be bugging Mike every other weekend to go shoot his full-auto S-12

[Niff 1]

*bump* i guess.

 

Also still looking for ways to mount said optics.

 

Dude, you live in New Mexico? You really should talk to Mike at Lone Star Arms, (also in NM). I'd highly recommend that you do some reading in his biz section, (he's a business member of this forum), and possibly call/email him also before you decide exactly how you want to set your S-12 up. He does amazing, (and in some ways unique), work.

 

Hell, if I lived in NM I'd probably be bugging Mike every other weekend to go shoot his full-auto S-12

hehehe I have actually chatted with him about having him do his basic conversion job, but that ended up being a bit more tan I could afford. Never occurred to talk to him about general advice, as for trying to go the range with him, that would be pretty awesome, but would require free weekends I wish I had lol.

[RobRez 1,895]

You will need a LOT of ammo! A whole Bunch! It is gonna go FAST!!!!

[zenman223 460]

i didnt read the whole thread just scanned through it but i dont think anyone has mentioned to you that there is a scope mount on the side of the S-12. you can get a nice picatinny railed scope mount for an AK and mount your scope/red dot "further back" on the gun just like you want.

 

 

i dont have any personal experience with these scope mounts but i here if you get a good one that they are pretty good at retaining zero through multiple takeoffs. which brand is a good one? i dont know but i would geuss you couldnt go wrong with one of the Russian ones. just my 2 c.

[Niff 1]

You will need a LOT of ammo! A whole Bunch! It is gonna go FAST!!!!

True that! Thank goodness this gun should eat any type of ammo after I get it back so I can AFFORD to go shooting, and shoot more than 40-50 rounds a range trip, cant say the same about my Garand...

 

i didnt read the whole thread just scanned through it but i dont think anyone has mentioned to you that there is a scope mount on the side of the S-12. you can get a nice picatinny railed scope mount for an AK and mount your scope/red dot "further back" on the gun just like you want.

 

 

i dont have any personal experience with these scope mounts but i here if you get a good one that they are pretty good at retaining zero through multiple takeoffs. which brand is a good one? i dont know but i would geuss you couldnt go wrong with one of the Russian ones. just my 2 c.

 

I have seen a few pics on the forums that would indicate this, but i keep looking at google, and dont see any pics that indicate how..,

 

Any chance you care to explain in more detail? Or just show me a pic that show how to install one. Hell, ill take anything.

[Mayor Al 41]

Niff,

I am curious about the factory side-mount plate also. Many of the side mounts I see on 'parts lists' say they require a separate 'Plate' to hold the mount itself. I'd like to hear from some owners who have mounted these after-market scope-mounts. Success? or junk??

 

The factory mount is sort of odd shaped to fit the normal three screw (or quick-release) rail-holder ...at least it appears to be visually from the photos I have seen???

 

AL

[Paulyski 2,227]

You will need a LOT of ammo! A whole Bunch! It is gonna go FAST!!!!

True that! Thank goodness this gun should eat any type of ammo after I get it back so I can AFFORD to go shooting, and shoot more than 40-50 rounds a range trip, cant say the same about my Garand...

If you're going for wally world target loads, get #6 shot federal.

Four 25 round boxes are about $4.00 cheaper than the value bulk packs, & it's better ammo.

 

i didnt read the whole thread just scanned through it but i dont think anyone has mentioned to you that there is a scope mount on the side of the S-12. you can get a nice picatinny railed scope mount for an AK and mount your scope/red dot "further back" on the gun just like you want.

 

 

i dont have any personal experience with these scope mounts but i here if you get a good one that they are pretty good at retaining zero through multiple takeoffs. which brand is a good one? i dont know but i would geuss you couldnt go wrong with one of the Russian ones. just my 2 c.

 

I have seen a few pics on the forums that would indicate this, but i keep looking at google, and dont see any pics that indicate how..,

 

Any chance you care to explain in more detail? Or just show me a pic that show how to install one. Hell, ill take anything.

I'm researching that very topic at the present time...

 

Here's; how to fit Russian side mounts. This procedure is used on all AK side rail systems, as they all differ slightly.

 

As for availability...

Oleg has them at present....

They will be cheaper elsewhere if you can find them though.

 

 

 

I'll personally avoid the lower priced US made quick release optics, as I'm unaware if they are the same mechanisms with regards to fitting.

Edited October 20, 2010 by Paulyski

[Niff 1]

stuff

Thanks man, thats exactaly what I was looking for, cant believe it was on the side most pictures dont use Looks like just what I need/want!

 

Good info on the ammo too.

 

EDIT: Just to be sure, Olag = This site?

Edited October 20, 2010 by Niff

[Bridis 319]

I had one my S-12 for a short time. It looked really bulky and out of place. Plus you have to remove it every time you want to take off the dust cover. I later found that the extended quad rail by Chaos worked out just fine and looked 10 times better.

 

This is my S-12...

 

The HK style sights don't co-witness well through that EOTech. So I'll be getting a Burriss Fast Fire in the near future.

[Niff 1]

I had one my S-12 for a short time. It looked really bulky and out of place. Plus you have to remove it every time you want to take off the dust cover. I later found that the extended quad rail by Chaos worked out just fine and looked 10 times better.

 

This is my S-12...

 

The HK style sights don't co-witness well through that EOTech. So I'll be getting a Burriss Fast Fire in the near future.

Wanna sell it then?

I might just get the extended rail considering how expensive this mount looks like its going to be...

[physicsnerd 139]

Kalinka Optics has the BP-02 in two styles for $52.95. Much cheaper than ordering them from the UK. I'm leaning in the direction of getting one for my S-12 for a Burris FastFire II.

 

The BP-02s are made in Belarus. I wonder if that is why Oleg fuzzes that out on the above pictures so people would assume it is made in Russia. However, that doesn't deter me. Belarussians need to eat too!

[grommit666 24]

I got a pre-converted saiga from atlantic firearms. I couldn't be happier with it. Knowing that it will just work, and work well, right out of the box is great. You can get straight to shooting shit! I would definitely recommend getting one pre-converted from a reputable dealer, there are many you can find right here. The extra cost is not that much and is well worth it.

[Niff 1]

Kalinka Optics has the BP-02 in two styles for $52.95. Much cheaper than ordering them from the UK. I'm leaning in the direction of getting one for my S-12 for a Burris FastFire II.

 

The BP-02s are made in Belarus. I wonder if that is why Oleg fuzzes that out on the above pictures so people would assume it is made in Russia. However, that doesn't deter me. Belarussians need to eat too!

That is MUCH cheaper, thanks.

Also: after more google, it appears a site called "goodoptics" also has then for 43 bucks, but I would need to see how legitimate they are.

 

 

I got a pre-converted saiga from atlantic firearms. I couldn't be happier with it. Knowing that it will just work, and work well, right out of the box is great. You can get straight to shooting shit! I would definitely recommend getting one pre-converted from a reputable dealer, there are many you can find right here. The extra cost is not that much and is well worth it.

Thats what I finally came up with, and with that christmas special, 500 bucks was something I could afford (once my ebay auction ends lol) and after seeing CGW's full auto saiga vids, can't wait to see mine run that well.

[Paulyski 2,227]

I hate quad rails on an AK platform.

I hate stocks that were styled after AR type crap too, not to mention forward vertical grips.

Just not my style.

 

The AK look & lines are sexy as all hell to me.

 

 

 

 

ETA;

Not knockin' anyone's setups...

All that stuff's just not for me.

Edited October 21, 2010 by Paulyski

[Niff 1]

Well thanks for all the advice for mounts all, looks like the BP-02 will work just fine. My question is I have heard there are more than one version, a 2 support and 3 support one, how do I tell the difference? (I assume supports are the things below the rail, but I figured I would ask)

 

Also, for those who had CGW convert and optimize: (like with the xmas special) I am sure it should cycle anything I throw at it, but what is the cheapest stuff I try? One person suggested #6 shot federal, are there rounds I should down right AVOID, I looked through a few threads, but I never saw a general consensus other than "dont shoot low brass" but hopefully the cash I am spending on the conversion allows me to avoid that rule.

[Mullet Man 2,114]

Order a iz109 from Carolina Shooters Supply, support the supporters! Gilberts Guns isnt a vendor on here.

 

If you have CGW do your restoration, you shouldnt have any problems running "low brass".

Edited October 22, 2010 by Mullet Man

[Niff 1]

Order a iz109 from Carolina Shooters Supply, support the supporters! Gilberts Guns isnt a vendor on here.

 

If you have CGW do your restoration, you shouldnt have any problems running "low brass".

good to hear...

 

And I actually have switched my plans to CSS as the link for the saiga on gilberts 404'ed >.>, ordering tomorrow mornin, getting a intrafuse tri-rai, the S12, and this here vert gripunless there is something else i should get thats just a "must have"

[Niff 1]

wahhhhhaaa so much money gone

 

But ill be damned if I am not excited, all orders placed and hopefully shipped to Tom soon.

 

When do I learn the secret handshake?

[ErikTaylor 41]

Glad to see you ordered from Greg. Great guy and super fast shipping. I also just ordered some stuff from him today.

 

Have you decided on a red dot yet? I have a Burris Fast Fire II on mine and it has held up beautifully, and I believe it's $200 cheaper than the Ziess. I've put almost a few thousand rounds through mine and it hasn't done anything but perform perfectly.

[Niff 1]

Glad to see you ordered from Greg. Great guy and super fast shipping. I also just ordered some stuff from him today.

 

Have you decided on a red dot yet? I have a Burris Fast Fire II on mine and it has held up beautifully, and I believe it's $200 cheaper than the Ziess. I've put almost a few thousand rounds through mine and it hasn't done anything but perform perfectly.

The burris fast fire does look quite good, although I have yet to decide, my father was showing em some of his optics, I believe the brand was osprey, they looked fairly rugged, and the saved money would be nice, fees ate up a bit more of my budget than i would have hoped (shipping to tom, shipping to me, FFL transfer etc)

 

So does anyone here have an osprey? They claim they are rated for up to a 50BMG round, so I would imagine they should hold a zero with that BP02 rail system.