headshot 52 Posted May 20, 2009 Report Share Posted May 20, 2009 I don't believe I've heard of one if so. It'd be an interesting Vankiller project...... Quote Link to post Share on other sites
csspecs 1,987 Posted May 20, 2009 Report Share Posted May 20, 2009 (edited) I'm sure someone has. I found it to be hard to control bump firing. Very noticeable muzzle climb, even with a vertical front grip its hard to hold it down. The video was not made with the idea of putting on youtube, we did that so we could watch it frame by frame to check the rifles reaction to shooting like that.... Its surprising how much the barrel moves. The bolt is closed for a fair amount of time before the hammer drops again, so a real automatic would probably really have a high rate of fire compared. Edited May 20, 2009 by csspecs Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Bvamp 604 Posted May 20, 2009 Report Share Posted May 20, 2009 Tom is going to see this tomorrow, and probably will make one soon. The jungle carbine that he worked up is already a candidate for the job. It should be much easier to keep on target than the "beast", regardless. Just make sure he doesnt give you minigun ammo and chuckle when you jump suddenly and wonder what the fuck just happened. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
vintagedude88 16 Posted May 20, 2009 Report Share Posted May 20, 2009 The .308 is not a good caliber for full auto simply because of the uncontrollability of the gun when fired. I saw on American Rifleman where they noted that back in the 80's in the Falklands, the Brits had FN FAL semi-auto while the Brazilians had the same in full-auto. In the end the Brits where more effective because they were able to hit what they were shooting at. I think this is the reason behind the science for the smaller bullets used in full-auto such as the .223 or the 7.62x39 which is a cut down version of a .308 or 30-06. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
SOPMOD 254 Posted May 20, 2009 Report Share Posted May 20, 2009 It's all about your body mechanics and how you run it.I can run a full auto FN or M14 like a hole saw because of the way I mount up on it and because I am used to the rhythm of those two guns.I added a SEI comp to my buddies transferable M14 and it reduced the recoil so much it screwed me up for a good 300 rounds until I got a feel for it again. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
protected static 19 Posted May 20, 2009 Report Share Posted May 20, 2009 The .308 is not a good caliber for full auto simply because of the uncontrollability of the gun when fired. I saw on American Rifleman where they noted that back in the 80's in the Falklands, the Brits had FN FAL semi-auto while the Brazilians had the same in full-auto. In the end the Brits where more effective because they were able to hit what they were shooting at. I think this is the reason behind the science for the smaller bullets used in full-auto such as the .223 or the 7.62x39 which is a cut down version of a .308 or 30-06. Argentinians, not Brazilians. The difference in accuracy could also have a lot to do with the fact that (conventional) Argentine ground forces were largely conscripts, while the British troops were professionals. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Twinsen 86 Posted May 20, 2009 Report Share Posted May 20, 2009 Full auto doesn't affect accuracy. I'm sorry, but I'm tired of hearing that. It's an option, and how is an option ever a bad thing? Full auto definitely has a use, especially if you have a bipod or are in very confined spaces. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
csspecs 1,987 Posted May 20, 2009 Report Share Posted May 20, 2009 Sure you can get used to it.. But comparing with others I have played with the .308 is hard to control (I'm around 170 lbs so that did not exactly help either) , 5.45x39 is like using a water gun (a very loud and expensive water gun) It's all about your body mechanics and how you run it.I can run a full auto FN or M14 like a hole saw because of the way I mount up on it and because I am used to the rhythm of those two guns.I added a SEI comp to my buddies transferable M14 and it reduced the recoil so much it screwed me up for a good 300 rounds until I got a feel for it again. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
vintagedude88 16 Posted May 20, 2009 Report Share Posted May 20, 2009 The .308 is not a good caliber for full auto simply because of the uncontrollability of the gun when fired. I saw on American Rifleman where they noted that back in the 80's in the Falklands, the Brits had FN FAL semi-auto while the Brazilians had the same in full-auto. In the end the Brits where more effective because they were able to hit what they were shooting at. I think this is the reason behind the science for the smaller bullets used in full-auto such as the .223 or the 7.62x39 which is a cut down version of a .308 or 30-06. Argentinians, not Brazilians. ... Whoops! Looks like I just failed my South American geography. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
headshot 52 Posted May 21, 2009 Author Report Share Posted May 21, 2009 The .308 is not a good caliber for full auto simply because of the uncontrollability of the gun when fired. I saw on American Rifleman where they noted that back in the 80's in the Falklands, the Brits had FN FAL semi-auto while the Brazilians had the same in full-auto. In the end the Brits where more effective because they were able to hit what they were shooting at. I think this is the reason behind the science for the smaller bullets used in full-auto such as the .223 or the 7.62x39 which is a cut down version of a .308 or 30-06. Not true. The M60 is actually pretty controllable from what I've seen. A good brake would help. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
KrisFox 69 Posted May 21, 2009 Report Share Posted May 21, 2009 The .308 is not a good caliber for full auto simply because of the uncontrollability of the gun when fired. I saw on American Rifleman where they noted that back in the 80's in the Falklands, the Brits had FN FAL semi-auto while the Brazilians had the same in full-auto. In the end the Brits where more effective because they were able to hit what they were shooting at. I think this is the reason behind the science for the smaller bullets used in full-auto such as the .223 or the 7.62x39 which is a cut down version of a .308 or 30-06. Argentinians, not Brazilians. The difference in accuracy could also have a lot to do with the fact that (conventional) Argentine ground forces were largely conscripts, while the British troops were professionals. Also many of the Brits picked up the F/A Argentinian FAL's along the way. Troops like the F/A option, regardless of weather it's controllable or not. I plan on setting up my AR10 to use a DIAS once I get a DIAS (Requires milling relief in the lower and some bolt carrier mods and a custom trip in the DIAS). I think a AWS DNC comp or a Surefire suppressor will make it very controllable. I'll have to toss the 300 RSAUM upper on that setup too. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Twinsen 86 Posted May 21, 2009 Report Share Posted May 21, 2009 I'd recommend you go AAC or SWR for the silencer, but sounds like a lot of fun! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
VanKiller 322 Posted May 21, 2009 Report Share Posted May 21, 2009 Yes, A 308 SBR in full auto is definitely in the works for a little later in the year. One of the sweetest FA 308s I ever fired, was the little BM59 with the built in muzzle break/comp. So it is possible to build a short and user friendly model. But, in all honesty, I seldom used a "Work" gun on FA.......I had a fear of running out of ammo. I even took a tip from the Aussies and kept a tracer third round from the last in the mags , just so I would know when a mag change was due......... Quote Link to post Share on other sites
BobAsh 582 Posted May 21, 2009 Report Share Posted May 21, 2009 Not true. The M60 is actually pretty controllable from what I've seen. A good brake would help. It is, but it's nice and heavy. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
dobravery 49 Posted June 2, 2009 Report Share Posted June 2, 2009 I wonder how many rounds it would take before the barrel becomes too hot and ineffective? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
csspecs 1,987 Posted June 2, 2009 Report Share Posted June 2, 2009 Like before you start having bad groupings or before the barrel falls off? Bad groupings is about 10 rounds (I bumped 10 and shot a group and it seemed to be more open) Barrel can probably go 100 rounds before really causing damage. Probably 300-400 before it falls off I'm not going to try it myself, I don't see the fun in spending 200.00 to ruin a 450.00 rifle. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
BKLYN_C 14 Posted June 2, 2009 Report Share Posted June 2, 2009 Like before you start having bad groupings or before the barrel falls off? Bad groupings is about 10 rounds (I bumped 10 and shot a group and it seemed to be more open) Barrel can probably go 100 rounds before really causing damage. Probably 300-400 before it falls off I'm not going to try it myself, I don't see the fun in spending 200.00 to ruin a 450.00 rifle. 40-50 rounds in full auto is all it takes for any AK (except RPK) to lose range and accuracy to the extent of being unable to hit targets at 100 yards. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
csspecs 1,987 Posted June 2, 2009 Report Share Posted June 2, 2009 Uhh not so sure about that. I have shot two 60 round mags out of my wasr-2 back to back (bump firing) and it seemed to be shooting normal still. Now if you have actually done that yourself I have no problem believing it, just so many myths going around. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
PinkFloyd 63 Posted June 2, 2009 Report Share Posted June 2, 2009 The .308 is not a good caliber for full auto simply because of the uncontrollability of the gun when fired. I saw on American Rifleman where they noted that back in the 80's in the Falklands, the Brits had FN FAL semi-auto while the Brazilians had the same in full-auto. In the end the Brits where more effective because they were able to hit what they were shooting at. I think this is the reason behind the science for the smaller bullets used in full-auto such as the .223 or the 7.62x39 which is a cut down version of a .308 or 30-06. Well idk if you study history but there were many accounts of the brits ditching their standard issue L1A1's for the full auto versions. I also beg to differ on the controllability of 308... Hk G3 isn't bad to shoot at all. I think that one needs a pistol grip and the bore has to be on a straight axis to the shooter's shoulder, like on an M16. That might help a little bit. I've shot a G3 full auto and I'm pretty normal size and I didn't find it too terrible bad. Bursts tho Quote Link to post Share on other sites
BKLYN_C 14 Posted June 3, 2009 Report Share Posted June 3, 2009 Uhh not so sure about that. I have shot two 60 round mags out of my wasr-2 back to back (bump firing) and it seemed to be shooting normal still. Now if you have actually done that yourself I have no problem believing it, just so many myths going around. AK will start spitting after 2 mags. RPK can take couple hundred rounds and still be reasonably good. PKM/PKT will take any kind of abuse, all you have to do is replace barrel before it turns red hot, not to cause the permanent damage to the barrel and frame Quote Link to post Share on other sites
trapper308 0 Posted July 5, 2009 Report Share Posted July 5, 2009 i havent heard of it Quote Link to post Share on other sites
SOPMOD 254 Posted July 5, 2009 Report Share Posted July 5, 2009 The S308 barrel is thicker than a G3,FAL or M14 barrel.It is made on a mandrel and chrome lined.It is RPK diameter under the handguards and the rifle has 3 locking lugs instead of 2 and at least 1/2 of an RPKs trunnion but a thicker chamber end on the barrel than any of the alternatives.Wander POI comes from stresses loaded up in the barrel during manufacture and if you freeze it of draw them out in an oven and let it cool slowly then those stresses will lessen or even dissapear(don't go heating up barrels without knowing WTF you are doing BTW) Mine is a bit undergassed and only throws the brass about 5-8ft after opening up the gas port to 1.6mm but it is almost as soft kicking as an AR10 and would probably make the best compact 308 assault rifle ever made if the conversion was handled by someone like VanKiller. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t1kJPH7GGK0 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Genocide 0 Posted July 7, 2009 Report Share Posted July 7, 2009 Shoot, your conversion looks superb. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
TonyRumore 1,332 Posted July 7, 2009 Report Share Posted July 7, 2009 Whatever.....yeah, you can man-up and hold the thing down like a G3, but who really cares?.....in the hands of a DETERMINED man, it will be no problem shooting it. Hitting anything at any sort of distance.......well, that's another story........ Tony Quote Link to post Share on other sites
BobAsh 582 Posted July 7, 2009 Report Share Posted July 7, 2009 ...in the hands of a MAN, it will be no problem shooting it. FIXED Quote Link to post Share on other sites
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