Bounce12 407 Posted December 9, 2009 Report Share Posted December 9, 2009 Has anyone heard of them making a semi-auto civilian knock off of the AA-12? I would LOVE to have one of these bitches. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Twinsen 86 Posted December 9, 2009 Report Share Posted December 9, 2009 The whole point of the gun is that they're open bolt. So no, nothing anywhere near the real thing will be made for civilians. Sure, they might do a closed bolt one, but why? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
thehopping1 105 Posted December 9, 2009 Report Share Posted December 9, 2009 Hell, I'd love to have an open bolt full auto. That gun is bad ass. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Bvamp 604 Posted December 9, 2009 Report Share Posted December 9, 2009 actually the AA12 was featured in a long segment on "vanguard" which is an investigative reporting show that adresses some interesting issues. these people go into cuba to ask about anti castro crap, the kybher pass and africa to buy guns, and all of that fun stuff. hulu carries some of thier shows.... 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
bullseyeboy 11 Posted December 9, 2009 Report Share Posted December 9, 2009 Cool show, thanks! Bullseyeboy- Quote Link to post Share on other sites
IndyArms 10,186 Posted December 11, 2009 Report Share Posted December 11, 2009 I want to know how that is any cooler than any one of the FA S12's we have seen built here?!?!? Toss a MD drum on the "Vankiller" FA S12... and my money goes on the Saiga... I dont get the point of the AA12... other than hype... Quote Link to post Share on other sites
BpS12 512 Posted December 11, 2009 Report Share Posted December 11, 2009 It's that "American Made" thing. High priced and not all that it's cracked up to be. Kinda like the M16. Instead of improving on the proven, we like to reinvent the wheel. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Bvamp 604 Posted December 11, 2009 Report Share Posted December 11, 2009 I want to know how that is any cooler than any one of the FA S12's we have seen built here?!?!? Toss a MD drum on the "Vankiller" FA S12... and my money goes on the Saiga... I dont get the point of the AA12... other than hype... mike, you know where my money is...... 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Azrial 1,091 Posted December 11, 2009 Report Share Posted December 11, 2009 I want to know how that is any cooler than any one of the FA S12's we have seen built here?!?!? Toss a MD drum on the "Vankiller" FA S12... and my money goes on the Saiga... I dont get the point of the AA12... other than hype... My money is right beside yours! We had a fellow show up at a SMG Shoot here in a Georgia with an early one. He made a snide dismissive remark about my S12. Then his got so sick, he just put it away, while mine was running flawlessly! Honestly, I felt sorry for him! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Bounce12 407 Posted December 11, 2009 Author Report Share Posted December 11, 2009 I want to know how that is any cooler than any one of the FA S12's we have seen built here?!?!? Toss a MD drum on the "Vankiller" FA S12... and my money goes on the Saiga... I dont get the point of the AA12... other than hype... There are a couple. 1) It has an excellent recoil buffer which makes it a snap for a 90 pound teenage girl to handle. My wife and kids are afraid of the S-12 with slugs or buckshot. It owns them. The AA-12 wouldn't. 2) If I put 100 slugs through my S-12, I almost can't get the gas plug out of it to clean it and that's with gunfixr's plug and the new tappet AND anti-seize on the threads. The S-12 is great, but it has some quirks. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
diamondback 56 Posted December 11, 2009 Report Share Posted December 11, 2009 Only way I'd be really gungho about the AA12 would be if they made it in a "Retro Atchisson" (the AA12 is really just an improved Atchisson) version, which would allow me to add one of the preferred weapons of a favorite fictional character (Carl Lyons, before they flushed the Executioner series and its spinoffs straight down the bloody loo) to my collection. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
HOWARD COSELL 155 Posted December 11, 2009 Report Share Posted December 11, 2009 Has anyone heard of them making a semi-auto civilian knock off of the AA-12? I would LOVE to have one of these bitches. I would love to have an AA 12! Those different rounds in that video would be nice too. Too bad the AA 12 sucks in Modern Warfare 2. What do you think Bounce? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Bvamp 604 Posted December 12, 2009 Report Share Posted December 12, 2009 I think its time Tom made a FA 12 with a cutts or tank break on it. I could carry "the beast" itself all day long, without it much getting in the way, or hurting my back, either. I cant say the same for the AA12.it might be light, but it sure look AWFUL bulky..... 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Twinsen 86 Posted December 12, 2009 Report Share Posted December 12, 2009 Just machine a stock out of lead and you'll have the exact same recoil characteristics of the AA-12 for your Saiga. There's nothing magical about the design, it'd recoil harder than the Saiga if they weighed the same. It weighs a ton though, so recoils less. I see that as a downside though, but hey, just add a bunch of weight to your Saiga. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Bounce12 407 Posted December 12, 2009 Author Report Share Posted December 12, 2009 Just machine a stock out of lead and you'll have the exact same recoil characteristics of the AA-12 for your Saiga. There's nothing magical about the design, it'd recoil harder than the Saiga if they weighed the same. It weighs a ton though, so recoils less. I see that as a downside though, but hey, just add a bunch of weight to your Saiga. Doesn't look like it weighs a ton to me: Quote Link to post Share on other sites
mgconnor13 206 Posted December 12, 2009 Report Share Posted December 12, 2009 AA-12 looks cool and all but I can probably fire my semi auto saiga 12 faster then the full auto AA-12 from the videos I've seen. There any 8" versions of the AA-12 out there? FA SBS S12 = 12 gauge SMG goodness Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Twinsen 86 Posted December 12, 2009 Report Share Posted December 12, 2009 It weighs 12 pounds. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Bounce12 407 Posted December 12, 2009 Author Report Share Posted December 12, 2009 It weighs 12 pounds. At the end of the first segment of the video (after she shoots 20 rounds), the lady is holding the thing with only her left hand (she shoots right handed), so your 12 lbs number must include the 20 rounds. Judging from the video, the thing weighs less than that by itself or she wouldn't be able to hold it (casually) left-handed. Making an S-12 with a lead stock to act as a recoil buffer and then adding 20 rounds of ammo... shit, you'd need a bipod. An S-12 is great for guys like you and me, but for a 90 lb girl I think the AA-12 is better. The open bolt thing is a big drawback for a semi-auto. I don't care for that, but the rest of it is pretty appealing. It looks "chick friendly" to me. I'd buy one for my wife and kids if the price was reasonable. Like you say, they probably won't build one for civilian use. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Twinsen 86 Posted December 12, 2009 Report Share Posted December 12, 2009 (edited) 12 pounds is unloaded. It's over 16 pounds loaded. Go find yourself a stock that weighs 8 pounds. Edited December 12, 2009 by Twinsen Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Bounce12 407 Posted December 13, 2009 Author Report Share Posted December 13, 2009 (edited) 12 pounds is unloaded. It's over 16 pounds loaded. Go find yourself a stock that weighs 8 pounds. You're telling me one thing, my eyes and a little internet research is telling me something different. http://www.defensereview.com/auto-assault-12-shotgunfrag-12-high-explosive-round-comboweapon-system/ If a right-handed 99 lb woman with tooth pick arms can hold it casually in her left hand, it's not too heavy regardless of how much it weighs. Plus, they're saying they haven't had to clean the AA-12 prototypes (even after thousands of rounds). That sounds pretty damned good to me. If they made a civilian version, I'd buy it. Edited December 13, 2009 by Bounce12 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Twinsen 86 Posted December 13, 2009 Report Share Posted December 13, 2009 I was just going by Wikipedia, WorldGuns, Military Factory, and a few other sites. The gun is open bolt, and it seems is recoil operated or something. Also, its fully automatic cyclic rate is equal to my aimed rate of fire with a pump shotgun, and there are those that can kick my ass. That gun would literally hold me back, and my Saiga would not. I can see how it'd be good for a woman that doesn't fire much. They tend to not buy expensive shotguns though. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Bvamp 604 Posted December 13, 2009 Report Share Posted December 13, 2009 you guys cant tell that its got a long throw buffer tube in it? come on now...... I honestly, being 6 3, would want the smaller saiga full auto in 12" on my side. the engineering is nice in the AA12, but i just cant warrant it, with the size change. have fun, Sir. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Bounce12 407 Posted December 13, 2009 Author Report Share Posted December 13, 2009 you guys cant tell that its got a long throw buffer tube in it? come on now...... I honestly, being 6 3, would want the smaller saiga full auto in 12" on my side. the engineering is nice in the AA12, but i just cant warrant it, with the size change. have fun, Sir. This post never was about what a 6'3" man can handle. As I have stated repeatedly, it's about what a 90 lb woman or teenage girl can handle. However, I still like the fact that it doesn't need cleaning. Even a man would like that. The Saiga is great, but it has to be cleaned or it stops working - at least mine does. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
scoutjoe 276 Posted December 13, 2009 Report Share Posted December 13, 2009 This post never was about what a 6'3" man can handle. As I have stated repeatedly, it's about what a 90 lb woman or teenage girl can handle. However, I still like the fact that it doesn't need cleaning. Even a man would like that. The Saiga is great, but it has to be cleaned or it stops working - at least mine does. Everything mechanical needs cleaned at some point, period. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
volkov 318 Posted December 14, 2009 Report Share Posted December 14, 2009 I just find all the hype on it to be normally uniformed and over the top. They always try to act like it's the shotgun of the future and one of a kind, and ignore that spetznas is has been using saiga for years now.. Maybe it was something amazing back in the 70s, but now it's old news just being repackaged, plus, it's not going to beat the saiga on reliability, and it fires slower. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Bounce12 407 Posted December 14, 2009 Author Report Share Posted December 14, 2009 (edited) I just find all the hype on it to be normally uniformed and over the top. They always try to act like it's the shotgun of the future and one of a kind, and ignore that spetznas is has been using saiga for years now.. Maybe it was something amazing back in the 70s, but now it's old news just being repackaged, plus, it's not going to beat the saiga on reliability, and it fires slower. This isn't about the Spetznaz and I really couldn't care less what the Russian special forces have been shooting for years. It's not even about the Saiga. Your post has nothing to do with my point. If you had bothered to read the posts before chiming in you might have seen that. Edited December 14, 2009 by Bounce12 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
volkov 318 Posted December 14, 2009 Report Share Posted December 14, 2009 didn't mean to offend bounce.. But to be honest a lot of the posts were saiga vs aa-12, and they are comparable weaps, both being military type mag fed shotties. I was just giving my opinion on the AA-12 vs a reasonable alternative. Didn't think that would start fireworks. If you want I'll add that yes I think the recoil is impressive and theres a cool youtube video out there of a little remote control helicopter firing two at once without being wiped off course. Youtube won't work for me right now or I'd post it. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Bounce12 407 Posted December 14, 2009 Author Report Share Posted December 14, 2009 didn't mean to offend bounce.. But to be honest a lot of the posts were saiga vs aa-12, and they are comparable weaps, both being military type mag fed shotties. I was just giving my opinion on the AA-12 vs a reasonable alternative. Didn't think that would start fireworks. If you want I'll add that yes I think the recoil is impressive and theres a cool youtube video out there of a little remote control helicopter firing two at once without being wiped off course. Youtube won't work for me right now or I'd post it. The thing I like about the AA-12 is that it's chick friendly and doesn't have to be cleaned very often. I'd love to buy one for each of my teenage daughters and my wife. They won't touch the S-12. The S-12 is too much for them, but I'd love for them to be able to confidently reach for a 12-gauge filled with 20 slugs and use it to defend themselves if necessary. That's why I was wondering if anyone had heard of a civilian knockoff. I am not sure why it is, but it seems like if you happen to like the characteristics of some shotgun OTHER than the Saiga, people around here will attack you for it. My S-12 is my go to gun for personal defense. Even though it has some quirks, it's what I will reach for when SHTF. However, my wife and kids won't touch it. They might very well be willing to reach for an AA-12. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Reverendfranz 160 Posted December 14, 2009 Report Share Posted December 14, 2009 Ive said it before, so ill say it again. You can clean an S12? I cleaned mine when it was brand new, and havent done anything but knock out the puck a few times, and shove it back in, to make sure it doesnt get stuck. I hear everyone say that theirs stops functioning if they dont keep on top of it, but mine runs as reliably as any of my other AK's, and i cant help but think the AK-that-stops-cycling-when-dirty is one that barely cycles when its clean. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Reverendfranz 160 Posted December 14, 2009 Report Share Posted December 14, 2009 Oh yeah, the topic. Sorry. There was an AA12 at the SAR show a couple weekends ago. The thing looks like the profile you would get if you tried to build a M16 out of masonry bricks. its like 8 inches top to bottom, it looks rediculous, and when i picked it up (didnt really handle it, just checked the weight) it definitely was alot heavier than a saiga, and from what ive seen of videos on youtube, the cycle rate runs at a crawl. Its an impractical antique, with a cool factor, but little application. It would be like someone tooling up to make semi auto BARs. It might be cool, look good, but at its weight and size, its not practical, by any stretch of the word. I was pretty dissapointed when i saw the AA12 in the new Stalone/lungren/li/et al movie trailer. Anyone with any sense would have put a S12 and an MD20 in the film instead. 2 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
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