elLOCOmutha 0 Posted April 15, 2005 Report Share Posted April 15, 2005 Hi all Im new to the forum (and saiga) but have read many interesting threads about this firearm here. I have decided to purchase a 12 guage for my home defense needs...but am asking for your peoples knowledge and experience in helping me get this done. I have been around, used and loved firearms of all kinds for my whole life and will pass my knowledge onto my kids one day soon..but I am more of a enthusiast/user than a person that mods them. In other words I dont like to get under the hood I just like to detail and use/train with my guns (I do normal maintenance/cleaning on them though always) Can a person buy a fully modded Saiga already to go into the field with all the bells and whistles? well nice meeting you all and hope I can get some great advice from seasoned Saiga owners/users. Thank you Quote Link to post Share on other sites
shotgunman 0 Posted April 15, 2005 Report Share Posted April 15, 2005 Hi allIm new to the forum (and saiga) but have read many interesting threads about this firearm here. I have decided to purchase a 12 guage for my home defense needs...but am asking for your peoples knowledge and experience in helping me get this done. I have been around, used and loved firearms of all kinds for my whole life and will pass my knowledge onto my kids one day soon..but I am more of a enthusiast/user than a person that mods them. In other words I dont like to get under the hood I just like to detail and use/train with my guns (I do normal maintenance/cleaning on them though always) Can a person buy a fully modded Saiga already to go into the field with all the bells and whistles? well nice meeting you all and hope I can get some great advice from seasoned Saiga owners/users. Thank you <{POST_SNAPBACK}> yes sir http://www.krebscustom.com/KalashnikovRifles.html catalog number15 or do it yourself it is very easy and all of us here will help!good pic and step by step pics but its up to you either way you will love this gun Quote Link to post Share on other sites
elLOCOmutha 0 Posted April 15, 2005 Author Report Share Posted April 15, 2005 (edited) I want these guns! lol I want great site shotgunman thank you! Edited April 15, 2005 by elLOCOmutha Quote Link to post Share on other sites
shotgunman 0 Posted April 16, 2005 Report Share Posted April 16, 2005 also try this to http://www.elitefirearms.net/saigaconversions.php Quote Link to post Share on other sites
elLOCOmutha 0 Posted April 16, 2005 Author Report Share Posted April 16, 2005 Thanks again...wheres a good place to pick up a stock Saiga 12 guage? or any stock Saiga guns for that reason. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Shep 0 Posted April 16, 2005 Report Share Posted April 16, 2005 Gunbroker is always a good place to look for Saigas of all types. I know that Dave from Elite Firearms puts some of his stuff up for auction/sale there. Shep Quote Link to post Share on other sites
ktatro 0 Posted April 16, 2005 Report Share Posted April 16, 2005 (edited) Not sure, don't think they have any left as of now, but you might check out CDNN for a stock Saiga-12. Mine was 315 shipped and transferred and I know they were running low--that was about a month ago. Page 58 of the cat. has the picture and specs. http://www.cdnninvestments.com Kevin Edited April 16, 2005 by ktatro Quote Link to post Share on other sites
elLOCOmutha 0 Posted April 17, 2005 Author Report Share Posted April 17, 2005 I cant get cdnn online catologue to work for me....I emailed them to ask for one through the mail. Thanks for all the great help people! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
dodgeturbointerceptor 1 Posted April 17, 2005 Report Share Posted April 17, 2005 Do yourself a favor Minnesota man.... Buy one from Dunhams in St Cloud, MN....cheap as fuck...... look on-line for Dunhams locations in MN.... I called before I left MN for school. They had plenty still. Let me know on the 7.62x39's also...I want a couple when i get outta this ghey ass Army post! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
elLOCOmutha 0 Posted April 17, 2005 Author Report Share Posted April 17, 2005 Sure thing Dodge and thanks ill check out dunhams. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Tokageko 8 Posted April 17, 2005 Report Share Posted April 17, 2005 Wow... just the title of this thread brings back bad memories... Either way, congratualtions on your decision. I'm sure you won't regret it. Oh, and Welcom to the forum. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
ktatro 0 Posted April 18, 2005 Report Share Posted April 18, 2005 My area Dunhams didn't carry the 12, only they 20's and 7.62x39's. If you want to check CDNN you have to call 1-800-588-9500. If you do let us know what they say--last I heard they were out, but they have a tendancy to find bundles of them every once in awhile. Kevin Quote Link to post Share on other sites
McUZI 1 Posted April 18, 2005 Report Share Posted April 18, 2005 I called .. six times a day for a month straight. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
hardcorps1775 1 Posted April 18, 2005 Report Share Posted April 18, 2005 damn, guys... FIREFLY you can either get an s12 mod'd by him for <$200 or you can buy a mod'd gun from him for about $625 (i got mine from him). sam, the owner, is one of the only established business guys who does these conversions that posts here and his work is impeccable... his info: Sam Betlyon Firefly Arms 69 Firefly Dr. Lewistown, PA 17044 (717) 543-4025 http://www.fireflyarms.com/ i can't imagine he would disappoint you! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
elLOCOmutha 0 Posted April 18, 2005 Author Report Share Posted April 18, 2005 I was informed by Dunhams that they cannot get in Saiga Shotguns of any guage anymore. But they do have the 7.62x39mm in stock. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
ForGreatJustice 1 Posted April 19, 2005 Report Share Posted April 19, 2005 It's not my intent to critique your choice, but why did you choose the S-12 for home defense? It's a somewhat complicated shotgun, despite being based on a simple design. I don't think I'd ever attempt to reload mine in a house fight, but then again, 8 12 ga rounds should mince anything that wants my TV anyway. Really, I'm just curious what makes one turn to the S12 over more traditional shotguns? I bought mine because I learned a lot of shooting on the AK platform, but I usually keep the old 870 just because its so simple to use. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
McUZI 1 Posted April 19, 2005 Report Share Posted April 19, 2005 Really, I'm just curious what makes one turn to the S12 over more traditional shotguns? I bought mine because I learned a lot of shooting on the AK platform, but I usually keep the old 870 just because its so simple to use. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Well, the whole "magazine" thing gets a lot of people wet about the damn thing... But I totally agree. For me, a regular, fast handling tube fed shotgun is my gun for HD. Sits nicely next to the bed and points very quickly from a back-laying or sitting position, which seems to be an important thing for a bedside gu that could be called upon to react to a situation where you are lying down. Try it with your Saiga 12. 8 rounds of 12 gauge in a pumpgun or a tube fed autoloader in a HD scenario is gracious ammo. I seriously doubt i'll have to reload. And if for some reason eight rounds isn't enough? If that freak occurance happens and I get into a roving gun battle with a gang of gangbangers within the confines of my own house? It's Form-4 gun time Quote Link to post Share on other sites
mopeman 0 Posted April 19, 2005 Report Share Posted April 19, 2005 I was thinking the same thing, a winchester 1300 holds 8 in the tube, and are readily available at $270.00 to $340.00, and ther's a ton of stuff to add to on them. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Gummerfan 0 Posted April 19, 2005 Report Share Posted April 19, 2005 Nice to know I'm not alone here! If the zombies attack, my Saiga will be staying in the safe. I can keep the lead flying much better with my tube-feds. With the Saiga, even if you can change mags fast enough, once they run dry, you've got a club. And I can carry way more mags and ammo for my other weapons anyway. Try keeping your S-12 mags loaded in a hurry. Gummerfan Quote Link to post Share on other sites
ForGreatJustice 1 Posted April 19, 2005 Report Share Posted April 19, 2005 To be fair, Home defense is a little different from SHTF, or even mobile defense in the field. The Saiga, it seems to me, was designed for a brutish, ugly and short battle, in which one side (the side with the Saiga) turns the other side into sausage inside of the first 5 seconds. For a seige though, it's a tube-fed all the way. -T Nice to know I'm not alone here! If the zombies attack, my Saiga will be staying in the safe. I can keep the lead flying much better with my tube-feds. With the Saiga, even if you can change mags fast enough, once they run dry, you've got a club.And I can carry way more mags and ammo for my other weapons anyway. Try keeping your S-12 mags loaded in a hurry. Gummerfan <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Quote Link to post Share on other sites
G O B 3,516 Posted April 19, 2005 Report Share Posted April 19, 2005 The wife has a Saiga .410 for HD. With a mag full of #3 shot, She need only to thumb the safety, cycle the bolt and rock'N'roll! 9 rd's should "git-er-done" . Store the Saiga with steel hulls, leave one round out to be"sping friendly" Keep it in a SAFE, HANDY place. Practice, practice, practice! If you cannot go shoot with your HD at least practice at home . If you go to grab something that your hands are not familiar with-especially when you have just been awakened to a stressfull situation. ..... there is NO time to think.... INSTINCT must take over. If you do not practice it will NOT be instinctual to handle the situation effetively. G O B Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Bvamp 604 Posted April 20, 2005 Report Share Posted April 20, 2005 i was a mossberg 500 guy until i used my saiga12 for a while. it is absolute in reliability and funciton otherwise. im a shotgun guy, and its a big deal for me to chage up like i did. not the best gun for ducks and stuff, but man, it will NEVER EVER fail you......... Quote Link to post Share on other sites
shotgunman 0 Posted April 20, 2005 Report Share Posted April 20, 2005 I was at a local pawn shop her in bham Alabama and they have a camo s-12 factory painted looks good 1 mag unconverted only 169.00 I dont have the bucks right now or I would jump on it Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Cobra 76 two 2,677 Posted April 20, 2005 Report Share Posted April 20, 2005 elLOCOmutha there's nothing wrong with an S12 for home defense in my opinion. Yeah tube fed guns are nice and some are quite reliable, not including my ol' Stevens 620. That sucker will jam in a heartbeat. I've heard others say that just the sound of a person racking a 12 ga pump is enough to make an intruder wet his pants. But the sound of an AK bolt being pulled back an released is no less frightening and you only have to do that once. There is no pump gun as effective as concentrated semi auto fire, I don't care how fast you are. If my wife ever has to grab the shotgun for defense I would feel confidant knowing she could pull that charging handle one time and rock and roll. This being said, before you decide on what gun and what ammo you are going to use in an emergency situation it is best to practice with said gun and ammo untill you are 150% confidant in it's reliability and effectiveness with that particular load. Then there will be no question if the need arises. shotgunman Factory camo? How long is the bbl? I have a proposition for you. If it's in good shape I will send you the money to buy the gun for me. You can keep the 5 round mag for your trouble. That way you can send your other 5s to Wakal to make a 10 and still have a 5 to use also. Let me know what you think. If the mag is camo to match I will send you one of my 5s in trade. I saw Slayer again at Ozzfest too last year. They still rock just as hard as they did last time I saw them in 91' here in Fayettenam. Send me a PM or email if you are interested. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
ForGreatJustice 1 Posted April 22, 2005 Report Share Posted April 22, 2005 (edited) When my S12 pulls bedside duty, I keep it in cruiser ready, that is, safety off, chamber empty, mag loaded on a closed bolt. The two 8s are clamped together, but I don't anticipate reloading. As mentioned above, I flip off the safety even though it is already off, whenever I shoulder the weapon. It's a habit you should get into if you're going to use any Kalashnikov pattern weapon. Have a fallback position/weapon. If my Saiga runs out of ammunition and things still need shooting (highly unlikely), a pistol or two is nearby with 30+ rounds available. Edited April 22, 2005 by ForGreatJustice Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Saiga Saga 7 Posted April 22, 2005 Report Share Posted April 22, 2005 I installed the Blackjack SWIFT lever when I did my pistol grip conversion. I leave the bolt locked back with an 8 rounder in the well.( It actually holds 9 this way and no worry about shell distortion). Pick up gun, push down safety with a flick of the finger when ready and first round is chambered and ready to go with 8 more to back it up. Let me add that this is for you single or married folks only, those of you with youngsters can have the bolt pulled back and gun next to the bed but need to pull the mag and lock it in the nightstand or hide it under the matress or some shit. In other words those with youngsters would be better off with a pump, lol. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
IndyArms 10,186 Posted April 23, 2005 Report Share Posted April 23, 2005 Personally, I usually am in the forefront of gun safety, and care with children... However, I am going to stick my neck out here, because of something that I find interesting with the saiga line... I leave my 410 next to the bed, safety on and a full magazine with a shell *NOT* chambered, and the hammer against the firing pin... I have to disengage the safety, THEN rack the action to get a round chambered..and with the added tension of the hammer, you all know the difference in pull on the slide lever.... My point is... My kids are 7 and 10... and NEITHER one of them is strong enough to rack that action, if they even WANTED to... mind you.. they do not touch the guns, as they shoot all the time and KNOW the seriousness a gun poses. Thats the only gun remotely "loaded" in the house...and I feel secure that the kids CANT fuck with it... even though I am confident that they wont... With a pump... it is MUCH easier to chamber a round... almost NO FORCE needed to cycle a pump action... least MINE is as free as you please to cycle.. I know the kids COULD cycle that one.. and I WOULD NOT leave a semi-loaded pump laying around in my home..."just in case"... but all that is academic.. and purely my $.02 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Diggler 0 Posted April 24, 2005 Report Share Posted April 24, 2005 Personally, I usually am in the forefront of gun safety, and care with children... However, I am going to stick my neck out here, because of something that I find interesting with the saiga line... I leave my 410 next to the bed, safety on and a full magazine with a shell *NOT* chambered, and the hammer against the firing pin... I have to disengage the safety, THEN rack the action to get a round chambered..and with the added tension of the hammer, you all know the difference in pull on the slide lever.... My point is... My kids are 7 and 10... and NEITHER one of them is strong enough to rack that action, if they even WANTED to... mind you.. they do not touch the guns, as they shoot all the time and KNOW the seriousness a gun poses. Thats the only gun remotely "loaded" in the house...and I feel secure that the kids CANT fuck with it... even though I am confident that they wont... With a pump... it is MUCH easier to chamber a round... almost NO FORCE needed to cycle a pump action... least MINE is as free as you please to cycle.. I know the kids COULD cycle that one.. and I WOULD NOT leave a semi-loaded pump laying around in my home..."just in case"... but all that is academic.. and purely my $.02 <{POST_SNAPBACK}> You are crazy if you think a 10 year old can't cycle the action. He just hasn't found the right way to do it yet. I won't leave a full mag in my shotgun because of the top round deformation issue. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
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