hartzpad 0 Posted September 21, 2008 Report Share Posted September 21, 2008 (edited) Finally cleaned my Saiga's gas system (it was filthy) and then shot a 3 gun match today. I have always been able to run everything on gas setting #1, even cheap 100 pack Wal-mart Federal target loads. Today at the 3 Gun match, it malfunctioned a few times, so I changed to setting #2 and the empties really ejected much further, but still had some occasional malfunctions. It seemed to not be grabbing a fresh round from the magazine because the bolt wasn't traveling reward far enough, only happened 2 times out of 60 rounds after I changed the gas setting. When I cleaned it, I removed the gas piston plug from the gas tube and cleaned it as well as the 3 gas ports to the barrel. How can cleaning my Saiga cause it to malfunction now? Does it need to be somewhat dirty to function? It always ran before this so give me some advice. Anything I can check? I was able to finish the match and I did really well. Maybe my Saiga just likes being dirty and that is why the more I shot today the better it functioned. I need to tear it apart and check it out. Edited September 21, 2008 by hartzpad Quote Link to post Share on other sites
152dbs 0 Posted September 21, 2008 Report Share Posted September 21, 2008 u do anything to the piston? .... and just a far out thought....bump any of the internals, may have misaligned the fcg, or bumped the retaining plate so it slows down the carrier just enough to throw it off... Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Monk 0 Posted September 21, 2008 Report Share Posted September 21, 2008 Just because you think you can fire them on #1 doesn't mean you should, especially if reliability is the top priority. You didn't describe the failure, so it is impossible for anyone to narrow down what the potential causes may be. Were you getting failures to eject? Was it ejecting rounds but failing to pick up the next round? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Bvamp 604 Posted September 21, 2008 Report Share Posted September 21, 2008 hartzpad - mine did the same thing!!! its all you man..........ah, i love blacksabbath........orchid rules. my advice is CRAP. this is really where the insults over the years stops. oh, fuck all. you guys can figure it out!!!! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Cobra 76 two 2,677 Posted September 21, 2008 Report Share Posted September 21, 2008 ? That is mighty strange.... Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Makc 64 Posted September 21, 2008 Report Share Posted September 21, 2008 hartzpad - mine did the same thing!!! its all you man..........ah, i love blacksabbath........orchid rules. my advice is CRAP. this is really where the insults over the years stops. oh, fuck all. you guys can figure it out!!!! What in the world is this?!? I cannot decipher the solution to fixing the problem Hartzpad is having.... B, you got to stop with posts like this, man - they make you look really bad... Sorry Hartzpad, I did not meant to highjack your thread... It might be that the gas port holes themselves got clogged and need cleaning. Or one other thing you can try (which worked for me) is unscrewing the regulator plug out 1 full 360 degree turn... Check if that would make the difference... Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Bushido 2 Posted September 21, 2008 Report Share Posted September 21, 2008 ? That is mighty strange.... Ditto! ? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Franky 2 Posted September 21, 2008 Report Share Posted September 21, 2008 hartzpad - mine did the same thing!!! its all you man..........ah, i love blacksabbath........orchid rules. my advice is CRAP. this is really where the insults over the years stops. oh, fuck all. you guys can figure it out!!!! Wwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwhat??? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
evildog 20 Posted September 21, 2008 Report Share Posted September 21, 2008 hartzpad - mine did the same thing!!! its all you man..........ah, i love blacksabbath........orchid rules. my advice is CRAP. this is really where the insults over the years stops. oh, fuck all. you guys can figure it out!!!! I act like this also when i don't have my crack before 10am. lol Quote Link to post Share on other sites
mscottrogers 56 Posted September 21, 2008 Report Share Posted September 21, 2008 hartzpad - mine did the same thing!!! its all you man..........ah, i love blacksabbath........orchid rules. my advice is CRAP. this is really where the insults over the years stops. oh, fuck all. you guys can figure it out!!!! Oh yeah that reminds me..... Don't do crack Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Flex_BT 0 Posted September 21, 2008 Report Share Posted September 21, 2008 I had the same exact problem with mine after cleaning the gas tube, it just wasn't getting enough pressure to push the bolt back all the way. I assume this is the same problem with yours. Unfortunately I didn't have enough time to go to the range to see if this worked yet but I took the tube back apart again (man that puck was a BITCH to get out of there), cleaned the shit out of it, soaked the puck in cleaner to get it squeaky clean and cleared out the three gas ports as best I could with a dental pick. I know people say to be sure NOT to oil the gas tube as it will gunk up and stop it from working properly. I didn't make that mistake but I'm not sure where I went wrong. If my re-cleaning doesn't work I'll probably polish up the bottom of the bolt and top of the hammer as said in one of the stickied posts. Do you guys use the white polishing dremel attachments? What kind of polish do you use with them and how much of that crap do you put on there? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Bayoupiper 738 Posted September 21, 2008 Report Share Posted September 21, 2008 ? That is mighty strange.... Some people shouldn't post when they are hung over....... Quote Link to post Share on other sites
cscharlie 107 Posted September 21, 2008 Report Share Posted September 21, 2008 Finally cleaned my Saiga's gas system (it was filthy) and then shot a 3 gun match today. I have always been able to run everything on gas setting #1, even cheap 100 pack Wal-mart Federal target loads. Today at the 3 Gun match, it malfunctioned a few times, so I changed to setting #2 and the empties really ejected much further, but still had some occasional malfunctions. It seemed to not be grabbing a fresh round from the magazine because the bolt wasn't traveling reward far enough, only happened 2 times out of 60 rounds after I changed the gas setting. When I cleaned it, I removed the gas piston plug from the gas tube and cleaned it as well as the 3 gas ports to the barrel. How can cleaning my Saiga cause it to malfunction now? Does it need to be somewhat dirty to function? It always ran before this so give me some advice. Anything I can check? I was able to finish the match and I did really well. Maybe my Saiga just likes being dirty and that is why the more I shot today the better it functioned. I need to tear it apart and check it out. One thing that I've seen is part of a cleaning patch hanging up on the inside of the barrel at the gas ports while cleaning, and then plugging the gas system when fired. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
6500rpm 670 Posted September 21, 2008 Report Share Posted September 21, 2008 All I can think is that the crap in the gas block was causing a better seal, now that you've cleaned it, it's been clearanced out? If you only have three ports and your shooting matches, I'd give pulling the block and drilling a fourth port a good look. Did you mess with anything other than the gas block/piston/port area? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
GPalmer 1 Posted September 21, 2008 Report Share Posted September 21, 2008 hartzpad - mine did the same thing!!! its all you man..........ah, i love blacksabbath........orchid rules. my advice is CRAP. this is really where the insults over the years stops. oh, fuck all. you guys can figure it out!!!! What in the world is this?!? I cannot decipher the solution to fixing the problem Hartzpad is having.... B, you got to stop with posts like this, man - they make you look really bad... +1, Ben, take it from someone who has never insulted you but has been a witness to your self destruction on the forums. You have it in your grasp to be one of the most respected members of this forum and a resource that helps everyone. And you're throwing it away, you'll blame others for taking your reputation but the truth is that you had it in your hands and threw it away. One of these posts completely undoes the respect engendered by many of your positive posts. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
hartzpad 0 Posted September 21, 2008 Author Report Share Posted September 21, 2008 I was thinking the same thing, the dirty gas system sealed better than a clean one, I got most of the carbon off my gas system puck but I could probably do better. I made it over 3000 rounds without a gas system cleaning, I figure I just won't clean it again. In the match I went the last 40 rounds or so rapid fire without any malfunction, so maybe it is getting better the dirtier it gets. I used brake cleaner to spray and clean out the gas ports to the barrel, maybe I'll find a dental pick to try out. The malfunctions only lost me around a second each, but seconds count. On the plus side, I have been able to reload my full AGP mags on a closed bolt the first try every reload, I don't need a bolt hold open, but might try the new one when it comes out. I had a Jeric LRBHO and never installed it because I have my reloads down. One thing I would like to have on my 12 is the Kreb's left side thumb safety that my KTR-03S rifle has, it is way faster to engage/disengage than the stock and/or aftermarket extended safety selectors. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Bvamp 604 Posted September 22, 2008 Report Share Posted September 22, 2008 cause - the dirt and grime and crap caused your puck to wear a bit, which doesnt give it enough of a seal. when you cleaned the gunk, the remaining seal from crud was no longer there. solution - get new gas puck. my original is VERY dimensionally different after the abuse it took, as opposed to the new puck I installed. it worked for me. better than my half asleep post above? (it was quite nasty, wasnt it?) Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Bayoupiper 738 Posted September 22, 2008 Report Share Posted September 22, 2008 cause - the dirt and grime and crap caused your puck to wear a bit, which doesnt give it enough of a seal. when you cleaned the gunk, the remaining seal from crud was no longer there. solution - get new gas puck. my original is VERY dimensionally different after the abuse it took, as opposed to the new puck I installed. it worked for me. better than my half asleep post above? Who are you and what did you do with Bvamp! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Bvamp 604 Posted September 22, 2008 Report Share Posted September 22, 2008 Will - he is over with the empty bottle of scotch his landlord brought over last night. Im filling in for him today while that asshole rests. (thats why I dont drink that crap anymore, or try not to.) Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Cobra 76 two 2,677 Posted September 22, 2008 Report Share Posted September 22, 2008 Ya know those breathalizer gadgets they install on people's cars after they get too many DWIs? It's a shame they don't make those for keyboards! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Bvamp 604 Posted September 22, 2008 Report Share Posted September 22, 2008 yeh really. thats what scotch does to me, for the record. I was kicking myself when I saw it today when I woke up. Ever whack yourself in the head all pissed off when you have a hangover? I can tell ya, it dont feel too good.... an apology wont suffice for that type of bullshit, so I wont even try. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
zakmatthews 14 Posted September 22, 2008 Report Share Posted September 22, 2008 anyone ever listen to the song "alcohol" by brad paisley? i heard it for the first time just the other day . . . really made me laugh. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
SJgunguy 5 Posted September 22, 2008 Report Share Posted September 22, 2008 anyone ever listen to the song "alcohol" by brad paisley? i heard it for the first time just the other day . . . really made me laugh. Nope can't say that I have. You ever heard "Too Drunk To Fuck" by the Dead Kennedy's. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
hartzpad 0 Posted September 22, 2008 Author Report Share Posted September 22, 2008 OK, good theory. Running 3000+ rounds with a dirty gas piston and then cleaning it has given it a loose fit causing blowby and thereby not enough bolt carrier movement and a malfunction. Actually makes a lot of sense. Who sells new gas pistons? I've seen the Tromix gas piston, is there any other manufacturer and what dealers sell them online? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Bvamp 604 Posted September 22, 2008 Report Share Posted September 22, 2008 I have a CHAOS plug, myself. http://www.chaosus.com/home.html Tromix makes pucks and they are sold here - http://www.mississippiautoarms.com They both count as one US part in the Saiga shotgun, and both are US made. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
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