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Bullpup Saiga- 12 options?


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aku94bullpup.jpg

 

I was wondering if anyone recognizes this AK-47 bullpup kit, and would know whether or not it can be used on a saiga-12? A friend and I intend to try just that, but don't know exactly where to start, whether the kit will fit properly, or even if it's simply impossible. Any advice or directions on where to look would be greatly appreciated.

I apologize if this topic has been covered before, but if someone could point out such a thread to me, that would be great.

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Ive seen the AK done in a bullpup configuration before, weather you use a Saiga or Romanian kit or whatever. Like all bullpups, once you get the linkage rod routed and figured out to work reliably, your home free. Most folks are not very impressed with the design, its overall fabrication expense and time outweigh its usefullness. Ready built kits are very expensive. The F.A.C. catalog used to have one for around $500.

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I only saw one S-12 bullpup, but I'll be darned! Someone threw it in a Muzzelite clamshell stock... It also looks like someone put together a Groza or Norinco 86 but didn't put the charging handle up top.

 

I think one of the biggest problems with AK bullpups is that the charging handle prevents shouldering on the left shoulder. A pretty critical weakness in cornering.

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I think one of the biggest problems with AK bullpups is that the charging handle prevents shouldering on the left shoulder.

 

Uh... so what if you get rid of the charging handle, you've still got that pesky ol' EJECTION PORT throwing hot brass into your cheek!

 

With a couple notable exceptions, bullpups IN GENERAL just aren't lefty-friendly.

Edited by shooter2
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The kit you have pictured is called a AKU-94 Bullpup conversion. The kit has recieved many poor reviews. The

articles I have read all say its ill formed cheap plastic, and the fire controls are unreliable, and usually dont work correctly. You can read about it at AK-47.net.

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From a "holy crap, what is that weird futuristic-space gun" perspective, a bullpup shotgun would be cool.

 

From a "I'm hardcore about urban warfare and need to be able to clear a corner" perspective, a bullpup shotgun would be cool.

 

From a "I'm a backyard MacGuyver and want to build cool stuff" perspective, a bullpup shotgun would be cool.

 

From any other perspective, a bullpup shotgun doesn't seem too practical.

 

My understanding was that a bullpup was to maximize barrel length with a minimal overall length in order to keep ballistics maximized. But with a shotgun, we've learned that it doesn't much matter how long the barrel is (check some of the old posts on ballistics v. barrel length): a shotgun will never give pin-point accuracy or 1600m effectiveness.

 

Thus, the three reasons above are the only reasons I could see to do it. The time and money needed to create a reliable one don't seem to justify it, except for the cool factor of having a one of a kind bullpup. But I'd say, use the money to pay for an AOW and get an 12" or 8" normal style gun.

 

However, if you think you can make a reliable bullpup, I'd be a huge fan and would endorse it whole-heartedly. I just don't see it being a realistic option, but please prove me wrong. :killer:

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From a "holy crap, what is that weird futuristic-space gun" perspective, a bullpup shotgun would be cool.

 

From a "I'm hardcore about urban warfare and need to be able to clear a corner" perspective, a bullpup shotgun would be cool.

 

From a "I'm a backyard MacGuyver and want to build cool stuff" perspective, a bullpup shotgun would be cool.

 

From any other perspective, a bullpup shotgun doesn't seem too practical.

 

 

That kinda also falls under the M-11 thread from a week or two ago... cool but not really practical...

 

and I agree... I think a bullpup AK looks very cool... and being a righty... it works for me... BUT... it would have to be WELL MADE, and not chincy... to be one I would want to have as "my baby"....

 

 

:smoke:

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aku94bullpup.jpg

 

I was wondering if anyone recognizes this AK-47 bullpup kit, and would know whether or not it can be used on a saiga-12? A friend and I intend to try just that, but don't know exactly where to start, whether the kit will fit properly, or even if it's simply impossible. Any advice or directions on where to look would be greatly appreciated.

I apologize if this topic has been covered before, but if someone could point out such a thread to me, that would be great.

 

 

That is a K-var kit. They have them for about $200; http://www.k-var.com/shop/product.php?prod...&cat=256&page=1

 

As far as building AK bullpups check this forum: http://www.gunco.net/forums/search.php?searchid=534741

Edited by icarus
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If the shotgun bullpup wasn't plastic, I'd consider going for it. Didn't the guy that was on here that made one reenforce his with aluminum? I don't want to do all that.

 

And you're right, M11s aren't very practical, unless you want to dump alot of ammo quickly and at close range for a minimum cost, like say, a gang member. Hence the targeting of MACs and TEC-9s by anti-gun groups.

Edited by KySoldier
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Thanks for the advice all- and yes, just to clarify, this is entirely a backyard MacGuyver spacegun thing. There are far more practical guns to reach for if I need one, but few as pointlessly awesome as a bullpuped 12.

I like the mini-14 bullpup kit a lot more than the K-Var- I had been considering getting that same bullpup kit for my little ruger 10-22. I assume that it, like the K-Var kit, is plastic? Does anyone know if a pistol butted Saiga-12 or a rifle stock one would be easier to match up to that mini-14 kit, or does it make any difference?

Again, thanks for all of the help and pics.

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kinda funny...... :smoke:

 

I sold my Mossberg 500 bullpup to finance my first Saiga S-12 shotgun in Jan 05......to a member here.

Haven't seen him here anymore though.. What's Up ricardomangana?

 

Best trade in the world....I love my S-12!

 

I've owned a few bullpup designs.

 

Steyr Aug Bullpup

Bushmaster M17S Bullpup

Mossberg 500 Bullpup

 

 

I don't miss any of them..........even the Steyr. I got more than my monies worth on it.

 

Only Bullpup I ever liked was the Israeli Tavor I held. Never fired it though. And though not technically a bullpup. I don't think. The FN P90(and now semi-auto PS90) looks nice.

 

Bullpup Shotguns though...........No Thanks.

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Only Bullpup I ever liked was the Israeli Tavor I held. Never fired it though. And though not technically a bullpup. I don't think. The FN P90(and now semi-auto PS90) looks nice.

 

Bullpup Shotguns though...........No Thanks.

 

 

The Tavor and P90 are certainly technical bullpups as I understand the term. Any weapon with the action behind the grip and trigger.

 

The FS2000 looks really slick, but the price is ridiculous. I had a dealer quote me $2300 for pre-order.

 

I mean, come on!

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kinda funny...... :smoke:

 

I sold my Mossberg 500 bullpup to finance my first Saiga S-12 shotgun in Jan 05......to a member here.

Haven't seen him here anymore though.. What's Up ricardomangana?

 

Best trade in the world....I love my S-12!

 

I've owned a few bullpup designs.

 

Steyr Aug Bullpup

Bushmaster M17S Bullpup

Mossberg 500 Bullpup

 

 

I don't miss any of them..........even the Steyr. I got more than my monies worth on it.

 

Only Bullpup I ever liked was the Israeli Tavor I held. Never fired it though. And though not technically a bullpup. I don't think. The FN P90(and now semi-auto PS90) looks nice.

 

Bullpup Shotguns though...........No Thanks.

 

so the trigger was bad on the mossy? or it was just overall not that great?

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  • 4 weeks later...

Oh now you all have done it now I need another I think I can do better with my router table and some oak planks and it would serve a definite nitche for me in the storage area I could have it ready to go aboe the stairwell . Now if I can jsut get another decent deal to allow me money to play with. I like bull pup designes.

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The "compactness" of a bullpup is nice, but I still can't stand the idea of my face resting on the chamber area of the whole thing. Perhaps if it were a pistol-cartridge or something, but not much more than that.

 

I also think it would be cool if someone made one out of a single-stamping / sheet bend instead of attaching something to the front of a normal receiver.

Edited by mordecai
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I also think it would be cool if someone made one out of a single-stamping / sheet bend instead of attaching something to the front of a normal receiver.

 

That would be the best. It should be fairly easy to come up with a monolithic AK receiver/rail system. Might make the whole thing accurate and compete (At least stylistically) with the LMT MRP AR-15.

 

Actually...I would have thought Krebs would do that for the KTR series, but he went with a standard KCI rail instead.

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And you're right, M11s aren't very practical, unless you want to dump alot of ammo quickly and at close range for a minimum cost, like say, a gang member. Hence the targeting of MACs and TEC-9s by anti-gun groups.

 

You might be suprised what can be done with and M11 with a good stock and foregrip. It is not a trackdriving percision weapon but. At one of the shots I go to there are 55 gal drums set at about 50 yds. I can consistently nail them with my M11. I get regular hits on GI style pop up targets at about 100 yds. That is with stock sights which are not the best. Good trigger control and short burst go a long way in controlling a high rate of fire weapon such as the M11.

That's not to say a mag dump at closer range is not a lot of fun, because it is.

Just my 2 cents work on that subject

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So you rest your cheek right on the receiver cover with a bulldog? The reason I ask is because I just mounted a red dot sight on the top handguard of my AK pistol

 

 

Yep...that's the general idea. The toughest part about AK bullpups is having a positive safety and keeping that charging handle out of your face if you ever have to fire from the left.

Edited by ForGreatJustice
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if you want a semi bullpup shotgun try the highstandard m10b. i got one and it's really cool. it's designed for short mags though, back when the 3 inchers were not common. makes a great cqb gun though.

pat

 

 

Good point. That's probably the ONLY semi-bullpup shotun that actually got made, used, and altogether worked (Pancor Jackhammer and H&K CAWS never more than vaporware).

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