Centurion slugs any good? (as cheap break-in ammo)

[tofu1998 2]

These are cheap: http://www.sgammo.com/product/centurion/250rds-12-gauge-centurion-1-18-oz-slug-275-inch-1400-fps

 

Guess I can use a case of these to break-in my brand new Saiga 12?

[MrOneEyedBoh 14]

yeah from what I have researched on here they are. Nothing great but 1400fps, slugs and at 70 some odd bucks. I went for it too. Cant beat it. Well Im sure you can but for the deal at hand, it was good.

 

edit: FWIW I ordered last week and they have 78 of the 250rd packs.. now they have 34

Edited March 7, 2011 by MrOneEyedBoh

[tofu1998 2]

yeah from what I have researched on here they are. Nothing great but 1400fps, slugs and at 70 some odd bucks. I went for it too. Cant beat it. Well Im sure you can but for the deal at hand, it was good.

 

edit: FWIW I ordered last week and they have 78 of the 250rd packs.. now they have 34

 

Great. Thanks!

 

Just want to make sure that slugs are not too powerful for a mint gun seeing everyone suggest using 00 buck. (Thinking that you can't run a car too fast during the vehicle break-in)

[MrOneEyedBoh 14]

edit.

Edited March 7, 2011 by MrOneEyedBoh

[BullF-16 0]

edit.

 

I've shot about 30 or so of them thru a stock arsenal S-12 and a sweeter than hell RandR targets tactical gun. Neither gun would run them on setting 1 with the stock plug, no problems on setting 2. I have the MD arms V-plug in both guns now and they only run on setting 5 (most gas). So they are a little weak in my opinion but cycle fine on the correct gas setting. They also dont kick nearly as bad as buck shot loads.

 

For the price....cant beat em.

Edited March 7, 2011 by BullF-16

[tofu1998 2]

edit.

 

I've shot about 30 or so of them thru a stock arsenal S-12 and a sweeter than hell RandR targets tactical gun. Neither gun would run them on setting 1 with the stock plug, no problems on setting 2. I have the MD arms V-plug in both guns now and they only run on setting 5 (most gas). So they are a little weak in my opinion but cycle fine on the correct gas setting. They also dont kick nearly as bad as buck shot loads.

 

For the price....cant beat em.

 

Crap... Just ordered 1 case as break-in ammo. Seems I still need to look somewhere else.

Can anyone point out a deal on some decent priced shells that's powerful enough for a stock S-12?

[AJ Dual 43]

IMO, breaking in the Saiga is about wear-polishing the internals from use for slicker operation later on. Unless you've got a specific need to test the heavy load setting #1 on the gas regulator which just cuts off the gas a bit so the gun's not over-gassed and cycling too violently, for the most part, I'm thinking a stroke of the action is a stroke of the action. The cycling velocity is probably the same (within the ballpark) between a hot slug that needs setting one, and a mild slug that needs setting 2.

 

If they're getting stuck for you untill you went with after-market gas puck and settings, I'd try several hundred strokes of hand-cycling, then blasting the action out with lube, and trying again. You could also check how well your gas-ports are drilled.

 

Is it a three or four port model?

 

I'm just in the process of partially reloading Federal Wallyworld bulk-packs into slugs for my break-in. Those Centurions are roughly $320/1000 rounds, while Fed bulk target loads are $230/1000, saving you $90. (I figure sales tax in the store vs. shipping is roughly a wash...)

 

Lee Load-all $43

Lee Production Pot II $50

Lee 1oz 12ga Foster type shotgun slug mold $18.

 

So that's 1000 slugs (not counting your time) and an extra $22 dollars, which gets you almost completely set up to reload for 12ga. And now you've got a whole bunch of hulls you can use over. Next time around all you need is powder, lead, wads, and primers. (Plus you've got a little extra lead, since the bulk packs are 1 1/8th oz of shot..) And you're on your way to making '68 cal balls, ball & buck combos, or even getting into casting for other ammo/reloading too.

 

The worth of your time? I leave that to you.

 

They way I see it, unless you're rich, you want your Saiga to work with those cheap weaker loads, so any experimentation, polishing, break in, or adjustment it takes to get there is worthwhile.

 

For me, time spent casting slugs, or reloading shells is better than my screaming kids, picking up dog poop, or doing the dishes.

Edited March 7, 2011 by AJ Dual

[Dad2142Dad 6,559]

Just get a case of federal at Wally Mart, 100 rounds $22.

[tofu1998 2]

IMO, breaking in the Saiga is about wear-polishing the internals from use for slicker operation later on. Unless you've got a specific need to test the heavy load setting #1 on the gas regulator which just cuts off the gas a bit so the gun's not over-gassed and cycling too violently, for the most part, I'm thinking a stroke of the action is a stroke of the action. The cycling velocity is probably the same between a hot slug that needs setting one, and a mild slug that needs setting 2.

 

I'm just in the process of partially reloading Federal Wallyworld bulk-packs into slugs for my break-in. Those Centurions are roughly $320/1000 rounds, while Fed bulk target loads are $230/1000, saving you $90. (I figure sales tax in the store vs. shipping is roughly a wash...)

 

Lee Load-all $43

Lee Production Pot II $50

Lee 1oz 12ga Foster type shotgun slug mold $18.

 

So that's 1000 slugs (not counting your time) and an extra $22 dollars, which gets you almost completely set up to reload for 12ga. And now you've got a whole bunch of hulls you can use over. Next time around all you need is powder, lead, wads, and primers. (Plus you've got a little extra lead, since the bulk packs are 1 1/8th oz of shot..)

The worth of your time? I leave that to you.

 

For me, time spent casting slugs, or reloading shells is better than my screaming kids, picking up dog poop, or doing the dishes.

 

 

Sounds fun. A good skill to have in case of SHTF also. I'll definitely consider investing on that down the road.

Back to the topic of break-in, I think you do have a point that I can do with the mild slugs I have now and I do like to run a mint gun more smoothly.

However after reading the description of V-plug on MD Arm's site, I think the finer adjustment than the factory 2 settings offered by the V-plug is a must have. I'm new to the world S-12, so I'd like to hear more people's thoughts about factory VS after-market gas plug. Thanks in advance!

Edited March 7, 2011 by Tofu San

[PostsOnPercocet 32]

IMO, breaking in the Saiga is about wear-polishing the internals from use for slicker operation later on. Unless you've got a specific need to test the heavy load setting #1 on the gas regulator which just cuts off the gas a bit so the gun's not over-gassed and cycling too violently, for the most part, I'm thinking a stroke of the action is a stroke of the action. The cycling velocity is probably the same (within the ballpark) between a hot slug that needs setting one, and a mild slug that needs setting 2.

 

If they're getting stuck for you untill you went with after-market gas puck and settings, I'd try several hundred strokes of hand-cycling, then blasting the action out with lube, and trying again. You could also check how well your gas-ports are drilled.

 

Is it a three or four port model?

 

I'm just in the process of partially reloading Federal Wallyworld bulk-packs into slugs for my break-in. Those Centurions are roughly $320/1000 rounds, while Fed bulk target loads are $230/1000, saving you $90. (I figure sales tax in the store vs. shipping is roughly a wash...)

 

Lee Load-all $43

Lee Production Pot II $50

Lee 1oz 12ga Foster type shotgun slug mold $18.

 

So that's 1000 slugs (not counting your time) and an extra $22 dollars, which gets you almost completely set up to reload for 12ga. And now you've got a whole bunch of hulls you can use over. Next time around all you need is powder, lead, wads, and primers. (Plus you've got a little extra lead, since the bulk packs are 1 1/8th oz of shot..) And you're on your way to making '68 cal balls, ball & buck combos, or even getting into casting for other ammo/reloading too.

 

The worth of your time? I leave that to you.

 

They way I see it, unless you're rich, you want your Saiga to work with those cheap weaker loads, so any experimentation, polishing, break in, or adjustment it takes to get there is worthwhile.

 

For me, time spent casting slugs, or reloading shells is better than my screaming kids, picking up dog poop, or doing the dishes.

 

You're a smart man!

[MrOneEyedBoh 14]

hey man that MDarms plug is where its at.

[ChileRelleno 7,071]

These are cheap: http://www.sgammo.co...5-inch-1400-fps

 

Guess I can use a case of these to break-in my brand new Saiga 12?

Short answer, Yes.

 

I buy'em regularly, them and the Rio 00, good inexpensive plinking ammo.

I just took another delivery last week.

 

Products on order: 1 x 250rds - 12 gauge Centurion 1 1/8 oz Slug 2.75 inch 1400 FPS - $79.75

SKU: ac12rs-250

 

1 x 250rd - 12 Gauge RIO High Power 00 Buckshot 9 pellet - $109.00

SKU: RB129-250

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[MrOneEyedBoh 14]

No issues with that rio huh? Cant push it thru the MDarms though right?

[nattyiceking 33]

No issues with that rio huh? Cant push it thru the MDarms though right?

 

Are you talking about the drum? Any round thats 2 3/4" will fit that drum..

[MrOneEyedBoh 14]

No issues with that rio huh? Cant push it thru the MDarms though right?

 

Are you talking about the drum? Any round thats 2 3/4" will fit that drum..

 

you sir need to read up on the MDarms drums...

 

 

edit: Just to eliminate any he said stuff, its because of the roll crimp. If they are roll crimped no go, start crimped are good to go.

Edited March 8, 2011 by MrOneEyedBoh

[AJ Dual 43]

You're a smart man!

 

I wish I could take credit for the idea, but I can't. Since last fall there's been a few threads about people converting Federal bulk-pack into slugs.

 

However, some of these people were doing CRAZY stuff like making a wooden jig to expose the last 1/16th of the shell and cut off the crimp with a razor blade, and then sealing the slug in place with RTV silicone caulk.

 

Note that doing this would be pretty controversial on a reloading forum. There's endless debate, and no clear answers as to what the pressure curve of shot vs. slugs are, since the shot might compress in the wad, which might be absorbing some pressure, or fattening the wad sideways, putting more friction on the bore, and actually increasing pressure over that of a slug. Then there's the issue of the powder type, and it's speed (of burning) and what's suitable for what given load.

 

Or it's all a bunch of theoretical hoo-ha, since nobody's bothered to stick a microscope inside the chamber of a shotgun and see what happens. And if there's good test-fixture pressure transducer data on these kinds of variations, nobody seems to reference it.

 

Be prepared to be flamed if you go looking for help in other reloading forums. Just beware.

 

However, there's some compensating information too.

 

1. You're going from 1 1/8th oz down to 1.

2. A solid slug vs. shot pressure curve is a 50/50 tossup as best I can tell. Loose shot absorbs pressure Or... lose shot creates more by squishing sideways against the bore. (shrug)

3. This is a load for Saiga's, which is a rather different design in several ways from most other common shotguns. It has a rifle-like rotating bolt, a beefy barrel that is also further reinforced by the trunnion, and we all know the Saiga is designed for hot high-brass loads, and to come back begging for more. Getting it to work well with mild loads is the challenge.

[ChileRelleno 7,071]

No issues with that rio huh? Cant push it thru the MDarms though right?

Yep, it hangs in the MD20, roll crimped shells do indeed pose a problem in the MD20

 

Nope, no issues with RIO's High Power 00, cycles in my S12 just fine.

Then again, my S12 cycles even the Wally World Winchester bulk just fine.

But I do prefer the WW Federal bulk, its just about all I run through my MD20's as everything else is too expensive for that kind of fun.

[evlblkwpnz 3,418]

IMO, breaking in the Saiga is about wear-polishing the internals from use for slicker operation later on. Unless you've got a specific need to test the heavy load setting #1 on the gas regulator which just cuts off the gas a bit so the gun's not over-gassed and cycling too violently, for the most part, I'm thinking a stroke of the action is a stroke of the action. The cycling velocity is probably the same (within the ballpark) between a hot slug that needs setting one, and a mild slug that needs setting 2.

 

If they're getting stuck for you untill you went with after-market gas puck and settings, I'd try several hundred strokes of hand-cycling, then blasting the action out with lube, and trying again. You could also check how well your gas-ports are drilled.

 

Is it a three or four port model?

 

I'm just in the process of partially reloading Federal Wallyworld bulk-packs into slugs for my break-in. Those Centurions are roughly $320/1000 rounds, while Fed bulk target loads are $230/1000, saving you $90. (I figure sales tax in the store vs. shipping is roughly a wash...)

 

Lee Load-all $43

Lee Production Pot II $50

Lee 1oz 12ga Foster type shotgun slug mold $18.

 

So that's 1000 slugs (not counting your time) and an extra $22 dollars, which gets you almost completely set up to reload for 12ga. And now you've got a whole bunch of hulls you can use over. Next time around all you need is powder, lead, wads, and primers. (Plus you've got a little extra lead, since the bulk packs are 1 1/8th oz of shot..) And you're on your way to making '68 cal balls, ball & buck combos, or even getting into casting for other ammo/reloading too.

 

The worth of your time? I leave that to you.

 

They way I see it, unless you're rich, you want your Saiga to work with those cheap weaker loads, so any experimentation, polishing, break in, or adjustment it takes to get there is worthwhile.

 

For me, time spent casting slugs, or reloading shells is better than my screaming kids, picking up dog poop, or doing the dishes.

 

You're a smart man!

 

That "hand cycling" comment is pure genius.... and a much cheaper than "high brass" ammo.

[vtec16 0]

Ordered 250 rounds from sgammo. Works great on my Saiga 12 with TAC 47 Autoplug, AGP 10 round mag, Surefire 10 round mag. Wish I could get a hi cap drum, but I live in Commiefornia. Nothing like throwing 10 rounds downrange as fast as you can pull the trigger, excuse me, "squeeze the trigger". Makes a great smoke cloud too. It's always a showstopper when I bring it to the range.

[nattyiceking 33]

Ordered 250 rounds from sgammo. Works great on my Saiga 12 with TAC 47 Autoplug, AGP 10 round mag, Surefire 10 round mag. Wish I could get a hi cap drum, but I live in Commiefornia. Nothing like throwing 10 rounds downrange as fast as you can pull the trigger, excuse me, "squeeze the trigger". Makes a great smoke cloud too. It's always a showstopper when I bring it to the range.

 

How many rounds have you shot while using the autoplug? Have you had any issues with it? I've been thinking about buying one for a while but I haven't found enough info on here to convince me.

[TTMR 11]

Don't need those slugs but thanks for the link to that site!

[erwos 12]

I'm resurrecting this thread to ask the following: has anyone run these Centurion slugs through an MD20? I'm about to put in an order for a case (range time!), but I need to make sure they're compatible...

[fauxknight 30]

I've been meaning to ask this, these aren't listed as rifled, but it looks like they are, is that correct?

[kindapointless 22]

I would like to know also and a little more info on turning bulk to slug

[shades_of_grey 1,092]

Just get a case of federal at Wally Mart, 100 rounds $22.

 

Not every Walmart sells cases of slugs or buck. The one local to me sells only single boxes, and half the time they're out of stock.

 

So except for the odd box here and there, (when I haven't properly planned), I don't buy shotshells from any local retail store. I buy online.

 

I'll have to try some of these Centurion slugs, see how well they run in my S-12. I agree completely with Chile on the Rio 00 buck. It's great ammo for the $, though limited to stick mags.

[FORKLIFT352 63]

I got some load data for them Fed's in the

reload sec.

[AJ Dual 43]

I would like to know also and a little more info on turning bulk to slug

 

Well, I'm in the process of converting a case of 100 Federal Wallyworld bulk 1 1/8th oz/3 Dram #8 shot into 1oz slugs and reloading them with my Lee shotshell reloader.

 

So far I have:

 

- Pulled open the crimp to 100 Fed bulk shotshells, and dumped the shot into my Lee #10 production pot, and from that I cast 111 1oz slugs into the 1oz Lee mold.

- Stuffed the slugs back into the shot wads where to my relief and delight, they're a perfect fit.

- Test crimped a few of them shut with my Lee shotshell loader. Now I just need to find a good spot on my workbench to mount it, or a hardwood board to which I can mount it and C-clamp it all down. For now I just held the Lee steady with one hand and ran the operating lever over the shell with the other. (awkward...)

 

 

I need to take some pictures and make a more detailed thread about it once I know they actually will work. The bulk packs aren't known for working great in Saiga's out of the box as is, and now I've reduced the payload weight by 1/8th oz too. That'll either do one of four things, or some combination of them.

 

- Reduce the pressure of the load even more, and make them even less likely to cycle than the original because it's 1/8th oz less lead.

- Have higher velocity, meaning the powder is still burning when it reaches the gas ports and actually cycle better.

- Have higher pressure because loose shot in the wad acts like a shock absorber, and a solid slug does not do that.

- Have lower pressure because loose shot gets squashed, spreads sideways, making the wad grip the bore harder than a slug would.

 

Kind of a mystery. AFAIK, no one's ever done high speed X-ray films of a shotgun comparing identical loads save for shot and slugs.

 

I also need to find a member of my gun club with a chrony if possible to see what kind of velocity I'm getting. (my guess is 1300fps)

 

If the first batch of 100 works well, or I can get them to work well after break in/polishing, or any other mods within reason, I'll convert the other five packs I've stored up.

 

After that, I'm going to save my hulls, and then try full blown reloading, with new primers, powder, wads, and scrap lead from wheel weights, or a scrapyard etc.

 

I got some load data for them Fed's in the

reload sec.

 

You mean this thread? http://forum.saiga-12.com/index.php?/topic/66345-wally-world-fed-cheep-stuff/page__p__639921&do=findComment&comment=639921

 

If so, good to know, thanks!

Edited May 13, 2011 by AJ Dual

[spencer60 0]

I'm resurrecting this thread to ask the following: has anyone run these Centurion slugs through an MD20? I'm about to put in an order for a case (range time!), but I need to make sure they're compatible...

 

I have to shoot slugs at one of my indoor ranges, so I've probably put 300 of these through my (2) MD20s, and another 100 or so through my AA-30 without any problems. Even in factory trim my gun never had any issue cycling these. If you need slugs, also keep an eye out for deals on Nobel (or NobelSport). I've used their slugs and single-ball ammo a lot, and it's always worked well. BTW, SGA (mentioned earlier in the thread) is a good company to get ammo from too, although they don't have a great selection they have good prices on what they do carry. If you go to the gun-deals web site (Google it exactly like that and it should be #1) you'll usually find either Centurion or Nobel slugs out there cheap.

[lbsrdi 1,078]

You said you did run these slugs out of a MD20?^^^

[srupp23 2]

I bought these slugs too from SGAmmo and ran them this week. They ran fine on the stock plug setting 2. Did not load them into the MD20 but plan on doing it this weekend.