Wax Slugs

[CamelBlue 0]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VhqosJmUS-0

First watch this.

 

Now, this is for entertainment purposes only and not to be duplicated unless supervised by your local reloader.

 

This seems super dangerous and fun at the same time. Imagine how many "slugs" you could produce for $.25 a piece. Anyone ever try this?

[Alexc.s. 25]

Tried it, one piece of shot got out and locked up my Mossberg. Had to strip it to remove. This was after about 30-35 wax slugs though. (All tube feed, not one at a time.)

I had the odd affect of the slug jumping way high on all shots with both 18.5" and 28" barrels. Around 3 feet high at 75-100yards.(windage was dead on)

If I had no other way of making or buying cheap slugs/buckshot and I didn't have a rifle I would consider making these. They would be effective with practice.

[MT Predator 2,294]

My Dad used to make a similar load with rock salt to keep the bears out of the trash can on trash day.

[Cobra 76 two 2,677]

Heh! I like this guy! Wonder if they are in NC?

[gunfun 3,931]

Could this be done effectively by making a vibrating box with a bunch of shells and pouring the wax in without removing the lead?

 

It seems to me that this could be way more time efficient and consistent in weight that way. Just get a 3" thick block of wood and bore a bunch of holes in it that are a snug fit with 12 ga. put a board under it and set it on a massage pad or something to vibrate the wax down.

 

I would also want to make a jig for trimming the ends off more quickly and consistently.

 

I like the idea of cost, and wonder how the accuracy would do with my paradox choke.

[theturtlepond 31]

I tried them. They were fun but didn't really have the power that slugs do. And you have to heat the lead shot with the wax or else it will only dry on the top of the slugs. Its a fun little project and could be quite useful if the need for slugs arrived without time to melt lead.

[Superhawk138 202]

Heh! I like this guy! Wonder if they are in NC?

 

Nope Barry is down here in GA. He owns the place where I bought my first S-12 from.

[Cobra 76 two 2,677]

Could this be done effectively by making a vibrating box with a bunch of shells and pouring the wax in without removing the lead?

 

It seems to me that this could be way more time efficient and consistent in weight that way. Just get a 3" thick block of wood and bore a bunch of holes in it that are a snug fit with 12 ga. put a board under it and set it on a massage pad or something to vibrate the wax down.

 

I would also want to make a jig for trimming the ends off more quickly and consistently.

 

I like the idea of cost, and wonder how the accuracy would do with my paradox choke.

 

I think it would actually work better to pour warmed shot into a vibrating shell with the wax already in it. The lead is going to do a lot better job of sinking to the bottom of a container of hot wax than the other way around... seems to me anyway.

[rs51085 136]

This seems like a neat idea but why not just melt the shot down and pour it in a lee 1 oz slug mold? Then you wouldn't have to worry about the shot getting lose and possibly jamming your gun. Not to mention that you can reload from scratch for a little cheaper and have a better load. Just my 2 cents

Edited September 10, 2011 by rogers

[Deadeye 325]

how would this efect presure

[Nailbomb 10,221]

how would this efect presure

Effectively the wax would increase pressure due to it creating a greater seal, and possibly increasing the weight. Overall it should be negligible and your S-12 shouldn't notice.

[CFOofEVIL 8]

I may give this a whirl this weekend. In the future I want to get a Lee slug mold and convert federal multipurpose loads to slugs for practice, but I don't have the cash for the tools right now. I do on the other hand have a box of birdshot and a few old candles laying around. Sounds like fun!

 

IMHO the "cut shells" are way scarier.

[Joesmoe 14]

I think that's the point of wax slugs is that anybody can make them real simple and cheap no special tools needed.

[CamelBlue 0]

The paraffin wax I imagine would hold together better than candles. Imagine every time you shot smelling cinnamon apples:)

[Battosaii 99]

This seems like a neat idea but why not just melt the shot down and pour it in a lee 1 oz slug mold? Then you wouldn't have to worry about the shot getting lose and possibly jamming your gun. Not to mention that you can reload from scratch for a little cheaper and have a better load. Just my 2 cents

 

because with melting the lead you cannot simply just pour it in because lead melts at a higher temperature then wax so if you did pour it in it would simply melt the plastic with it. doing it with wax is a simple cheap effective way you dont need molds or anything just a knife, some bird shot, wax and a hot pot

[gunfun 3,931]

I think that's the point of wax slugs is that anybody can make them real simple and cheap no special tools needed.

 

+1

 

I could enjoy blazing away with these (made a bit more quickly). I would feel guilty doing a mag dump with shells that I had several minutes of work per shot into.

 

Also short of having a slug mold, when I looked into it I had a hard time adding up a materials list for a slug that was enough cheaper than buying slugs in bulk to be worth the bother. I am sure that someone who is very dedicated and has a lot of time could do it. I don't have the time knowledge or cash to do the super volume reloading.

I have the basic lee loader, but it's made for bird shot, and the only thing worth the bother to me at the moment is odd size buck and slugs, and only if they can be done quickly and for less than a third of the cost of manufactured ammo.

 

I also like the idea of the 'glaser' like qualities, although I am sure there is ammo with better properties available.

 

I was wondering if anyone knew of a cheap substitute that would have comparable bond strength to the wax, but would mot melt in high temperatures.

[Deadeye 325]

I just made 20 on about 10 minutes. A sharp razor knife cut and dump the shot while warming up the wax. Then I bent the spoon on the edges so it was not time consuming to fill the hulls. It was realy easy. I will try them out tomorow. Mine smell like apple pie. One thing I am conserned about on a hot day they might deform in the mag or start to melt in the gun. Dont leave them in the sun or in a hot car.

[poolingmyignorance 2,191]

I just made 20 on about 10 minutes. A sharp razor knife cut and dump the shot while warming up the wax. Then I bent the spoon on the edges so it was not time consuming to fill the hulls. It was realy easy. I will try them out tomorow. Mine smell like apple pie. One thing I am conserned about on a hot day they might deform in the mag or start to melt in the gun. Dont leave them in the sun or in a hot car.

 

Or becoming too soft waiting to be fired from an already heated chamber.

[Deadeye 325]

I just made 20 on about 10 minutes. A sharp razor knife cut and dump the shot while warming up the wax. Then I bent the spoon on the edges so it was not time consuming to fill the hulls. It was realy easy. I will try them out tomorow. Mine smell like apple pie. One thing I am conserned about on a hot day they might deform in the mag or start to melt in the gun. Dont leave them in the sun or in a hot car.

 

 

I took the kids swiming today and did not have a chance to go shooting

[CFOofEVIL 8]

I just finished up at the range. Took the 13 wax slugs I made last week - pretty abysmal results.

 

Out of the 13 rounds MAYBE 3 managed to stay together until target impact, all others either somehow separated before they left the barrel or failed to feed properly. The majority of the rounds got caught on the barrel hood, and jammed up. I suspect the lack of a crimp, instead with a nice edge in its place was to blame for this. I picked up a hull that got caught on the hood and it was partially sheared where it caught (pictures inbound later). I also suspect the heat of the chamber from previously fired rounds contributed to the "slugs" breaking up in the barrel. I tried both feeding from a magazine and single shot - same results.

 

I made them out of Remington Sure Shot Heavy Dove loads (#8 shot), which have very rigid hulls compared to Federal game loads IMHO. Normally these shells cycle perfectly for me on setting two.

 

Oh well, it was definitely worth a try! I have to wonder if they fell apart due to the wax I used, which was old candle wax from a large well used candle. I'll break down my S12 later and check for wax build up, stray pellets or anything else out of the ordinary.

 

But hey, one up side was that the desert smelled like "Mountain Breeze" when I was done. That's definitely a trip! lol

[gunfun 3,931]

That's disappointing. Did anyone try it with better wax? I wonder if differences in shot cup were part of that?

 

I was thinking it could help to cap it off with a little glue or something if you were doing a large batch.

 

a couple things didn't make sense to me in the above posts was part of the explanation of why there could be higher pressures...

 

1. I get that the more solid projectile, would seal to the barrel more, increasing pressures, but wouldn't the lack of crimp tend to reduce pressures significantly?

 

2. If the wax is displacing lead pellets, the total mass of the ejecta should be somewhat lower, so that I would expect the pressures to be possibly lower than the standard bird shot load. (don't get me wrong, I know I am ignorant about reloading, but this just seems counter-intuitive.)

 

3. even if it increased pressures a lot, I would still expect it to be way lower than factory slugs or buck. I understand the shell could be over pressured and tear or something, but we already cut the shell, it's trash. Is this a real worry?

[patriot 7,197]

Hot glue works pretty good. Let it cool before crimping.

[ewoketeer 35]

Just out of curiosity, what would happen if you were to take the heated birdshot/wax mixture and pour it in the 1 oz. slug mold?...

[patriot 7,197]

You would get an underweight single projectile that, if it held together, would act like a mini-grenade upon impact.

[Deadeye 325]

I just returned from shooting. The wax slugs that I made worked great. I had one falure to feed beacause of a sharp edge on the cut at the top. I shot a 5 shot groupe into a paper plate size at 55 yds off hand. The apple pie smelled good. I ran all 20 through the factory 5 rd mag. I wll definately make more.

 

I also cleand up a whole truck load of crap left at the shooting area. I wish people would respect our areas to shoot and not leave all the shit behind when they leave.

 

 

Should this thred be moved to the ammo/reloading section

[CamelBlue 0]

It is very important for you to use proper safety when trying this. Dont let someone on the internet get you killed:)

Having said that, paraffin wax seems to be better when making these "slugs". The paraffin will hold together more at higher temperatures and not shatter on impact. I believe it also has a bit higher temperature when melting and rather than splinter, it seems to be more pliable and mold-able. When use it at work to heat our hands and you can make any shape fat or skinny etc... Although you will not get the fresh scents, you would get a better projectile and I would assume less build up of wax in the barrel. Okay okay, we usually make dicks out of the used portions of paraffin.... Good luck guys!

[tokinshitload 12]

I just returned from shooting. The wax slugs that I made worked great. I had one falure to feed beacause of a sharp edge on the cut at the top. I shot a 5 shot groupe into a paper plate size at 55 yds off hand. The apple pie smelled good. I ran all 20 through the factory 5 rd mag. I wll definately make more.

 

I also cleand up a whole truck load of crap left at the shooting area. I wish people would respect our areas to shoot and not leave all the shit behind when they leave.

 

 

Should this thred be moved to the ammo/reloading section

 

Thank for the clean up! I get tired of all the crap left behind by target shooters up here. Once I just piled it all up and torched it! This was in spring when the brush was still green. I would not recommend a burn right now, and burning tv's and refrigerators can present environmental hazards worse than the piles of lead we leave behind.

xacex

[gunfun 3,931]

I just returned from shooting. The wax slugs that I made worked great. I had one falure to feed beacause of a sharp edge on the cut at the top. I shot a 5 shot groupe into a paper plate size at 55 yds off hand. The apple pie smelled good. I ran all 20 through the factory 5 rd mag. I wll definately make more.

 

I also cleand up a whole truck load of crap left at the shooting area. I wish people would respect our areas to shoot and not leave all the shit behind when they leave.

 

 

Should this thred be moved to the ammo/reloading section

 

Thank for the clean up! I get tired of all the crap left behind by target shooters up here. Once I just piled it all up and torched it! This was in spring when the brush was still green. I would not recommend a burn right now, and burning tv's and refrigerators can present environmental hazards worse than the piles of lead we leave behind.

xacex

+1 Most of the private areas that had been open to the public around my hometown have been closed down because the generous landowners got tired of the mess and hazards of irresponsible shooters. I always try to take a few more bags of trash home than I bring out. I might leave up a target for others, but I will take home trash. I wouldn't say that it is necessarily every shell I brought, but for sure more than I brought.

 

Thanks for the reports of successes, and failures. That beats theory talk every time.

[AJ Dual 43]

This seems like a neat idea but why not just melt the shot down and pour it in a lee 1 oz slug mold? Then you wouldn't have to worry about the shot getting lose and possibly jamming your gun. Not to mention that you can reload from scratch for a little cheaper and have a better load. Just my 2 cents

 

This is precisely what I do.

 

Federal 100 round bulk pack 1 1/2oz #8 from Wallyworld $22.

 

Pick the crimp open with a pointy awl, dump the shot into my Lee 10lb production pot that cost about $60.

 

Pour it into the Lee 1 oz Foster style slug mold. $18.

 

Push the slug back into the cup/wad and crimp it shut with my Lee Load All II. $42.

 

I now have $.22 low-recoil range slugs. (my club's range requires slugs, shot tears up the target hangers too quickly) And I have roughly an extra doxen slugs left over for every 100 shells I reload because of the extra 1/8oz of lead per shell too. I re-use the hulls once or twice with bulk powder, wads, primers and scrap lead, my cost is down to about $.16 a shell. (using Fed bulk hulls more than 2x is pushing it IMO..)

 

The best price online I can find for bulk slugs or even just .65cal solid balls is the Nobel Sport 100 pack for $35, not even counting shipping... Which probably makes it at least $45 per 100, or $.40 per shell.

 

At that rate of savings, just making "Moscow/Mexican Match" slugs out of Fed bulk pack, I recouped the cost of the Lee equipment in roughly 6 1/2 Fed bulk packs.

 

 

[gunfun 3,931]

That's pretty cool, and it looks like you have a simple setup and recoup your time investment. I am impressed. If only I had time/ money and my own garage to keep all the stuff in.

 

How long does it take you to cast a batch of slugs? or more meaningfull, how much time does it take per shell?

 

I have a Load All II, but I don't have the molding equipment. Plus I live in an apartment, and that kind of thing would be awkward. I don't need lead fumes inside.

 

I was thinking of splitting the difference between these methods: pick apart the shell as you describe, mix the shot with paraffin, pour in, let it cool, and then crimp. I can use an agricultural syringe to suck out any extra wax if I overfill.

 

I figure it would take building more than 23 an hour to make up the $.42 difference between either type and and $.60 sluggers, assuming a base rate of $10/hr. I tried un-crimping a shell, and I don't think I am fast enough to make it worthwhile yet.

Edited September 21, 2011 by GunFun