Odd Man Out 1,283 Posted February 2, 2012 Report Share Posted February 2, 2012 (edited) - Odd Man Out, Losing vision is a bad thing as I want to confirm a hit. -BobAsh, I agree, a proper flash suppressor will be effective during the night, but my priority is follow up shots by reducing muzzle climb and secondary is flash suppression. Two things; 1. In a home defense sit, usually one can confirm a hit with a Saiga shotgun by either a scream of pain or the sound of a body hitting the floor... 2. In a home defense sit, executing follow up shots ( unless you at first miss and the threat is still present -- highly unlikely) is a sure way to inhabit a place where you would never want to drop your soap....... If I may suggest an excellent book to all: "FACING VIOLENCE" by Rory Miller Preparing for the Unexpected *Ethically *Emotionally *Physically *Without Going to Prison Contains no BS good info we all need. Edited February 2, 2012 by Odd Man Out 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
King Cash 104 Posted February 3, 2012 Author Report Share Posted February 3, 2012 I've used my 8" SBS quite a bit at night; out on the ranch shooting varmints. I use our flash hider of course and I can tell you it's quite effective. Nice! Do you have any pictures of your "Comp" model on a Saiga 12? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
BobAsh 582 Posted February 3, 2012 Report Share Posted February 3, 2012 This is all I could find...it's the gun Tony made for Taran Butler. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
rs51085 136 Posted February 3, 2012 Report Share Posted February 3, 2012 Hey bob, are those holes in the top of the barrel? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
BobAsh 582 Posted February 4, 2012 Report Share Posted February 4, 2012 Yep. (null) Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Ronin38 2,117 Posted February 4, 2012 Report Share Posted February 4, 2012 Nice! Ported and braked! Serious competition gun, maybe? How do you think that would compare to just having the Monster brake on it? Or is that too muzzle-heavy? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
King Cash 104 Posted February 5, 2012 Author Report Share Posted February 5, 2012 This is all I could find...it's the gun Tony made for Taran Butler. Thanks! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
BobAsh 582 Posted February 6, 2012 Report Share Posted February 6, 2012 Serious competition gun, maybe? Google "Taran Butler" Even though it was a full-length gun, Tony did the 8" gas system on it so he could use the lightest possible ammo. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Ronin38 2,117 Posted February 6, 2012 Report Share Posted February 6, 2012 Thanks. I guess Mr. Butler used the Saiga a couple years ago? All I could find of him were videos with Benelli's. Still, I learned more about 3-gun! I am not very familiar with that sport. (Obviously.) Quote Link to post Share on other sites
BobAsh 582 Posted February 6, 2012 Report Share Posted February 6, 2012 Thanks. I guess Mr. Butler used the Saiga a couple years ago? All I could find of him were videos with Benelli's. Still, I learned more about 3-gun! I am not very familiar with that sport. (Obviously.) Yeah, that was a few years ago. Taran eventually decided against the Saiga platform for "political" reasons...that is, he has to travel and compete in places like California, New York and other places where the gun just isn't legal. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Ronin38 2,117 Posted February 6, 2012 Report Share Posted February 6, 2012 It would be very hard to remain competitive if you can't bring your gun with you! Thanks! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Shiner5455 9 Posted February 25, 2012 Report Share Posted February 25, 2012 I just recently bought the Mini-monster brake for my S-12 and I love it. Before I put it on I could put 100 rounds of #2 steel shot through my gun and my shoulder would feel it. With the brake on I have no problems shooting the gun with the same ammo from the hip with one hand. The is very little recoil, I then put on an ATI 6 point butt stock with a Scorpion grip and the recoil almost disappeared. I was impressed with the mini monster. This is my first S-12 so I have to say I have not tried any other brakes or muzzle devices. Saying that, this brake would be hard to give up on my next build. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Lord Ak-47 49 Posted March 10, 2012 Report Share Posted March 10, 2012 Anyone have any clue when this are going to be available again? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
preparehandbook 326 Posted March 10, 2012 Report Share Posted March 10, 2012 "I's not a question of "confidence"; we don't make promises or claims about the brakes because there is no real way to quantify their performance. And trust me, many have tried." Is this a typo? Back in the late 80's I did a little consulting work for a now well known company doing LTL weapons. They first calculated recoil based on projectile weight and a chrono reading. Then they got a rough real world test on a recoil sled (pretty accurate actually) Before stuff went to bid for DOC etc. they ran it on the recoil sled with it fixed and a load cell. They were able to determine differences in recoil down to the level of foot grams and more imprtantly able to determine changes in duration of recoil and peak recoil spikes. They tested a couple of muzzle break/flash hiders I had on an HK 91 (they all sucked it turned out, they reccomended a softer butt pad) I cannot understand why any of these or the other recoil testing systems in use wouldn't work for muzzle break testing. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
gpqueen 545 Posted March 10, 2012 Report Share Posted March 10, 2012 Anyone have any clue when this are going to be available again? We should have them back in stock in 3-4 weeks. If you email sales@carolinashooterssupply.com I will notify you as soon as they come in. 2 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Lord Ak-47 49 Posted March 10, 2012 Report Share Posted March 10, 2012 Thanks Greg, appreciate the response. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
BobAsh 582 Posted March 12, 2012 Report Share Posted March 12, 2012 Is this a typo? Yeah, I suppose if you have a "recoil sled" and dynamic load cells and the software to capture and relate the the data, then you could record some significant info. Personally, I've never seen a manufacturer with a setup even close to that. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
romad7 75 Posted March 17, 2012 Report Share Posted March 17, 2012 I have the Monster Brake and love the look but there are a couple of issues that are keeping me from loving it and everyone seems to like it. I just want to make sure it is/isn't me before giving up. I was planning on having It permanantly attached with an OA 18" barrel. There is a lot of back blast in my face when firing and that is an annoying distraction when shooting. Is this normal and something that people just deal with? This is my first muzzle brake on any gun and I know that back blast is what reduces recoil through redirection but I always figured that it was back and out away from the shooter (towards bystanders;). Also, when tightening the brake it doesn't line up properly, I have to back it out a lttle to get it lined up righ. Do I just need to apply lots of red thread lock and line it up a little backed out and let it set? I searched and couldn't find these answers so maybe my ignorance can help others. Thanks! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
todmich 16 Posted March 17, 2012 Report Share Posted March 17, 2012 As for the back blast I am not sure but as for you issue with having to back the muzzle break out to get it to align I would suggest butting a barell nut on it which will help you keep it where you want. here is the link to the one on the CSS site http://store.carolinashooterssupply.com/servlet/-strse-495/CHAOS-SAIGA-12-BARREL/Detail Quote Link to post Share on other sites
romad7 75 Posted March 17, 2012 Report Share Posted March 17, 2012 As for the back blast I am not sure but as for you issue with having to back the muzzle break out to get it to align I would suggest butting a barell nut on it which will help you keep it where you want. here is the link to the one on the CSS site http://store.carolinashooterssupply.com/servlet/-strse-495/CHAOS-SAIGA-12-BARREL/Detail I'll get that for sure, thanks! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
preparehandbook 326 Posted March 18, 2012 Report Share Posted March 18, 2012 Is this a typo? Yeah, I suppose if you have a "recoil sled" and dynamic load cells and the software to capture and relate the the data, then you could record some significant info. Personally, I've never seen a manufacturer with a setup even close to that. It's pricey gear that usually won't earn you money. You could cobble the stuff together if you really wanted to, but why? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
The_Caged_Bird 474 Posted March 18, 2012 Report Share Posted March 18, 2012 Maybe we could get the guys from "Deadliest Warrior" involved... Quote Link to post Share on other sites
BOB A. BOOEY 45 Posted April 20, 2012 Report Share Posted April 20, 2012 If you aren't still confident to put numbers how about filling in an arrangement like this: More reduction: Competition>Monster>Shark> MInnster :Less reduction. It's not a question of "confidence"; we don't make promises or claims about the brakes because there is no real way to quantify their performance. And trust me, many have tried. But based on my experience and the feedback we've had from thousands of customers I would say "Monster>Competition>Shark". This also bears out in engineering terms of weight and vent surface. The "Comp" model is the mini-version of the Monster. In fact, after the Comp model was designed and tested, Tony just made a monster just for fun out of the remaining steel stock. He posted pics of it and there was a ton of interest, so it became a product. Im confused isnt that what the guy from CSS just did in stating that this brake reduces recoil up to 40%? Ive held an S12 with a full monster brake on it and although it looks good it weighs a ton. I think I'll live with the recoil and reduce the weight. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Lord Ak-47 49 Posted April 20, 2012 Report Share Posted April 20, 2012 The Mini Monster ran well on my first outing with it. I couldnt really notice any difference in terms of weight and it stil feels balanced. I will do more tests in the near future but I can say I am satisfied with it at this point. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
BpS12 512 Posted April 21, 2012 Report Share Posted April 21, 2012 FWIW, I've got the Chaos Wave break. The only things I can say about it is that without it, my shoulder is bruised significantly deeper and longer. It's hard to say if it reduces muzzle climb as I've got it on a Bullpupped S12 and both my hands are at or forward of center of ballance. It does blow exhaust back on my light, but the ligh is mounted fairly far forward. So I would be interested in how this does in deflecting gases almost imediately behind the break. Haveing to stop to clean off my light lens kinda sucks. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
shades_of_grey 1,092 Posted April 21, 2012 Report Share Posted April 21, 2012 (edited) I have the Monster Brake and love the look but there are a couple of issues that are keeping me from loving it and everyone seems to like it. I just want to make sure it is/isn't me before giving up. I was planning on having It permanantly attached with an OA 18" barrel... I had that done by Mike at Lone Star Arms, and it turned out beautifully. Buckshot/slugs feel like birdshot, (in terms of recoil). Here's a pic: The barrel was cut, rethreaded, the Monster Brake was installed, then silver soldered in place for an OAL of 18.2" ...There is a lot of back blast in my face when firing and that is an annoying distraction when shooting. Is this normal and something that people just deal with?... Yep. I'll refrain from further comment. Edited April 21, 2012 by post-apocalyptic Quote Link to post Share on other sites
romad7 75 Posted April 21, 2012 Report Share Posted April 21, 2012 (edited) The barrel was cut, rethreaded, the Monster Brake was installed, then silver soldered in place for an OAL of 18.2" ...There is a lot of back blast in my face when firing and that is an annoying distraction when shooting. Is this normal and something that people just deal with?... Yep. I'll refrain from further comment. Those Lone Star guns are nice looking, even with the huge brake it looks good. The Monster Brake is definitely growing on me. I was actually interested in your further comments, from your experience, since you have the exact setup that I was talking about. If you just want to tell me to suck it up and deal with it, I can handle that. I am actually in the process of bringing the brake much closer to me. The end of the brake will be at just under 11" with the gas system shorted by 3.75". All I have left is to attach the brake and see how much hair I will lose from my hands:-). Edited April 21, 2012 by romad7 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
gunfun 3,931 Posted April 22, 2012 Report Share Posted April 22, 2012 why not affix a wing behind it to deflect the powder, like you see on some of the midbarrel compensators? Also those guns look awesome because of the massive comp, not in spite of it. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
shades_of_grey 1,092 Posted April 22, 2012 Report Share Posted April 22, 2012 The barrel was cut, rethreaded, the Monster Brake was installed, then silver soldered in place for an OAL of 18.2" ...There is a lot of back blast in my face when firing and that is an annoying distraction when shooting. Is this normal and something that people just deal with?... Yep. I'll refrain from further comment. Those Lone Star guns are nice looking, even with the huge brake it looks good. The Monster Brake is definitely growing on me. I was actually interested in your further comments, from your experience, since you have the exact setup that I was talking about. If you just want to tell me to suck it up and deal with it, I can handle that. I am actually in the process of bringing the brake much closer to me. The end of the brake will be at just under 11" with the gas system shorted by 3.75". All I have left is to attach the brake and see how much hair I will lose from my hands:-). Sounds cool. I doubt you'll lose too much hand hair. The "backblast" really isn't a big deal at all, especially if you wear some kind of glasses/goggles when you shoot, which you should. The reduction in recoil makes it more than worth tolerating, and it's really just hot air, not a lot of carbon or other particles. Don't worry about it. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
shades_of_grey 1,092 Posted April 22, 2012 Report Share Posted April 22, 2012 why not affix a wing behind it to deflect the powder, like you see on some of the midbarrel compensators?... Because it's not necessary. ...Also those guns look awesome because of the massive comp, not in spite of it. Exactly what criticisms would you level at the rest of my build, (considering your undoubtedly vast knowledge on the subject)? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
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