Spindrift 6 Posted December 13, 2010 Report Share Posted December 13, 2010 I have a 300 Mag. bolt action. I have a 870 pump heavily modified. I can only afford ONE Saiga this year. Which would YOU buy? I target shoot and hunt with both. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
volkov 318 Posted December 13, 2010 Report Share Posted December 13, 2010 (edited) S-12.. Argueably the most powerful shotgun available and the only gun in it's class that hasn't been banned or DD'd- YET Edited December 13, 2010 by volkov Quote Link to post Share on other sites
danklab 57 Posted December 13, 2010 Report Share Posted December 13, 2010 S-12 Definitely. If you're going to do the conversion.. it's a little bit easier than the rifles. It's a great starting point... plus the most bad ass shotgun you can get your hands on in America. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Salmonking 149 Posted December 13, 2010 Report Share Posted December 13, 2010 I have a 300 Mag. bolt action. I have a 870 pump heavily modified. I can only afford ONE Saiga this year. Which would YOU buy? I target shoot and hunt with both. I asked this question when I first signed up. Go saiga 12 and don't look back. Shoot federal low base rounds, they work the best with it. All in all, it's cheaper (ammo wise), and more satisfying to shoot. Just make sure you've got money to convert it with later. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
getitat 609 Posted December 13, 2010 Report Share Posted December 13, 2010 Hello If it is for a defensive application in an urban or semi-urban environment, then S12 definately. .308 is not a prudent choice (in my humble opinion) for an urban defense platform. S12 rules in that environment. -guido Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Stansplace 414 Posted December 14, 2010 Report Share Posted December 14, 2010 I disagree, I did the .308 first and it was easier than the S-12 to me. I always ask people what they are using it for. If it's for shits and giggles or home defense, go with the shotty. If you don't have a MBR, then .308 all the way. The .308 is a big boy toy though, ammo is more expensive and it's way more dangerous downrange. Look at it like a tool and make your own decision. I will say that the .308 doesn't get as much range time as my S-12. And it certainly doesn't turn as many heads. But if some serious shit went down, I would be real glad the .308 was in my corner. 3 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
bohound 281 Posted December 14, 2010 Report Share Posted December 14, 2010 I'm with Stansplace. You've got a bolt action rifle, capable of mid to long-ish ranges already. You've got an 870, covering the up close and personal ranges. To fill the gap, I'd go the .308. The S-12 is an awesome weapon for sure, and I believe it should be a second Saiga for sure... But if you went with that first, you've got a redundancy in the close range department, completely neglecting the critical 1-800 meter range. A lot can happen at that range, and I don't think I'd want to rely solely on a bolt action. In an urban/cqb setting, the S-12 reigns supreme. I suppose it depends on your intended application, but you're outta luck in the autoloading rifle department. How fast can you work that bolt? Lee Harvey Oswald fast? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Spindrift 6 Posted December 14, 2010 Author Report Share Posted December 14, 2010 (edited) Well, my last name IS "Harvey." So, everything I've read is exactly what I go to sleep and wake up thinking. With a little help from my friends here, I've concluded that as long as the natives aren't restless, the 12 is going to be a big party toy to have a blast with (no pun) and double down on close up security. My daughter just turned 18 and is getting her FID card so two shotguns is good. On the other hand, if the SHTF before next year when I can get the 308 too, I'm leaving an undefended gap of major proportions. But that's why we have a neighborhood contingency plan. So, I'm thinking right now. hedge my bets that peace will prevail one more year and wait for the .308. Maybe I'll have a windfall and get both this year. I just dumped a bundle on the Weatherby so... The last time I felt this way was when my FIRST wife said "Either that dog goes or I go." I'm not good with decisions. That's why she was my FIRST wife. AAllrighty then. Thanks guys! Guido... love your quotes! Edited December 14, 2010 by Spindrift Quote Link to post Share on other sites
redfish28 50 Posted December 14, 2010 Report Share Posted December 14, 2010 S-12 all the way. I was struggling with a similar decision this year and asked the good folks on this forum what they thought. I received good arguments on both sides but fact is the saiga 12 is a force multiplier like Lone Star Customs told me. With dealing with multiple threats the S-12 evens the score with the amount of lead it can lay down. Unless you are looking to pick a fight at distances over 100 yrds, I think the S-12 is the right choice. Take it for what its worth. It's just my opinion. I live on the Texas border, and if I hear bump in the night, the S-12 is coming out. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Dudethebagman 222 Posted December 14, 2010 Report Share Posted December 14, 2010 (edited) I vote other. I know you didn't ask, but you already have a hunting/long distance rifle and a hunting/short distance/home defense shotgun. If you want a semi, I'm assuming you might have a zombie apocalypse in mind and don't need 1/2 moa accuracy. There are reasons the military has moved to intermediate calibers. Less recoil = faster shots and potentially better real world accuracy. Lighter ammo = more ammo carried. Cheaper ammo = more ammo in your stash, and more frequent trips to the range. I have an x39 and a 308. If I was forced to choose, I'd take the x39. Cheap ammo is cheap, and better quality hunting ammo is available. Covers up close to 300 yards pretty well. Realistically, anything past 300 yards is pretty far away and actually requires aiming pretty carefully. If you can't hit something with the first shot, what are the odds that a semi is going to help once your target hears the bullets fly? Just my opinion. Short of that, I'd go with the 12 gauge and sell the other shotgun, because it's a semi and you're less likely to miss up close than with the 308. 2 shotguns seems redundant. Edited December 14, 2010 by Dudethebagman 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
DrGonZo 157 Posted December 14, 2010 Report Share Posted December 14, 2010 I'd say the .308. Its very easy to convert and you can get boxes of Brown Bear ammo for range days for around $6.50 a box of 20. I started with the .308, then the S12, and I just recently purchased a x39 I LOVE my Saigas. Some may be a little rough around the edges from the factory, but once they are dialed in and converted, they're the best quality for the price and they're fucking TANKS! You can beat the shit out of em and they keep going. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
jdmakersmark 15 Posted December 15, 2010 Report Share Posted December 15, 2010 My vote would go to the S-12, no other shotgun can do what it can do. 20 round drums can't be beat. That being said the .308 is awesome! Very easy to convert and one great handling, potent and reliable beast! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Rhodes1968 1,638 Posted December 15, 2010 Report Share Posted December 15, 2010 The military went to smaller rounds to accommodate full auto operation which isn't the 308s strong suit as seen with the M14. Take the 308 you already have a shotty and firepower is what your are lacking. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
1liter 20 Posted December 15, 2010 Report Share Posted December 15, 2010 BOTH! 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
butch1911 12 Posted December 15, 2010 Report Share Posted December 15, 2010 I agree with Bohound. If you already have a 12 gauge then get the .308. An 870 is a fine weapon and will work for what you need it to. Is it a Saiga 12, no but it will do the job more than adequately. In my opinion you need an semi-auto center fire rifle to fill the gap in your arsenal. The 308 would be a great choice. If price of ammunition is a concern you can get a 7.62 or .223 Saiga. They would also work well for the intermediate shots. Just my $.02. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
HBTANK 0 Posted December 15, 2010 Report Share Posted December 15, 2010 I disagree, I did the .308 first and it was easier than the S-12 to me. I always ask people what they are using it for. If it's for shits and giggles or home defense, go with the shotty. If you don't have a MBR, then .308 all the way. The .308 is a big boy toy though, ammo is more expensive and it's way more dangerous downrange. Look at it like a tool and make your own decision. I will say that the .308 doesn't get as much range time as my S-12. And it certainly doesn't turn as many heads. But if some serious shit went down, I would be real glad the .308 was in my corner. Agree Quote Link to post Share on other sites
wdfaulk 0 Posted December 26, 2010 Report Share Posted December 26, 2010 Heres the deal, with the S12 you give up some reliability (dont get into a snit yall know good and well what I mean)for a ton of firepower downrange over the 870. Now ask yourself this if the target wears a level 3(or even a good 2) vest the shotgun round will not penetrate dependably. The 308 will blaze right on though. Before anyone bitches about that bad guys are wearing them. Now personally I never give up reliability but rather prefer the good old double coach gun as its a last stand/broken arrow tool for me along with the 40cal pistol. Nothing is simple is it. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Spindrift 6 Posted December 28, 2010 Author Report Share Posted December 28, 2010 OK. Tired of losing sleep over this. I just bought the 12 Ga over the phone in NH and picking it up this Sunday.. Reasoning: 1. Can't hunt with the .308 in assachusetts 2. I only hunt a day or two in Maine and the 300 will work. 3. Last week I broke my muzzle loader hunting and was gunless for a week waiting for the part. I don't EVER want that to happen during shotgun season! 4. I already have 12 Ga reloading equipment and know how to use it (kind of). 5. 308 ammo won't fit the Weatherby or Remington. Saiga 12 will fit the Remington. Less ammo to stock. Thanks for all the input. I'm sure I'll be asking all kinds of stupid questions if I don't understand stuff when converting. assachusetts has some REAL dumb laws. Still could be a 308 next year. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Stansplace 414 Posted December 28, 2010 Report Share Posted December 28, 2010 OK. Tired of losing sleep over this. I just bought the 12 Ga over the phone in NH and picking it up this Sunday.. Reasoning: 1. Can't hunt with the .308 in assachusetts 2. I only hunt a day or two in Maine and the 300 will work. 3. Last week I broke my muzzle loader hunting and was gunless for a week waiting for the part. I don't EVER want that to happen during shotgun season! 4. I already have 12 Ga reloading equipment and know how to use it (kind of). 5. 308 ammo won't fit the Weatherby or Remington. Saiga 12 will fit the Remington. Less ammo to stock. Thanks for all the input. I'm sure I'll be asking all kinds of stupid questions if I don't understand stuff when converting. assachusetts has some REAL dumb laws. Still could be a 308 next year. +1 for reasoning and not jumping the gun for cool factor. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
SaigaKen 338 Posted January 4, 2011 Report Share Posted January 4, 2011 (edited) BOTH! +1 on that Just added a .308 to my collection tonight Edited January 4, 2011 by Saiga Power Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Zambidis 90 Posted January 12, 2011 Report Share Posted January 12, 2011 (edited) I shoot my shotguns much more than the rifles. Perhaps in part because of ammo cost. If I could only keep one saiga it would be an S12. It might also be that I have a S12 set up pretty close to just the way I want it (there are always things to tweek here or there it seems). My S308 is further from that point so it may not be a totally fair comparison. Trying to be mindful of that I'd still say the S12. For you it probably depends on how you see yourself using the each and a number of other personal factors. If you can only afford one this year that weighs towards the S12 because you'll likely be better able to afford to feed it. I think you made the right choice. 2 shotguns seems redundant. I don't think i could live with only two shotguns. It sounds like a slow start to me not anything even approaching redundancy. Edited January 12, 2011 by Zambidis Quote Link to post Share on other sites
x_man586 7 Posted February 27, 2011 Report Share Posted February 27, 2011 I bought my s-308 first. I saw a pretty dark wood ak in the pawn shop and I had to have it. I became a member here and then I learned about the s-12. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Deadeye 325 Posted March 1, 2011 Report Share Posted March 1, 2011 just start saving up and get the whole family. I have 308 12 7.62 want the 223 next maby some day the 30-06 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
pbwe 45 Posted April 5, 2011 Report Share Posted April 5, 2011 You have all you need right now. Any more is redundancy. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Mephis 82 Posted April 6, 2011 Report Share Posted April 6, 2011 (edited) 12 gauge is fun, but if you don't already have a good rifle around you'd be better served with the 308. I'd go for the 308 in your situation. Plus, with the cost and availability of the saiga 12 currently, I personally wouldn't be putting that much money and time into getting one. 308s seem to be about everywhere, and halfway affordable still. So I'd snatch one of them while they're still not attracting much attention. S-12 all the way. I was struggling with a similar decision this year and asked the good folks on this forum what they thought. I received good arguments on both sides but fact is the saiga 12 is a force multiplier like Lone Star Customs told me. With dealing with multiple threats the S-12 evens the score with the amount of lead it can lay down. Unless you are looking to pick a fight at distances over 100 yrds, I think the S-12 is the right choice. Take it for what its worth. It's just my opinion. I live on the Texas border, and if I hear bump in the night, the S-12 is coming out. If you can deal with multiple threats under 100 yards, I think you'd earn a hell of a name for yourself. You'd be a hell of a lot more skilled and famous than most of the old famous gun slingers. I'd rather not get myself into a situation like that in the first place and stay far the hell away from anything. And be able to keep enough distance so if things didn't turn out good I'd have the option of getting away or out-ranging them. If things ever get bad, beware the old-boys with their hunting rifles and a fair amount of experience. 100 yards at the range always seems like a lot until you get outside your house and start measuring real-world distances. About 400 yards is the closest you could be around here to anything without standing out in the middle of a field. Edited April 6, 2011 by Tombs Quote Link to post Share on other sites
ItsAllCreated 59 Posted April 6, 2011 Report Share Posted April 6, 2011 After years of passing up the S12 for 300, 400 ....I finally got one at $750!!! (OUCH!!) & thats because I thought I had to have once in case they were't going to be imported anymore. At the 800, 900, 1000+ prices that the S12's are going for now ...I wouldnt buy one even if it meant I was never going to get one. But since I had my S12 ....& 7.62x39's ....Adding a 308 to my AK Collection just felt like a natural progression lol Quote Link to post Share on other sites
lbsrdi 1,078 Posted April 7, 2011 Report Share Posted April 7, 2011 I chose the S-12, although I actually got my S-308 years before my 12. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
CJS3 3 Posted April 7, 2011 Report Share Posted April 7, 2011 I disagree, I did the .308 first and it was easier than the S-12 to me. I always ask people what they are using it for. If it's for shits and giggles or home defense, go with the shotty. If you don't have a MBR, then .308 all the way. The .308 is a big boy toy though, ammo is more expensive and it's way more dangerous downrange. Look at it like a tool and make your own decision. I will say that the .308 doesn't get as much range time as my S-12. And it certainly doesn't turn as many heads. But if some serious shit went down, I would be real glad the .308 was in my corner. MY main reason for the choice. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Cryogaijin 33 Posted April 7, 2011 Report Share Posted April 7, 2011 I got my .308 first, largely because I wanted something that'd go through a class II vest. The bug bit me hard, and I ended up putting about $600 into the gun that originally cost me $450. Last october I finally got the s12. . . and yesterday I bought 2 md-20 drums for it. (haven't gotten around to the conversion yet. Probably in a month.) I voted s12 due to the prices raising faster on those than the .308. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
ItsAllCreated 59 Posted April 7, 2011 Report Share Posted April 7, 2011 (edited) 3 major Factors why I'd want a S12 over a 308. 1. The S12 can lob slugs accurately a 100yrds with no problem. 2. The way I think about it... I'm not entering a fight unless I absolutely have too do it for my own protection (defense only). 3. Defensively I don't need to reach out to 200+ yards, cause if a threat is that far away im still planning to avoid it (not get its attention). Thats why the S12 was my 1st Saiga (and why for years I had my eye on one) ...just wish I woulda bought it years ago (at less than half the price) lol Edited April 11, 2011 by ItsAllCreated Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.